hemigeno's Daytona restoration - a few more tweaks... again!

[hemigeno]

The nosecone was not mounted on the car in April, and they were still massaging everything to suit their picky standards.  I don't remember if I've mentioned this little tidbit or not, but in the third picture you can see what looks like an unfinished seam.  In fact, that's exactly what it was.  The nosecones were essentially made of pieces that were joined together and then leaded in.  The top sides of the nosecones had a lot more filler/lead work done on them, but about 1/4 of the way down on the bottomside they just quit filling in the big gap between the L/R pieces and the center section.  It would have looked a little better if they'd have kept going, but that's how they did the originals so that's what we're doing now.

[hemigeno]

The first two pictures are of the wing components, which were being filled/blocked/sanded for the umpteenth time.  The last two pictures are of the '69 R/T SE sunroof car that is patiently awaiting its turn.  As you can see, it's back from the sand & media blaster's shop and the car is pretty solid - no, check that - VERY solid from a sheet metal standpoint.

[hemigeno]

Last batch for now, although I still have another batch of pics from my May visit queued up - they still need to be resized and grouped though...

I took these last three pictures to cheer me up after seeing how solid that sunroof car is.  This is a 3rd Gen Charger that a guy is having Vance repair.  IIRC the car is not necessarily rare, and the owner is undoubtedly going to drop some serious coin to repair the sheet metal.  Lots-o-Swiss visible, and I didn't even look that closely. 

To each his own, I suppose...

[The70RT]

  Nice detailed pics 

[charger01]

Makin it so easy for all of us..... Love the detail..

[tan top]

    taking shape now Geno      that dude is doing awesome work  ..

[BigBlockSam]

wow! 

[69_500]

Gene I don't remember what month it was when I made the last trip up there with you, but if you lost any photo's of that trip, I still have copies of the ones I took that day. Which includes about 10-15 of the front chin spoiler.

Car is starting to take shape now Gene. I really wanna make another trip up to see the car as its getting closer to paint, and even maybe during reassembly. Actually I wanna bring up the video camera and do some shooting on the car.

[hemi68charger]

Geno,,
What a thrill to see paint !!!!!!  I can't wait to see paint back on my '68 again within the month..... It'll mean you-know-what.............

Looking fantastic........................

Troy

[XXHEMI]

Looks good Geno!

[PocketThunder]

Whats the status Geno?   

[hemigeno]

Well, not much movement at the moment.  I've been scrambling around to try and find a supplier for flat rubber material to make the air seals that surround the radiator, K-frame, etc.  It's been a struggle.  I was very hopeful in my dealings with one manufacturer's rep for about 2-1/2 months, just for the guy to finally come back and tell me he can't make what we need.  They had done some chemical analysis work on a sample of the original rubber material, but did not derive the exact formulation.  I think they stopped analyzing when they realized the sample had asbestos in it  As it turns out, he knew all along that he could not make a close reproduction, but was hoping he could make something we'd like anyway.  He definitely didn't know me very well...

Vance had a lead on some decent material a while back that he had quit chasing, when my lead seemed as promising as it did.  He's planning to start looking for that material again.  If he can find that stuff, we will have something that looks really, really good but might be just a tad more flexible than the originals.  I'm still trying to find another manufacturer on my own, just in case Vance hits a dead end in his search.  Between the two of us, we should eventually find something.  The question is:  How long will that search take?   

There is also still a question about how hard the original rubber seals were.  All the original pieces found (whether on a car or NOS) are approaching 40 years old.  Rubber, by nature, gets harder with age - and that aging process starts as soon as the material is initially cured.  Sooo, the people who swear up and down that the original pieces should be rock hard could be basing their assumptions on material that is significantly harder than it was when first installed.  In other words, we may be trying to search for material that is actually well past the hardness/stiffness of the rubber which Creative Industries worked with.

I still have pictures from May/June/July to post up, but they honestly don't look all that different than what you see.  It's been so busy around the office here that I've not taken the time to organize the pics or write up captions for them.  I'll try to do so soon...

BTW, thanks again everyone...

[Moparmatty]

Is Dayclona's kit not correct Gene?

