Could use a little support...

[bill440rt]

The body shop does not side with the insurance company(because they all try to rip the body shops off as well as the consumer) so don't worry there. 

Hopefully AC Insurance has not told metlife this because they all stick together and screw the consumer.

Mike,
I'm not too sure how insurance companies work in Maine, or which ones you've had to deal with, but that is FAR from the truth from my experience. And I have DAILY experience.

Please re-read my post regarding my experience with American Collector's. They were EXCELLENT to deal with when I had to file a claim. Yes, they paid everything in FULL, no questions asked, going over & beyond. They're probably not worried about fault because when everything is said & done they will have subrogation against the other company for reimbursement. In dkn1997's case it is Metlife. Why wouldn't you want to go thru your company that specializes and understands antique/classic cars? Metlife will most likely fall short, this is not their expertise. That is probably why AC is so eager to help you now in the beginning. They'll worry about subrogation later. There was no effect on my rates, but it wouldn't hurt to ask them.


Depending on the area, some insurance companies won't pay directly from a shop's estimate unless that shop is part of some kind of direct repair program. In that case, they'll pay the shop DIRECT, not the customer.
Otherwise, they'll send out their own appraiser (in this case some lame-o who unfortunately didn't know what he
was looking at).

I can think of plenty of personal experiences where the body shop sided with the insurance company, and NOT the customer. YES, this does happen, and constantly. Like the guy who claims his air conditioning doesn't work since his tail light got broken. No insurance company is gonna pay to have his A/C fixed, so he bad mouths them.
And, I can think of just as many crooked body shops that try to screw the customer more so than the insurance company. They're out there too, believe me.
But, that is another topic for a different thread.

dkn1997, it sounds like you're on the right track here. Be patient, it'll all work out in the end. Have faith.

[hemi-hampton]

The burned up 72 Cuda I just repaired  the guy had some Haggerty type classic car insurance. Their original estimate was a cheap $5,000 with half the work I had to do left off, they only counted the obvious basics & nothing miscellaneous. Total now is somewhere around $15k, 3 times more then original. Still a works in progress so not sure how it will all work out in the end? LEON.

[69bronzeT5]

He was trying to nickpick "previous damage" by saying there is a hole in the vinyl top and a rust spot on the rear quarter.

Yep, they do that. We've had a few experiences with that too.

[daytonakid]

My statements are Oregon law but your's could be similar. One of our services is helping our customers get what they have legally coming. In our state you are ALWAYS better off to go through the other persons insurance if they are at fault. They must pay for loss of use. They must pay for returning the car to preloss condition or pay fair market value for it. If they repair it they are liable for diminished value. The car has now been wrecked and if you have two identical cars next to each other but one has been wrecked it is worthless than the unwrecked one. They owe for the difference. your can not make your insurance pay for most of these things. Something we have done if they are not working with you is to send a demand letter to their insured for the amount they refuse to pay. That gets their attention. Unfortunately today some corporations will do almost anything to increase the bottom line be it right or wrong. Don't be afraid to get what you have coming and be prepared to have them try to wait you out.

[dkn1997]

........... Why wouldn't you want to go thru your company that specializes and understands antique/classic cars? Metlife will most likely fall short, this is not their expertise. That is probably why AC is so eager to help you now in the beginning. They'll worry about subrogation later. There was no effect on my rates, but it wouldn't hurt to ask them.....

......dkn1997, it sounds like you're on the right track here. Be patient, it'll all work out in the end. Have faith.

I'd love to go through american collectors, but I'm paying the price here for my own mistake of not updrading my coverage over the years.  AC will cut me a check right now. The issue is that repairs are right at my coverage limit..and I know how these things snowball once you start working on them.  Plus AC is totalling out the car if they pay.  Im not sure how a salvage title would work since in NY, cars this age don't have titles...I'll keep being patient.  I also haven't gotten a price from the body shop and that's the most important thin in all of this. who cares what anyone says when this guy wants x amount for his work?  I want the price as if I came in off the street with no insurance. 

On a side note, I previously posted about metlife's guy being less than stellar in his people skills.  I also have to say that the AC adjuster wasn't that much better.  pretty much rude to me when I was trying to ask questions.  Is this a common thing with the adjusters?

[Ghoste]

Yes, their job is to bully you into the loss to "insure" that the company they work for never ever under any circumstances has to hand out a single penny of their hard earned money.

[dkn1997]

I got the grill home and disassembled about 90% of it.  here it is broken down to the metal frame and a pic after a bit of straightening. still more to go, but it's close.  once I have the all of the grill plastic I need, those pieces will dictate if I have to tweak this frame.  it's pretty flimsy, so I think getting it perfect is not happening. 

the damage:

drivers side "bucket"
driver's side headlight door (I have the piece that broke and I will fix that)
5 fins missing off the bottom of the grill center piece (I have 4 of them in a bag, I can live with one missing)
a few of the anchoring points on pass side headlight bucket and center are broken/gone.  since this is not a resto by any means, I can repair them to functionality with a little metal and some backyard engineering. 

