Who here hates the charger prices?

[Johnny SixPack]

Yep, the prices are insane, but seeing how they are now, I thank my lucky stars I got my "70 and "69  when I did (even though I still think I got snookered on the "69 deal, but that's water under the bridge with the way prices are now).

There is no way in hell I could replace either of them for what I paid just 14 months ago.

Still have three years to pay off the "70, but knowing what I know about it now, man... I friggin' lucked out.

I'd have to sell a kidney if I was buying it today (EV2 "70 R/T SE 6-pack sunroof car), and I'd still probably need the loan.

I just feel bad for the next crop of MoPar fans, as not only are the cars themselves priced past the means of most, but the prices of the parts to restore even the insanely priced "project" cars is enough to make you choke on your Wheaties.

[twilt]

Why not look at a 3rd gen Charger. 73/74, plenty left at reasonable prices(kind of) and parts aren't to hard to find.

Parts aren't cheap for these either.

I`d have to agree with NHCharger on this one. 3rd gens are still reasonably priced. only a FEW select parts for them are expensive.  If they really  were expensive i wouldnt have been able to buy 10 parts cars and 2 keepers (to include a 72 Rallye N96 car) over the last 3 years, with a total investment of $9300

[terrible one]

I just feel bad for the next crop of MoPar fans, as not only are the cars themselves priced past the means of most, but the prices of the parts to restore even the insanely priced "project" cars is enough to make you choke on your Wheaties.

Exactly! Don't even remind me! It's hard for a young lad of 16 

[Troy]

I remember a few years ago you could get a clean '69 charger for $5,000 now a non running project can get $10,000. Some prices are coming down but most are still up there.

So, you're like 16(?) now and you don't have a job. Could you buy a $5,000 car right now if it dropped into your lap? Be honest. How many years ago was it that you could get a "clean" 69 Charger for $5k???

I've been looking for a week for a car to work on for Auto body next year, a '68 or '70, but now I've decided to buy something else.

You spent an entire week looking for a car and couldn't find a great deal? That must really be a bummer. I looked for 12 years and finally figured I better actually step up and get one before they were all gone. Well, I've bought three more since then and passed on probably 15 more that were very restorable because I don't have any room nor do I have enough money to fix them all if I had the room. They do exist - especially if you aren't afraid to put in some sweat equity to offset the cost.

No, I'm not being mean - I'm being realistic so don't everyone send me hate mail. In 1987 I was in high school with a part-time job and I got a 68 Charger for $1,300. I had to borrow some of the money to get it and I spent every one of my paychecks (and weekends) working on it to keep it roadworthy. It wasn't pretty, it handled bad, it ate a lot of gas, and it was uncomfortable to drive (all black with headers and no A/C or insulation in the floor). It was a very cool car though compared to everyone else's mid-eighties trash. I had a few adults that took me under their wing and explained how to fix things but no one ever did it for me. It took a LOT of work and sacrifice to own that car but it was mine and I loved it. Save your money, work more than you have to, get to know people in the hobby and help them out when you can and deals will come up - you just have to have the cash to take advantage. Once you get the car it's another story but it will work out if you make it happen.

One last thing, a Charger is probably a horrible first car so it may be a really good idea to look for something smaller, newer, and with expendable engine parts (318 maybe?). I'd go for a Dart or Duster... if you can stand the looks.

Troy

[Silver R/T]

Glad I bought mine, great investment

[Blakcharger440]

I think that when someone says they dont care if their musclecar was worth $1 or $1Million dollars is fooling themselves and not being truly realistic.  
Because we all know if ya had a sparkling red Hemi Daytona survivor that you would want unobtainium amounts of money for it that only Jay Leno and Bill Gates could afford.

I dont think stanghater is lookng to get a hot deal of a couple hundred bucks either. But just wishes for a sane price.
But there are alot of people who profess to complain about the skyrocketing prices of musclecars in one thread and then turn around and try to ebay their 318 car off for 75K (I know a crazy amount.....but ya get my point)
No one here is about giving anyone a good deal on a Charger but just dont turn around and say....oh,but its the other guy who is driving up the prices. ITS ALL OF US!
I will want my truck load full of sweaty cash when it comes time to sell all my muscle cars just like the next guy....and dont say that ya dont  

[Chad L. Magee]

No one here is about giving anyone a good deal on a Charger but just dont turn around and say....oh,but its the other guy who is driving up the prices. ITS ALL OF US!