[hemigeno]

Is Dayclona's kit not correct Gene?

I could not tell you firsthand.  Any comments I could make about them are merely heresay, so I'll leave that subject alone.    I did purchase a set from Dale's Cuda Shop, and they're not even remotely close to being correct (apart from the general shape of the pieces).  We also tried a Pontiac vendor who supposedly had a similar product sold in full sheet form, but it too was pretty sad looking in comparison to the originals.

Right now, the nosecone is installed utilizing seals that were made from a matting material used by a local machine shop.  It's not horrible looking, and beats all of the repro materials that either Vance or I have seen.  Both Vance and I are holding out for something better-looking yet, and he has a sample of material made in 2007 that is dead-nuts correct from a color, texture, thickness, look & feel standpoint.  The only questionable part about this particular sample is that it has a durometer reading around 77-79, and we are (or were) shooting for a mid 80s reading.  If we want to use that material, we will need to track down the original manufacturer - which Vance was attempting to do in late spring.

The nosecone will be removed whenever we get a better rubber material, so that the seals can be replaced with the most correct-looking material we can find.

[Aero426]

When you talk about asbestos, the lower K-frame diaper on the Superbird strikes me as it could be of the same material.   It's flexible, but always has been relatively stiff.  Mine is not a black soft rubber, but more of a tan color. 

[WingCharger]

They had asbestos?!?

I thought they were solid rubber?

[moparstuart]

  mine cinda felt more like a tar paper ?  best picture i could find
   thats why my engine failed got cancer from the asbestos     

[hemigeno]

The seals were 1/8" thich rubber, but with a fibrous material embedded into the rubber.  If you break a piece in half, you can see the fibers sticking out (I know, since I've done this to see for myself).  Some of the pieces also show fibers sticking out of the surface as well, giving the seal a speckled look.  This whole timeperiod is right when the rubber industry went away from asbestos fibers, but it's very likely the fibers are indeed asbestos.

Best we can tell, the K-frame material is similar to the air seals.  Whether it is exactly the same, who knows?  The K-frame seal had to span a longer distance, since it was secured with (IIRC) six clips.  A stiffer material would work better, but I don't know if Creative went looking for a different material for this specific piece or not.  I have some paperwork that shows Creative was responsible for die-cutting the seals themselves, but so far I've found no mention of the rubber material used.  There is one Material Standard number that I found reference to, but I think it is very generic in nature and doesn't give an exact specification.  Incidentally, the same M.S. number is used for all the seals, including the K-member seal.

mine cinda felt more like a tar paper ? best picture i could find

The surface of the rubber seals does have about that same texture - it's certainly not smooth.  Way thicker though...

When you talk about asbestos, the lower K-frame diaper on the Superbird strikes me as it could be of the same material. It's flexible, but always has been relatively stiff. Mine is not a black soft rubber, but more of a tan color.

Doug, is the tan color throughout the seal material itself, or just on the surface?  I'm wondering if it discolored over time from road grime, etc., as well as having hardened/stiffened. 

I've debated about taking the material that looks really close, and throwing it in an oven for a few days at a fairly low temperature to see what it would do.  Whether my wife would believe me that it's just an Aerocar Shrinky-Dink is another story. 

[moparstuart]

 keep us updated on how the oven experiments and the wife come out   

[PocketThunder]

keep us updated on how the oven experiment and the wife come out   

shrinky dink,  man that takes me back to the 80's!   

[Aero426]

The K frame seal on the Bird is 1/8 thick and is the tan color throughout.    It has that kind of look that if you broke it that you would find fibers.   Like I said, it has always been very rigid, and it's been off the car since the mid 70's.  It was held on with speedometer clips. 

[BB1]

   I spy.

[nascarxx29]

Im not sure but wasnt that seal material called masticated rubber

http://www.thomasnet.com/products/masticated-rubber-69431559-1.html

[moparstuart]

good places to start looking

[440mop]

Probably been mentioned before but has anyone got experiance with this vendor?
http://www.alliancelink.com/users/joshsdodge/start.html
I haven't used them myself but I do need a set for the Daytona