Gauge gremlins aka instrument cluster resto, the results!

[Dino]

I finally got the car back, put the instrument cluster in and not everything worked as it should...

Before I pulled the cluster to restore, only one thing did not work and that was the right hand turn signal indicator light on the panel, everything else worked perfect...almost perfect, fuel gauge was at the 3/4 mark when the tank was topped up to the cap.

Of course dumbass ole' me had to pull the damn thing because it looked like a 40 yo cluster.  It looks great now but alas, something went wrong.

First of all I am not an electrician so I did not test anything out before I put it back in the car.  Simply because I don't know how and because I didn't really have to take all that much apart to reface the gauges, it's really straightforward.  Therefor I believed everything would not work!

First thing I noticed,  the rh turn signal indicator works! Yay!
But the clock is not moving...  Looked for continuity and nothing, no juice.  The orange wire had power but the clock didn't take it.  Took the clock back out and bench tested it.  The ground seems to be a flimsy metal ring with the positive post sticking inside it, protected by a rubber washer.  It's deteriorating but it still looks decent.  Finall got the thing running but by the time I hooked it up in the car it didn't move again.  I did this a few times, also played around with the mechanism itself and I'd be able to wind it enough to get it running for a few seconds...so no clock.  Funny thing though, I drove it home and noticed that for every hour in the car, the thin second hand would move up about 5 seconds!  By the time I got home it seemed like I did the trip in 20 seconds.  So what is going on with this thing?  Is it fried or did I miss something?  I found two small springs in the mechanism and both were attached at either end.  One was part of the winding mechanism I think.

The speedo!  Oh boy...the cable is on thanks to someone who knew what he was doing (no not me), and the odometer turns and works great...but the speedo needle isn't going anywhere, and that's a problem with a 440 under the hood.

I followed pcg's instructions on how to remove and reinstall the needle and it was a breeze, yet after doing only that why is it not moving?  Before I installed it in the cluster, I could easily spin that big metal wheel thingy and the needle would travel from 0 - virtual 165-ish and back.  Again where do I start to look?

When I turned on the lights only half the cluster lit up.  None of the small gauges were lit nor was the right side of the speedo.  These are all the bulbs on the circuit board.  We tested the bulbs and wires and they are good.  One of the 5 (6?) pins on the circuit board (far right looking from the back) Was a bit loose so I don't know if the circuit is broken.  The connector itself seemed fine.  Now all the small gauges work great and even the fuel gauge read spot on this time!  Temp read the same as before as did oil pressure and alternator.  About 45 minutes into the trip the fuel, oil and alt gauges travelled all the way to the right and stayed there.  WTF???  My first thought was that the gauges received more than 5 volts, maybe the full 12 and they were now the prettiest dead gauges thou shalt find.
About 10 minutes later the temp gauge fell to the far left and has remained there.  I pulled into a rest area and turned the ignition off, fuel and oil pressure gauge needles fell to the left.  Every time I turned the ignition on the fuel and oil needles would go back to the right, temp never moved, alt works fine.

Now all I had to rely on to know how much fuel I have left is to look at the odometer and guess.  The thing is, since I swapped the rear end gears, the odometer and speedo are off, by quite a bit.  I know the odometer shows less than you're actually doing so better safe than sorry, I pulled into a gas station, filled it up and did the math.  Yep it's still doing a lousy 11 mpg on the highway...

I drove it home, ignored the gremlins and enjoyed a sunny Sunday morning in my Charger.

I hope you guys can shed some light on what is going on as I really don't want to remove and install this cluster much more.  Not because it's a lot of boring work but because every time I do this, I risk damaging the hard work I put into restoring this.  I will post a few pics later in my cluster resto thread (and/or here).  I don't think anyone can tell the difference between the real chrome and the paint.  It looks awesome!

[b5blue]

1st I'd ground the cluster really well "somehow" and re-check. The pins to the printed board are famous for looking fine yet not conducting at the connection. If one gauge light works they all should. (Clean and wiggle to check.) 

[Dino]

1st I'd ground the cluster really well "somehow" and re-check. The pins to the printed board are famous for looking fine yet not conducting at the connection. If one gauge light works they all should. (Clean and wiggle to check.) 

None of the circuit board lights work, only the lights on the seperate wires work.  The oil pressure gauge decided to move around a bit more, floating around 20 now. 

I'll try to test the circuit board and see what's going on. 

