Overheating issue resolved....interesting read !

[greenpigs]

Not sure if the part number is the same elsewere. http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/brbhigvolwat.html

[Steve P.]

I have not put the car on wheels yet, so I can't say what my running temp will be at this point.  Oddly enough, the 440 Source pump was the only one whose vanes would touch the housing when put together without a gasket (preferred tight tolerances).  However, take a look at the photo and notice how off-center the shaft is in relation to the impeller.  Probably not too big a deal but makes one wonder about quality control.  The impeller itself was centered and true, just the hub center was cast just a bit off.

Hey Randy,  By any chance have you measured from the center of the shaft to the outside edge of the vein style pump? (4-places would be good.) I'm wondering about QC as well and also wonder if that pump rubs without the gasket due to tight clearance or off center. Also if the weight being off center wouldn't cause some balance troubles and take out a pump early in life?

[Needa68]

Ron: Thank you for posting this information. I'm one of those experiencing an overheating issue. My 440 has had over heating problems from the start. I contribute that to it being bored 60 over, having 10.25:1 flat top pistons and a 440 commando cam.

It took me about a year to resolve the over heating problem initially. I did so, ironically by installing a new 440 Source water pump in the original housing, an electric fan and by adding a concoction of distilled water, Red Line Water Wetter and glycol to the radiator.

Things were fine until I returned from MOPARS at The Strip last year. It was then I noticed the lower radiator hose was leaking. Since I had to drain the system to change the hose I decided to also replace the original water pump housing. I purchased a housing from 440 Source, swapped the pump to it, installed both then refilled the radiator with the coolant concoction.

All was fine until the hot days of summer began. Suddenly the over heating problem was back in spades. Now that the weather is cool again all is well. If not for your post I doubt I'd have considered replacing the new housing. I'll be swapping it out in the very near future.

I do have one question for the membership. Are any of you who have stock BB engines fitted with the 440 Source water pump housing having heating issues? I ask because I used the 440 Source water pump / housing combo on the stock 440 I recently put in the 68 Charger I am restoring. My hope is I don't need to change out that housing too since that engine shouldn't run as hot as my other one.

All feedback would be appreciated. 

[harlandodge]

well as for my engine running hot , the water pump housing was the cause of it , in the back of it the water port openings were much smaller then the ones in my factory housing, really couldnt tell by looking , had to put my finger in the water ports to feel the difference,, cannot remember what brand name mine was but bought it on e-bay , anyway problem is fixed after changing my pump housing

[doctor4766]

Not sure if the part number is the same elsewere. http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/brbhigvolwat.html

Thanks for that link Allan.
Is there another supplier you'd recommend for that same part?
I'm just not really prepared to give Mancini any more of my money yet since they still haven't done the right thing by me with regards to a camshaft that was incorrectly supplied.

I'd really like to sort out the cause of my overheating and at this stage I'm still running the original OE water pump and housing that came with my engine. That's about the only thing left now.
The plan is to fit one of these Milodon HV pumps and a HV thermostat at the same time since after just having my 26" radiator rodded/flushed and  changing out the coolant, she's still getting a bit warm for my liking.

[greenpigs]

You can try Summit.



http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MIL-16260/

[Silver R/T]

Not sure if the part number is the same elsewere. http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/brbhigvolwat.html

Thanks for that link Allan.
Is there another supplier you'd recommend for that same part?
I'm just not really prepared to give Mancini any more of my money yet since they still haven't done the right thing by me with regards to a camshaft that was incorrectly supplied.

I'd really like to sort out the cause of my overheating and at this stage I'm still running the original OE water pump and housing that came with my engine. That's about the only thing left now.
The plan is to fit one of these Milodon HV pumps and a HV thermostat at the same time since after just having my 26" radiator rodded/flushed and  changing out the coolant, she's still getting a bit warm for my liking.

You can try Ebay. I just picked up a brand new one for $62 shipped

[Ranman69SE]

Steve, sorry for the late reply.  The impeller is centered to the shaft (equal distance all the way around).  It seems to be just the center hub casting that is off, and I suppose it could cause a balance issue but I'm sure it would be extremely minor.  And without the gasket, the vanes would lightly contact the back of the housing (not the sides) so from a tolerance standpoint, the 440 source WP is about right, IMO.  I still decided not to use it though.......

