Rack and Pinion Opinon

[rob69]

folks,
Im considering a Unisteer rack and pinion for my 69, stock 383, no headers.
I read the negative posts about Unisteer, curious if there is a silent majority of other experiences.
Is there anyone who is satisfied with the unisteer setup.
Appreciate any feedback
thanks
R

[Rolling_Thunder]

The major complaint about the Unisteer is an extremely limited turning Radius...     

[Mike DC]

 
I don't see a good reason to retrofit a rack & pinion.  Not into a front end that still uses the stock K-frame, arms, and other hard parts.  These days you can make the factory steering feel as tight a rack with the right mods. 

[tan top]

The major complaint about the Unisteer is an extremely limited turning Radius...     

true , never heard anything good about the Unisteer set up , was/is a big thread on moparts about them !! & it did not make for good reading 

[cdr]

i have one on my car,i fixed the issues that it has. would i do it again???

[Cooter]

Bout the ONLY reason I'd swap out my old Gear box would be for the weight savings. A Manual rack and pinion set up would go in after the Must II front clip under my junk. That way, you can run ANY engine/header combo you want and not have to dissasemble the entire car to get the starter off.

[Budnicks]

i have one on my car,i fixed the issues that it has. would i do it again???

x2 

[Mike DC]

  
That new setup that retrofits a Saginaw PS gearbox onto the Mopar K-frame looks interesting.   It saves something like 15 pounds too, because the Sag gearbox is made of aluminum and smaller than the Mopar one.  And it would open up a bunch of tuning options for power assist feel, steering gear ratios, etc.


Anybody know how much it costs?  

[HPP]

Box itself is $600+, I've seen some as high as $800, plus you need the adapters to get it to match up to the column, $150-200. But, it is lighter, smaller and is as precise as a R&P.

http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=Corners&Number=7516054&page=0&fpart=1

[Mike DC]

   
This thing came just in time for me.  In the last couple of years I've been thinking hard about cutting/welding the car so I could mount a regular Saginaw PS box in place of the Mopar one.  Now I don't have to.

The Mopar one isn't bad, but you just can't argue with all the OEM & aftermarket stuff available for the Saginaw.

[rob69]

My only interest in R&P is greater control of the vehicle, not other reasons I see discussed. Area where I live has lots of narrow hilly roads with jagged rocks instead of curbs, all I see is that big front hood when I go over the top of some hills. Always seems to be a deer or an oncoming Pruis on the down side of the hill. anyway..
My conclusion is that the Unisteer is not "Bolt On" as advertised since all complants seem related to installation rather then performance.
Since I dont like a lot of unexpected "Tweeking" I decided I'm going to have an experienced shop install it for me, and see how it goes from there.
Thanks for the posts
R

[HPP]

Performance wise it reduces your turing radius and increases your car's bumpsteer tendancies. Mopars already have excessive bump steer because of the t-bar's location conflict with the tie rod. By installing an R&P, the larger body diameter of the rack compared to a rod effectively lowers the inside rod/rack end location which increases bump steer.

So when you come over that hill, crank the wheel to avoid that deer, and reload the suspension as the car comes down on it, your tires are not going to be pointing in the same directions as you compress the suspension. Granted, we are talking fractions of an inch, but that deviation in precision may have an impact.

[cdr]

Performance wise it reduces your turing radius and increases your car's bumpsteer tendancies. Mopars already have excessive bump steer because of the t-bar's location conflict with the tie rod. By installing an R&P, the larger body diameter of the rack compared to a rod effectively lowers the inside rod/rack end location which increases bump steer.

So when you come over that hill, crank the wheel to avoid that deer, and reload the suspension as the car comes down on it, your tires are not going to be pointing in the same directions as you compress the suspension. Granted, we are talking fractions of an inch, but that deviation in precision may have an impact.

that is fixable !!!   by raising or lowering the outer tie rod connection point.

[HPP]

Lowering the outerlink tends to help with that. In a track car that receives regular inspection that is a-okay. In a street car that may possibly be driven without regular inspections, you now have a cantilevered joint that is spaced 1 to 1.5"  away from its mounting point. That can generate a fair amount of leverage on the mount. It isn't an absolute failure, but it does increase its potential. Just my opinion.

For the bucks and hassle, I'd change to the GM box.

[BrianShaughnessy]

The borgeson box setup works nice.    Peter Bergman (formerly of XV) has set up some machined conversion couplers based on what E-booger did (and I helped install).

I wouldn't mess with that unisteer deal.   

[Mike DC]

My only interest in R&P is greater control of the vehicle, not other reasons I see discussed. Area where I live has lots of narrow hilly roads with jagged rocks instead of curbs, all I see is that big front hood when I go over the top of some hills. Always seems to be a deer or an oncoming Pruis on the down side of the hill. anyway..

My conclusion is that the Unisteer is not "Bolt On" as advertised since all complants seem related to installation rather then performance.
Since I dont like a lot of unexpected "Tweeking" I decided I'm going to have an experienced shop install it for me, and see how it goes from there.
Thanks for the posts

Let me try to say things another way. 

I don't mean to be pushy but I really think you would be happier with a different choice.


Three options have been brought up: a stock (but improved) Mopar setup, the Unisteer R/P, or the Saginaw box retrofit.  What I'm trying to say is that the Unisteer is the worst of all three IMHO.  Modding the stock setup would be better.  Not just for competition and all that, but also for the usage you are talking about. 

No matter which of the 3 setups you do, IMHO you will probably still want some increased caster angle from the UCAs before the car will feel how you really want it to.  The caster angle change is what gives modern cars the natural tendency to straighten themselves out when you aren't pulling the steering wheel in either direction.  None of the 3 steering gearbox/rack options can make the car naturally want to roll straight if the car still has the stock zero-degree caster.  The best the PS boxes/rack can do is give you reduced power assist and tighter "feel" & tolerances.  The car is still going to "wander" whenever you aren't holding the steering wheel if you only change the PS box or install a R/P. 

And once you have the front suspension's caster increased, you can get the reduced power assist & tighter feel from the stock Mopar box if the right people rebuild it for you.  Firm Feel and Steer & Gear do this kind of work. 

If you keep the stock PS box then you get no turning circle losses, no potential for increased bumpsteer, no clearance changes anywhere, etc.  Can't say the same for a retrofitted R/P. 

[Budnicks]

Performance wise it reduces your turing radius and increases your car's bumpsteer tendancies. Mopars already have excessive bump steer because of the t-bar's location conflict with the tie rod. By installing an R&P, the larger body diameter of the rack compared to a rod effectively lowers the inside rod/rack end location which increases bump steer.

So when you come over that hill, crank the wheel to avoid that deer, and reload the suspension as the car comes down on it, your tires are not going to be pointing in the same directions as you compress the suspension. Granted, we are talking fractions of an inch, but that deviation in precision may have an impact.

that is fixable !!!   by raising or lowering the outer tie rod connection point.

IMHFO the biggest issue is the turning raidious, having to cut a steering column, everthing else is workable, but a front steer style rack & pinion with better geometry would be better thou, but then it's not a bolt in anymore either....