I agree on this one.  Case in point, it would take big, big $ to get me to part with my one hemi car, and remember it is just a project.  That makes the prices of the other hemi cars a little higher because  that is one off of the market.........

[TheGhost]

I remember a few years ago you could get a clean '69 charger for $5,000

Do you now?

[Ghoste]

All of us?  Mine isn't for sale and I don't even like it that much .  Seriously though, it isn't for sale and if I change my mind, it will go for what someone else will think is a steal.  One of the best kept secrets is the 1st gen cult.  If you're in the cult, it's amazing how many parts people will let go cheap to help you keep the car on the road.  I've given parts away myself to help someone out.  That's going too as I have recently began to see e-bayers and swap meet prices rising and rising.
I blame B-J for the televised hype.  The Leno's and Gates (even though I don't think Gates is a car collector?) have always existed and always paid what it took to get what they wanted.  I would bet that Leno isn't too crazy about the sudden and insane price increase either.  Just because he CAN afford it doesn't mean he WANTS to.  B-J has added in a "coolness" because you buy it on television.  How many of us actually know someone who bought a car at B-J?  I do and he readily admits that having too much to drink and his friends egging him on so his wife could watch it at home, got him to set a record price on a car.
As for prices today seeming like a bargain in ten years, well that's all relative.  If you are talking about cars that Mustanghater would look at a project Charger for 10,000 might as well be a hundred thousand.  Being able to afford the 10,000 dollar car in a decade or two only to have them costing 10X that won't really matter.  And that is the crux of my rants over B-J (and I still primarily blame them).  It's an artificial rise.  Last year a 6 barrel Road Runner sets a record for, what was it, around a 100K?  This year a 6 pack Super Bee goes for 210,000!!!  That is not normal.  If the general economy demonstrated that kind of inflation, the federal reserve would be going nuts and the general public would be rioting in the streets.  Clones are bringing over a 100k?  Is there a single educated gearhead who would pay that?  Really?
Flippers here (who aren't praised by all of us btw) and the e-bay (often derided as e-screw, e gouge, e-bag iirc) record deals are only talked about here.  How many times did you go into work and people come up to you and say "hey I saw a car just like yours on the Charger forum and the guy paid 5 but sold it 24 hours later for 15"?  None?  How many times did people with zero interest in cars say the same thing about B-J?
I'll need a lot of convincing to change my mind about B-J being the primary source of this runaway inflation.

[Mike DC]

American Musclecars are THE hot cars of this half-century.  Poeple walk by $200K modern Ferraris at car shows to go look at $20K old Plymouths.  Musclecars' prices are starting to reflect this.  There's nothing wrong with it except that the public perception of these cars needs to totally change. 

Ever since the end of the musclecar era, people have been waiting for these cars to "come back" as if what followed in the 70s & 80s was a brief screwup and the future will be brighter.  But now, even as the modern versions of these cars are coming out, we're finally realizing that these cars are NEVER coming back.  The public is finally realizing that nothing Detroit builds in the future will ever strike a chord with people the way these cars did again.  No wonder the demand is skyrocketing.

They're not cheap redneck cars anymore.  The average Appalachain redneck in 2006 is a lot more likely to have a 1989 Dodge in his front yard than a 1969. 

.

[hemihead]

American Musclecars are THE hot cars of this generation.  Poeple walk by 2006 Ferraris at car shows to go look at stock 1971 Plymouths.  Musclecars' prices are starting to reflect this.  There's nothing wrong with it except that the public preception of these cars needs to totally change.

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They're not cheap redneck cars anymore.  The average Appalachain redneck in 2006 is a lot more likely to have a 1989 Dodge in his front yard than a 1969.  The public needs to stop looking at building musclecars as an immature & redneck thing requiring no brainpower.

Ever since the end of the musclecar era, people have been waiting for these cars to "come back" as if what followed in the 70s & 80s was a brief screwup and the future will be brighter.  But now, even as the modern versions of these cars are coming out, we're finally realizing that these cars are NEVER coming back.  The public is is finally realizing that nothing Detroit builds in the future will ever strike a chord with people the way these cars did again.  No wonder the demand is skyrocketing.

.