[Dino]

I just remembered...we ran into a mystery wire coming from under the dash.  It's brown with a tracer wire.  I 'think' it's an extra for a 3 speed wiper switch, I have a 2 speed.  I don't 'think' it has anything to do with the problems that occur but thought I'd mention it.

Drove the car into work this morning and noticed the clock moved up 5 seconds again...wth is wrong with this thing??

Fuel, temp and oil pressure are all back to the far left, they ain't getting juice!

Oh and the '70 rheostat that checked out fine when I bench tested it?  That's not working either...seems like the two dash light bulbs that get power are at full intensity, turning the dome switch doesn't do anything and the dome light will only come on when I open the door.

[Dino]

I just looked at the instructions to reassemble the speedometer needle and it states to make sure the magnet tabs are not hitting the cupped wheel...I am so hoping they are because that would be a pretty easy fix!

It's too dangerous for me to drive without a speedometer, I got to work real early this morning so I must've been going a tad too fast...

[b5blue]

There is a contact at the far end of the dash light for dome, check it's clean. I recommend "Caig Labs DeOxIt D-100" on everything electrical connector wise.    It can be gotten at Radio Shack.

[AirborneSilva]

Man, God bless ya!  You did a great job of making them things look pretty  and that's something I probably couldn't do, least wise not that pretty, anyway I hate electrical issues and that's why I will be sending my instrument cluster in to get a full resto.  As for the dash bezel I think I'm just going to paint it black (it's a 73 ralley bezel so it's the wood grain), I don't think I can get it to look original..... 

Keep on keeping on, I'm pulling for ya that it's a simple fix 

[Dino]

Thanks blue I'll get that stuff and try it out.

Yeah Tony, I figured this would be a quick install and done, that didn't go as I'd hoped.   

How bad is your bezel?  Got any pics?  I might be able to save it for you IF you have time, I have several things to do before I can tackle the next project but I'd be happy to take a look at it and see what needs to be done..

[Dino]

The small gauges are really acting weird.  I can no longer see the needle for the fuel gauge, I think it's to the far left but it's out of sight.  Temp needle has not moved at all, still to the left.  Oil pressure gauge goes up to about 20 for a while, then maxes out.

What are the chances these will all work again when the circuit board is fixed?  Good looking gauges or not, if they're done for I need to start shopping for new gauges.

[AirborneSilva]

Thanks blue I'll get that stuff and try it out.

Yeah Tony, I figured this would be a quick install and done, that didn't go as I'd hoped.   

How bad is your bezel?  Got any pics?  I might be able to save it for you IF you have time, I have several things to do before I can tackle the next project but I'd be happy to take a look at it and see what needs to be done..

Hey thanks Dirk, I wont be ready to have the bezel done for quite some time but will try to get you picks soon.  The big problem is that when the rocket scientist that decided to paint the dash baby blue he didn't do a real good job masking the bezel so it has some blue over spray on it    There's only a couple of small spots around the edge that will need some fixing but I think a small amount of epoxy or something like that will fix it just fine.

[Dino]

Thanks blue I'll get that stuff and try it out.

Yeah Tony, I figured this would be a quick install and done, that didn't go as I'd hoped.   

How bad is your bezel?  Got any pics?  I might be able to save it for you IF you have time, I have several things to do before I can tackle the next project but I'd be happy to take a look at it and see what needs to be done..

Hey thanks Dirk, I wont be ready to have the bezel done for quite some time but will try to get you picks soon.  The big problem is that when the rocket scientist that decided to paint the dash baby blue he didn't do a real good job masking the bezel so it has some blue over spray on it    There's only a couple of small spots around the edge that will need some fixing but I think a small amount of epoxy or something like that will fix it just fine.

Overspray shouldn't be a problem, usually that can be removed without damaging the substrate.  Epoxy usually works fine for chips and nicks and there's other things to use as well.  If most of the woodgrain cleans up then the rest can be touched up with an airbrush.

[AirborneSilva]

Thanks blue I'll get that stuff and try it out.

Yeah Tony, I figured this would be a quick install and done, that didn't go as I'd hoped.   

How bad is your bezel?  Got any pics?  I might be able to save it for you IF you have time, I have several things to do before I can tackle the next project but I'd be happy to take a look at it and see what needs to be done..

Hey thanks Dirk, I wont be ready to have the bezel done for quite some time but will try to get you picks soon.  The big problem is that when the rocket scientist that decided to paint the dash baby blue he didn't do a real good job masking the bezel so it has some blue over spray on it    There's only a couple of small spots around the edge that will need some fixing but I think a small amount of epoxy or something like that will fix it just fine.