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

On a side note, I previously posted about metlife's guy being less than stellar in his people skills.  I also have to say that the AC adjuster wasn't that much better.  pretty much rude to me when I was trying to ask questions.  Is this a common thing with the adjusters?

Oh yeah, I can attest to this....Bill is the biggest prick I know
Honestly though Bill is actually the nicest guy I know

[hemi-hampton]

The insurance companies want to give you a hard time  so you'll just go away & not ask anymore Questions. Then they can lowball you & you wont want to fight & argue with them. A technique they have perfected & it works, I've seen it work. LEON.

[The70RT]

Stick to your guns and make them pay. You got all winter to get it back on the road.

[mikepmcs]

Mike,
I'm not too sure how insurance companies work in Maine, or which ones you've had to deal with, but that is FAR from the truth from my experience. And I have DAILY experience.

Bill,
I respect your opinion/experience, but I'm sticking with what I said on this one.  I also do this on a daily basis. ie: getting raped by insurance companies after I myself have written a fair estimate for damage and then having them try to lowball me and in turn try to hurt the customer because they don't want to get the right amount of parts to do the job in the first place.  Then, we have to get creative to get the job done and still come within the ahum...agreed price with the insurance company(actually it's take it or leave it in some cases, but we have to take it just to get the work)
Sad thing is the customer hurts in the end. Luckily for the customers in this area(winthrop maine),the owner of this shop is well known and is such a nice guy that he takes care of people to a fault and will most likely fold here pretty soon because the shop makes no money.(another story all together)
Anyway, Insurance companies want to save a buck, bottom line, and will pay the least possible in any case.

I maintain that metlife should have been the only insurance company involved at the start, and should have gone off book value to fix this car.  American Collector(in this case) should only have been involved, IMO, if the guy who hit him did not have insurance or metlife was coming in way too low.

As far as having a no nothing adjuster come out, that is where the body shop gets involved IMO(most body shop owners at least have an idea what it takes to fix a classic and have a good idea of their worth). We have no problem calling insurance companies or whomever and making the adjuster come back out after their initial estimate and walking them through another round if you will, pointing out obvious and not so obvious things they have missed.
We just did an 07 Impala SS, a couple months ago, that the original estimate was in the 5k range. After we chuckled a little and called State Farm, in this case, the second round came out to over $10k.  The body shop just has to go to bat for the customer is all.  I suppose you can look at it as the body shop is trying to make more money, but I assure you that is not the case with us.  Most of it was parts, which really does us no good in the long run.  We were just looking out for our customer.  Hopefully DKN's body shop will fight for him as well.

His car should be fixed regardless of cost with no money out of his pocket and metlife should foot the cost up to the at fault party's limitation if need be.
Average retail on a base model 318 68 is $15,800.

And if they still want to total it, buy it back get the check and I assure you, the body shop can save your ride for an agreed price.  They want your business as well.

I'm calling Joe Bornstein. 

v/r
Mike

[dkn1997]

I got a rude message on my vm from the metlife guy that they are declaring the car a total loss.  I called the claims rep and asked what they determined the value of the car was. She didn't know, she just said it's totalled based on what the adjuster said.  the same fool who said it's worth 10K.  so much for his assertion that he doesn't determine value and it's done by a service!  they are now handing it off to a total loss something or other and he will call me next week.  I'm waiting to hear from him and that's where the lines in the sand will be drawn. 

[Charger-Bodie]

.....And all of this IMO is why I would have turned it in to My own ins. co. and let them duke it out.

The only problem with that in this case is the low amount of coverage.

By the way people I deal with ins adjusters everyday, and for the most part they are all VERY easy to get along with. There are some Companies that are really bad to deal with, but MOST are very easy. You right a good estimate , with everything itemized and they usually have no problem just going right off of my est. It is very helpful to be using the right brand of estimate software (Audatex Estimating) in my case ,cause thats one of the most common programs and alot of the adjusters also use it.

In my opinion youre deal would have been a piece of cake if it whernt for the coverage amount on the car.

It could get tough to get them to pay more than 9500.00 if thats what you have it insured for.

[dkn1997]

It could get tough to get them to pay more than 9500.00 if thats what you have it insured for.

I have no plans to try and get AC to pay more.  Contrary to what at least one member accused me of, I am not "renegging"  I made my bed and I will lay in it....sure, I'll complain about it a little, and I think it's fair to try and get metlife to fix my car since it's thier insured's fault...but if I come up short in that effort, I will let AC total out the car and pay me what we agreed to.  We are not that far off.  The repair is in the neighborhood of 10K.  Since I have decided to fix the grill myself, and that a restored grill was about 30% of the parts budget, I should be ok.  If I'm out of pocket 1 or 2K, I will live with it.  But I'm going to do everything I can do to avoid that.

[dkn1997]

I just poked around online.  without the grill, it's about 1500 in parts I need. so round that up to 3 grand and that should cover the parts.   I don't want to fix this myself, but if I have to, I will.  I am not losing my car over this.  I do anticipate being off the road for a long time if the insurance decides to get cute and not pay me. 