These cars should have stayed "redneck' cars as you call them.I am not a redneck but I have always owned a Mopar.I'm brand loyal.
When I was a teen the only guys that owned Mopars, or any Muscle car,was the Gearheads.The rest of the trendy people wanted new cars.They would socially snub you if you were driving an "old" Muslcecar.Now, owning a Muslecar is become the "in" ,trendy thing to do.
There are way too many people working on these cars who should never open a hood.
The market on these cars will drop as soon as the generation starts to go to the old folks homes or die off.If you think the Mrs. or little Bobby and Mary is going to keep Dad's old car around because he spent more time and money on it than he did them ,you're  kidding yourself.
They will sell you cherished car for whatever they can get to go blow on the next Fad that comes along.
And the young kids aren't interested in your Musclecar. It is not from their generation.They want the ricers.Most kids consider Musclecars for the rich,old,senior citizens.

[terrible one]

I like musclecars...

[Mike DC]

I agree with you on some of that, Hemihead.

These cars are too trendy for their own good right now, but wait until these guys can spend $35K on a modern version and not get their hands dirty.  That'll help the issue some.  I've got nothing against buyers of modern musclecars (many of them are OUR kinds of guys too), but some of the people spending huge money on old musclecars at B-J really are more suited to the modern copies.

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I also REALLY wish these cars could totally retain their blue-collar roots.  I'd like that more than anything.  These cars have traditionally been sort of a badge of honor, an excusive club for the types of guys who can keep them running & repaired.  It pains me to see so many of them falling into the hands of collectors who would be embarrassed to be seen in public with the same guy who beautifully restored the car.  

But I think that losing some of that is inevitable, unfortunately.  The demand for the cars is too mainstream now, and the mainstream "replacements" from Detroit just aren't visceral enough to do the job.  (They should be selling 6-liter Hemi Challengers without the sound-deadening & exhaust reasonators.)

.

[Johnny SixPack]

And the young kids aren't interested in your Musclecar. It is not from their generation.They want the ricers.Most kids consider Musclecars for the rich,old,senior citizens.

I think you're off on that point. They're most definitely interested in them, especially when beaten by them.

Seriously though, if you want to get technical, well... muscle cars were before my time. I was born in "74 and by the time I could say Charger, the USA was in the middle of the gas 'crisis' and muscle cars were definitely not the thing to have. Yes, the DOH influenced me (since it was on for much of my formative years), but even then, let's face it, muscle cars were before my time.

The point I'm trying to make is this, it's not so much a generational thing (although for you old farts it might be ) as it is a love of what the cars represent. And lets not forget the styling and inherent coolness factor.

Many of the Ricers that see me out and about in either the "69 or the "70 stare as my 36 yr old hunk of steel rolls by, or even just sits at a stoplight.

The interest is there, but the means to follow it aren't for most (even though the F&F movies seem to make muscle cars out to be cheap -price wise- by how they treat them). So they go with what they can afford (often thanks to the very rich, old, senior citizens you commented about driving classic car prices through the roof). Unfortunately some of them are so caught up in the looks (if you can call 'em that ) that the car is essentially a paper tiger (well, more like a fiberglass one), but IMO much of it still comes down to a desire to have a vehicle that stands alone from the faceless masses (much as someone who bought a Hemi Orange, Sublime or Plum Crazy MoPar with a Go-Wing or Daytona/Superbird owner was doing in let's say "69 or "70).

It's even more noticeable with little kids.

Not a cruise goes by that some 5-10 yr old isn't plastered to the glass of mommy or daddy's modern snoozer trying to get a look at that cool car that effortlessly stands out from the pack. Just as I was doing 20 some odd years ago.

And remember, these are just some ramblings from a guy suffering from insomnia. 

[skip68]

Well, these are sweet cars and we know it.   I'm 50/50, It makes it harder to buy more of them but, It protects them and keeps most teenage kids from buying them and destroying them ..... I've got a friend that thinks I should sale the 68 I just got while the market is hot(looser) before it drops.. I just laughed and said they may drop a penny or two but they basically will never go down, they will only keep going up and that's a fact...... The rate that they will go up is hard to say but it's a fact... ..............To sum it up, I welcome the high prices, it makes me proud to have them ..Kind of like having your child being popular and others envying him or her. So I guess I'm proud of my cars[/b Chuck...............