[Steve P.]

Great info. Ranman. Thanks for getting back with it... 

[chargerdogs]

This my first post here.  I have found this thread to be very informative even though I have not read all the posts yet.  I am running a stock 440 in my 68 Charger RT and it always runs hot.  I installed a tri-core radiator and same result.  I purchased a Mopar Performance aluminum water pump and still the same overheating issue.  Tried thermostats etc. and same old heat problem.  I have my original cast iron pump.  I think I will throw it back on and see what I get.  Any other ideas out there?

[greenpigs]

Are you running a shroud?

How old are the hoses & do you have a spring in the bottom one?

Welcome

[chargerdogs]

Hoses are good and are factory replacements.  I do not have a shroud.  Do you think it makes enough of a difference?  Thanks for the reply.

[Ghoste]

Makes a big difference.  (and double check that lower hose, it may be a factory replacement but even those have been cheaping out on the internal springs)

[chargerdogs]

Thanks for the info.  I will try a shroud and check the hose for the spring. 

[my69rt]

I've been having overheating issues since I picked up the car, never a breakdown, but enough to make me hesitate to go out on a hot day and white knuckle as the temp guage climbs near 220 at extended stops.  After reading this thread I finally pulled water pump off to see which version was installed, it looked like the test #5 pump....the worst one, great.  I installed the Miloden HV pump tonight and am looking forward to some cooler temps tomorrow on the test drive, with luck the sun will come out to stress the system.

Thanks for the data,

spence

[my69rt]

Test drive on a hot Memorial Day weekend complete, I think my overheating issues are solved.  Big Win! God Bless the Gold Star families.

spence

[doctor4766]

Good for you Spence.
I've been toying with the idea of the Miloden pump and thermostat too.
Might wait til summer and see if I haven't already cured my issues though.
Thanks for the heads up.

[70 Charger RT]

I wish I had come across this post a few years ago.  My old Charger (see avatar) had always run hot.  So much so that the caps on my battery had deformed from the heat.  I don't own the car anymore otherwise I would be pulling the pump.  Great thread.  On my next 70 rebuild I will definately stay away from 440 Source for the waterpump and housing.

[harlandodge]

mine wasnt running hot because of the water pump , it was running hot because of the aftermarket water pump housing

[johnnycharger]

Hi guys,
chiming in a little late here.... there is a lot of great info on the water pumps, but I am not see too much on thermostats. How are the milodon ones working? Are others working also? Is 180 degrees the best to go with?

[greenpigs]

   I run a 180 stat and make sure the fuel line does not touch anything plus use a phenolic spacer. Keeping the gas cool is more important than the coolant as it seems to run better at a higher operating temp. I tried the 160 stat years ago and it didn't seem to like it as much.

[johnnycharger]

Cool. I will go with the 180. Thanks!

[dodgedarren]

I have a 440 bored 30 over with Edelbrock heads, intake and cam. I am wonder if I will have overheating issues
with the stock radiator?? 10-1 compression

[FLG]

A little late,

Ranman,

I used an edelbrock wp and fyi it also contacts the housing if a gasket is not in place 

[CrAzYMoPaRGuY]

Here's a slight twist....

I bought a Mr Gasket high flow 160 stat for my Interceptor... (anybody know where this is going?  )
After running warm/hot I pulled the stat to test it, and bought a $7 Stant regular stat to compare it to.
Dropped both in a pot of water, applied heat.

160 $7 Stant cap strated opening at 165 degrees.
160 Mr Gasket high flow stat barely started opening at 210 degrees.

NO MISPRINT!

I tossed the Mr Gasket high flow and my temps dropped dramatically.

I also have a 440 Source aluminum water pump on my Interceptor, but a PASSENGER side dump. I don't seem to have an issue with it, but wonder if they are not as restrictive as the driver's side dump housings?
Are the guys here who have NO issues with cooling and 440 Source housings possibly PASSENGER side pump users?

I also HAD a 440 Source pump in my Interceptor, but thought I would swap to an Edelbrock pump to see if there was a major difference. Swapped them out anddd.... NO difference.  The Edelbrock didn't cool any better than the 440 Source pump in MY car.