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Hemi heresy?

Started by Ghoste, September 16, 2010, 10:18:26 AM

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Ghoste

Talking about Japanese hemi's in another thread got me to looking them up.

Here is one.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_V_engine

And here are several others.  Ford, Aston Martin, Jaguar, Mitsubishi, Alfa Romeo and Lotus have all used the hemi chamber.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hemi_engine

I am obviously biased but I still the Chrysler ones are the greatest.  :icon_smile_big:

lisiecki1

the chrysler ones are the best because they came up with the original design, all others are just imitations......and NEVER as godly as the 426!  :2thumbs:
Remember the average response time to a 911 call is over 4 minutes.

The average response time of a 357 magnum is 1400 FPS.

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,52527.0.html

elacruze

Actually none of the above mentioned engines are true Hemis. Most pre WWII engines used true hemispherical combustion chambers. Harley-Davidson introduced the Hemi to their engines with the 1936 Knucklehead and used it through the 1984 FXR Shovelhead.

It's not a particularly good design unless you're running Nitromethane.
1968 505" EFI 4-speed
1968 D200 Camper Special, 318/2bbl/4spd/4.10
---
Torque converters are for construction equipment.

Ghoste

I'd disagree with that.  The main drawbacks as we know them relate to Nox emissions and valvetrain mass.  Overhead cams can do much to overcome that.  The vaunted 426 isn't a true Hemi either.  For that matter I'm not sure the 331-392 series were either.  There were compromises made in order to manufacture the thing.  There are huge gains found in surface to volume ratio and port flow.  Higher compression ratios on lower octane fuel (that is surface to volume of course).
The simple fact is there is no perfect internal combustion fossil fuel engine and the Hemi lends itself extremely well to some applications and poorly to others.  Just as wedges, crescents, poly's and so on.

Aero426

Quote from: lisiecki1 on September 16, 2010, 11:14:33 AM
the chrysler ones are the best because they came up with the original design, all others are just imitations......and NEVER as godly as the 426!  :2thumbs:

Better brush up on your history...

lisiecki1

Quote from: Aero426 on September 16, 2010, 03:24:34 PM
Quote from: lisiecki1 on September 16, 2010, 11:14:33 AM
the chrysler ones are the best because they came up with the original design, all others are just imitations......and NEVER as godly as the 426!  :2thumbs:

Better brush up on your history...

nope.
Remember the average response time to a 911 call is over 4 minutes.

The average response time of a 357 magnum is 1400 FPS.

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,52527.0.html

Aero426

Chrysler made it a household name.   But the hemi head design was successfully involved in auto racing just after the dawn of the automobile nearly 100 years ago.   Peugeot's DOHC design set the stage for racing engines for decades to come.  

lisiecki1

Quote from: Aero426 on September 16, 2010, 03:35:29 PM
Chrysler made it a household name.   But the hemi head design was successfully involved in auto racing just after the dawn of the automobile nearly 100 years ago.   Peugeot's DOHC design set the stage for racing engines for decades to come.   

I've read the history about hemi designs in mortars and cannons and then allie ray welch designing the first hemi head engine for a launch around 1901 before creating the Welch car company with his brother, etc., etc., etc.


I still stick by my original statement  :nana: :icon_smile_big:
Remember the average response time to a 911 call is over 4 minutes.

The average response time of a 357 magnum is 1400 FPS.

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,52527.0.html

Aero426

So if you know the history,  why would you say that Chrysler came up with the original design?   


FJMG

That's right doug, in addition to DOHC hemi chambers in 1912, they also introduced monoblock casting, 4 valves/cyl. AND desmodromically controlled valve closing mechanism (still used by Ducati). Peugeot was years ahead of their time.

lisiecki1

Quote from: Aero426 on September 16, 2010, 05:21:12 PM
So if you know the history,  why would you say that Chrysler came up with the original design?   



I didn't say I KNOW it, I said I've READ it, always willing to learn more however.  When you say original I'm assuming you're talking about the experimental XIV-2220 aircraft engine circa the 1940's?

Maybe we should start another topic about the history of the Hemisperical head design?  I would love to have a place that compiles all the little bits and pieces everyone knows about the design and construction.  I searched for "hemi history" but didn't really find what i was looking for...
Remember the average response time to a 911 call is over 4 minutes.

The average response time of a 357 magnum is 1400 FPS.

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,52527.0.html

mauve66

Quote from: FJMG on September 17, 2010, 08:59:09 AM
That's right doug, in addition to DOHC hemi chambers in 1912, they also introduced monoblock casting, 4 valves/cyl. AND desmodromically controlled valve closing mechanism (still used by Ducati). Peugeot was years ahead of their time.

too bad they didn't buy chrysler instead of fiat
Robert-Las Vegas, NV

NEEDS:
body work
paint - mauve and black
powder coat wheels - mauve and black
total wiring
PW
PDLKS
Tint
trim
engine - 520/540, eddy heads, 6pak
alignment

Ghoste

Personally, I think it's too bad that Bob and the boys sold Chrysler out in the first place.  I understand what you're saying though.

mauve66

at least i've seen and ridden in some hot Peugeots , 4 cyl of course, when i was in germany, never saw a fiat except out the rear window
Robert-Las Vegas, NV

NEEDS:
body work
paint - mauve and black
powder coat wheels - mauve and black
total wiring
PW
PDLKS
Tint
trim
engine - 520/540, eddy heads, 6pak
alignment

Ghoste

I see a lot in the course of a year and things like the Abarth's are tuned up pretty good but they are still little runt cars that don't do a thing for me.  I appreciate that the current Fiat CEO turned the company around and they own Ferrari and all of those great things and I hope they are somehow able to make Chrysler a profitable automaker once again but I hope they don't want to do it by turning it into an American distributor for Italian minicars.
Then again, maybe that is the sad dark vision of the auto future anyway.

Mike DC

    
The only thing Chrysler does well is be Chrysler.  Signature.  Oddball.  Fun.  Love it or hate it but don't forget it.  Let them design fun cars and they'll sell enough of that stuff to make up for their corporate and product problems like quality control.  

But these other corps all wanna take over Chrysler and try to use it as a front for their own brand's stuff.  No good.  They are stopping Mopar from doing what it does well and trying to make it live on what it does badly.  Of course it's gonna fail like that.  

   

jeryst

I just wish they would stop putting the same grill on everything! GOD, I hate that!