[triple_green]

The prices for this hobby are just like verything else. They are affected by supply and demand. The supply is somewhat fixed and the demand is rapidly growing.

I think that the prices on Chargers and other desirable 60s-early 70s cars will rise about 7% per year on average until the late baby boomers start dying off (20 years from now). Then  they will go flat and probably receed a little.

My solution is to keep getting the young guys into the hobby. I'm  :-doing my part.......2 boys and some of their friends.

3X

[JimShine]

"I think that when someone says they dont care if their musclecar was worth $1 or $1Million dollars is fooling themselves and not being truly realistic"

In my case, I am being totally realistic. I do not see my car as an 'investment'. It is a hobby and like most hobbies you pay to play. Buy a new motorcycle, ATV, boat, RV, you lose money to have fun. But thats okay, that is the way it is supposed to be. You want to have fun you pay for it. While the cars are not depreciating is nice for the 'investor', it is a moot point for me because I am enjoying the car regardless of its value, just like I would anything new that depreciates. Why is the mindset today that everything we buy has to gurantee a certain return if we decide to sell? Nobody cared about that years ago. You got your use and thats what you paid for. Today everything is an investment, which in my opinion is unrealistic.

[Orange_Crush]

It took me 20 years to be able to buy the '70 R/T I now have.  During that time, I owned a '69 SE which I ebayed KNOWING that I would get the most money possible for it.  Did I contribute to the high prices of MNopars nowadays?  Probably, in a small way I did.

Do I feel bad about it?  Nope, I got the car I wanted out of it.  Now, the '70 R/T is the car I always wanted, but if someone was to offer me insane amounts of money for it, you bet your ass I'd sell it.  I can always put the money towards building something else I've always wanted (small-block stroker aspen station wagon G machine).

I figure that by the time I'm done, I'll be 35 to 40 grand into my Charger.  Restoring these cars costs a LOT of money and no one wants to lose money on their car.

[Lightning]

and this is the whole reason why I looked into the alternatives ('74-'89 Mopars) in the first place.  All I need to do to make my car handle better, is to put the B-body front suspension on it!

[RT DAVE]

Did anybody notice that there weren't very many original 2nd gen cars at BJ this year?  There was one 70 v code and that was it.  There was also a 70 "custom" and that red 68 with the 5.7 hemi.  The two 71 RTs went for huge money.  Not sure why.  The max wedge cars were a steal this year in comparison. 

[sharpspike]

they are still out there, you just need to be quick. the 68 is sold i just missed it.


1968 DODGE CHARGER. 81,738 mi., 360 crate motor, 1,284 mi. on crate motor, new exhaust system, need front fender repair, AT. $4,400. Ft. Wayne, IN. 260-637-4338


1970 DODGE CHALLENGER RT. Numbers matching, 383 hp., AT, motor, trans. rebuilt, 8-3/4", Rallye dash, hood, whs., car is rusty, 70 SE, is very solid, 2 cars, one price. $5,300 OBO. Markle, IN. 260-388-9237

1966 DODGE CHARGER. Historical Special Edition, wide block 318, 3 sp. manual, some bubbled paint, small rust holes back qtrs., floors, trunk, rails solid, red int. $6,600 OBO. Trade. Also, AKC German Shepherd pups. Gibsonburg, OH. 419-637-7953

1973 PLYMOUTH GOLDEN DUSTER. V8, AT. $1,300. Spencers Auto Sales, Logansport, IN. 574-753-6060, 574-739-2620

[sharpspike]

oops i forgot 

[71Charger500]

Get one now, and hopefully the price will keep going up.

[Ghoste]

And I wouldn't be so certain about the prices going up and up forever.  It might happen but you might also want to ask some of the Model T and 57 Chevy owners what happened to their spiralling "investments".  It's called the graying of the hobby and unless these mass produced and relatively common vehicles somehow attain the status of the handbuilt prewar luxury classics and certain exotic sports cars, don't count on prices only going in one direction.  They might, because of the visceral factor that Mike mentioned, but history stacks the odds against it.
And for every young guy, say less than 35, who is into these old cars, there are likely thousands who couldn't care less.
Just my opinion though, I wish I had a crystal ball.

[mustanghater]

I found a Ok deal. 2 '72 chargers for $2000. one is parts the other is the "project", I've never seen a Running driving car in this type of condition.