Overspray shouldn't be a problem, usually that can be removed without damaging the substrate.  Epoxy usually works fine for chips and nicks and there's other things to use as well.  If most of the woodgrain cleans up then the rest can be touched up with an airbrush.

Yeah I dampened a rag with lacquer thinner and gently tried to wipe of the blue, while it did take that butt ugly blue off it was also taking the black accent over the brown so I quit.

Sorry, I'm dominating your thread.... 

[Dino]

Haha don't worry about it. 

There's not a lot of comments on this thread because b5blue is probably on the right track so I'm going to do what he suggests and take it from there.  I just figured out how to test the gauges themselves with some AA batteries so keep your fingers crossed! 

If they're toast I may go ahead and buy white and red's cluster in the for sale section although I really don't want to spend that much money on it.

[AirborneSilva]

Couldn't you send to a place like just dash's or some other resto shop?  I will be sending mine out, there's some things I just don't want to attempt on my own and while it's expensive I know it will be done right.  I do applaud your attempt as well as your patients.

[Dino]

Couldn't you send to a place like just dash's or some other resto shop?  I will be sending mine out, there's some things I just don't want to attempt on my own and while it's expensive I know it will be done right.  I do applaud your attempt as well as your patients.

All they would do is replace the circuit board and whatever gauges are fried.  I can do that myself and save a lot of money.  And I will if that's what it takes.

Because everything worked when I pulled it and I never touched the circuit board, it must have broken to old 'seal' and now I either have a continuity or a ground issue (I hope).  I'm trying to plan when I will be pulling the cluster out again, it's not a 5 minute job but that's about all the time I have lately.

[AirborneSilva]

yeah it is a big job which is why I won't be doing mine anytime soon.  I did get another gauge cluster off e-bay, it has the 150 MPH speedo and clock (may want to swap out the clock with a tic toc tac), so I will send that cluster in for resto while I am still driving/working on other things, but then I have that luxury with two gauge clusters and all...

[b5blue]

  Some where here is an excellent gauge test/repair topic.....it shows how to take a list of things from radio shack and build a gauge tester. Matt sent me his extra parts leftover from buying his for me to make one when I had my cluster out. I'll see if I can dig the topic up. 
   I got my D-100 from "Techni-Tool" and used it everywhere I've touched electrical anything. My gauges all worked fine upon install, (They look crappy but work.) So I never needed to make the tester.

[Dino]

Thanks again for that link blue.

My coworker today informed me he was driving behind me on the way in to work and he said my ds brake lights are out.  On the outside everything else works.  They did work when I parked the car for the winter.  I will check the bulbs and fuses shortly but in case they're good, can this have something to do with the cluster mess?  One thing I did change was the rheostat switch...which does the same as the original : zip!

Do wires for brake lights hook into something back there?

[b5blue]

There is a electrical connector for all the rear of the car under the kick panel next to the E brake.    Then there is the brake switch at the top of the peddle also.

[DC_1]

 
Some where here is an excellent gauge test/repair topic.....it shows how to take a list of things from radio shack and build a gauge tester

This one?.......scroll down near the bottom


http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,37999.0.html

[b5blue]

yep....

[AirborneSilva]

Thanks again for that link blue.

My coworker today informed me he was driving behind me on the way in to work and he said my ds brake lights are out.  On the outside everything else works.  They did work when I parked the car for the winter.  I will check the bulbs and fuses shortly but in case they're good, can this have something to do with the cluster mess?  One thing I did change was the rheostat switch...which does the same as the original : zip!

Do wires for brake lights hook into something back there?

I would think that if the right side lights do work then it would have to be something in the trunk area, maybe the light sockets themselves are not getting ground.  It just stands to reason that if one side works then the fuse and switch are both ok 

[Dino]

Tony I have to agree with you.  I checked the bulbs and they are fine, the taillight housing is clean as are all the connections.  I'm almost positive the culprit is behind the cluster.

[AirborneSilva]

If you have a circuit tester like this http://partimages.genpt.com/largeimages/223674.jpg I would turn on the flashers and see if you get the testers light to light up (well flash), that will tell you if you have power there, if not then test the wires to that side working your way back to the dash.

[Dino]

I'm going to autozone tonight to pick up a new battery so I'll grab one of those.

The flashers do work but yeah I have a lot of wiring to check.  The more I look at it, the more it seems it's all related to the circuit board but I'm also putting the original (nonworking) rheostat back in just to eliminate that variable. 

I so hate electrical...