I posted that on 11/2.  amazing what changes 13 days of research will yield.  that 1500 turned into 6 grand fast!!  lol!!

[hemi-hampton]

I wonder if this Scenario could happen, They consider totalled & give you $10,000. Then they take car & Auction as is for $10,000. They then get their money back. LEON.

[dkn1997]

I wonder if this Scenario could happen, They consider totalled & give you $10,000. Then they take car & Auction as is for $10,000. They then get their money back. LEON.

I'd see to it that the car wouldn't be worth 10 cents if they tried a stunt like that.  they would end up auctioning off the ahstray because i'd rather slide down a 60 foot razor blade on my balls and land in a bucket of iodine rather than let some grubby insurance company get their hands on my baby.   

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

i'd rather slide down a 60 foot razor blade on my balls and land in a bucket of iodine

Sweet jeebus man!  that was a picture I didnt need to paint

[Tilar]

I wouldn't settle for less than what it takes to repair the car or what average value for one like it is. Period. Threaten court action against them and the driver for insufficient insurance. They are not limited to the value you had between you and your insurance company. They have to go by average value of a car in the same condition yours was in. Don't settle for less.

[Troy]

Forgive me for sounding ignorant of the issues but I thought the reason we buy special "classic car" insurance was to protect ourselves from "normal" insurance companies who aren't as in-touch with the values of our cars? To most of them, any car over 10 years old should be totaled out in any sort of hard impact. Tell them you want an exact replacement (not a check) if they plan on totaling your car. That's still not ideal since most of us are attached to our cars (not just any car like ours) and the sentimental value should be enough to repair the original. There's no way the other driver's insurance should be able to total your car based one a the opinion of someone with little or no experience with classic cars. That is where your insurance should step in, make you "whole", and then go after the other insurance company to recover their losses. If it doesn't work that way then I'll be a whole lot less likely to drive my cars in the future if I have to rely on other driver's insurance to replace my babies. Too many clueless idiots on the road for me to take chances like that.

Troy

[The70RT]

 They shouldn't even have to know what value you had it insured for. You could always say I have done lots of work to it and haven't upgraded. Hell tell them you couldn't afford to go a higher premium right now. I have been offered amounts before and turned them down. They will eventually come around if you stand your ground. They know what your car is worth. They will low ball anyone that lets them.

[dkn1997]

Forgive me for sounding ignorant of the issues but I thought the reason we buy special "classic car" insurance was to protect ourselves from "normal" insurance companies who aren't as in-touch with the values of our cars? To most of them, any car over 10 years old should be totaled out in any sort of hard impact. Tell them you want an exact replacement (not a check) if they plan on totaling your car. That's still not ideal since most of us are attached to our cars (not just any car like ours) and the sentimental value should be enough to repair the original. There's no way the other driver's insurance should be able to total your car based one a the opinion of someone with little or no experience with classic cars. That is where your insurance should step in, make you "whole", and then go after the other insurance company to recover their losses. If it doesn't work that way then I'll be a whole lot less likely to drive my cars in the future if I have to rely on other driver's insurance to replace my babies. Too many clueless idiots on the road for me to take chances like that.

Troy

I'm right with you and I have to say, aside from a slighly surly adjuster, AC has been very accomodating.  I'm the one in the wrong as far as the coverage goes.  Had I updated it properly through the years, this thread would have ended at page 1 with me getting a check to repair the car.  My point is learn from my mistake and don't put yourself in the position of having to argue with ignorant fools about the value of your car.  I wouldn't expect anyone who's not a car guy to understand the value of my car, my beef with metlife is that, so far, they look like they are too stupid to know that they don't know.   I hope that this total loss specialist or whoever is smart enough to get the help he needs to understand something he doesn't know already.  So far, the people at metlife have been clueless, but i am expecting a call from the total loss specialist on monday.  If he won't listen to reason, I will then try the supervisor of the original adjuster, then the supervisor of the woman who's handling the claim on the office end. 

[tan top]

just seen this thread , don't konw how i missed  this    ...damn sorry to see this Dude !  ....  lucky you fitted them 3 poit belts !!! & know one was hurt !
insurance companys always try to riggle , but are quick enough to take your money ..... look forward to seeing progress pictures as & when 

[hemi-hampton]

Lets say for example you got a $30,000 (or 20k) car with $10,000  of Damage. In this case car is not considered totalled. (Metlife should not know total value given to your other insurance but they porobably do)BUT, As far as the clueless METLIFE new car specialist are concerned you got a $10,000 car with $10,000 worth of damage so considered totalled by them, the clueless making this descision for you. Maybe you'll need a current appaisal but may be hard to due considering damage? LEON.

[firefighter3931]

Kevin, why not bring in a specialized appraiser as Hemi Hampton has suggested. Hopefully you have some recent pics of the car before the accident. Let the classic car appraiser decide how much the car is worth. 

The fact that your coverage is $9500 is inconsequential because this is not an "at-fault" accident. 



Ron