Converting our collector cars to Propane?

[1969chargerrtse]

I had heard running a car on propane brings the price to about 2.50 cents per gallon?  Anyone have any converstion information or know if we can do it with our big 440 motors?  Cruising is important to me, I'd seriously consider a change over, my carb sucks anyway.   

[dodgecharger-fan]

Interesting thought.

Intrigued, I did a quick google and came up with this site that seems to be loaded with info. and they sell universal conversion kits.
http://poweredbypropane.net/index.html

I'll have to do some more reading to know how well it'll work - and my first question will be: Do I need fuel injectors to do this?

[Back N Black]

You don't need Injectors, it fit on top just like the carb. It burns really clean and helps prolong engine life.I use to work on them allot, back in the early 90's. We had all of our civilian fleet with the Propane conversion. It suck trying to start it up in the winter time, but we would not have to worry about that.

[1969chargerrtse]

Interesting thought.

Intrigued, I did a quick google and came up with this site that seems to be loaded with info. and they sell universal conversion kits.
http://poweredbypropane.net/index.html

I'll have to do some more reading to know how well it'll work - and my first question will be: Do I need fuel injectors to do this?

Thanks, here's their info for v8's

8 Cylinder Conversion Kit 


Price: $1,400.00



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

not actual photo



This parts kit is universal therefore the installer may or may not need to fabricate mounting brackets depending on the application. This kit is designed for any 8 cylinder fuel injected vehicle that does not have throttle body fuel injection. This kit was not designed for vehicles with throttle body fuel injection.



Works with vehicles that have plastic intake manifolds.



Supports up to 355 Horse Power.








Contents:





1)     Reducer "Gold" + its support

2)     LPG Solenoid

3)     Nozzle connection between the reducer and the Solenoid

4)     (2) 4x1  Injection Rail

5)     ECU VERSUS KIT (with Absolute Map-sensor module)



6)     VERSUS ECU Installation KIT (part of ECU VERSUS KIT):

a)     Switch + horn signal

b)     Injection Rail temperature sensor

c)     Reducer's Temperature sensor

d)     Sub-pressure T-fitting

e)     Fuse + Fuse case

f)      Battery + 12 V connectors – 2 Units

g)     Female connectors – 8 Units

h)     Male connectors – 2 Units



7)     (2)Gaseous phase Filter 1-1 Outlet

a)      "Y"  fitting

     LPG Fuel Level gauge

9)     Sub-pressure nozzle to inlet manifold

10)   Injection Rail nozzle – 4 Units

11)   LPG Injection Rail outlet nozzle

12)   Versus ECU Interface

13)   Water Rubber Hose 16 mm. diameter – 1,5 meter

14)   LPG Rubber Hose 12 mm. diameter – 1 meter

15)   Sub-pressure Rubber Hose 4- 5 mm. diameter – 1,5 meter

16)   LPG Rubber Hose 5 mm. diameter – 1 meter

17)   Copper pipe support + fittings

18)   Metal clips

19)   Fastening/isolation elements

20)   "T-fitting" 16/16/16 mm connection – 2 Units

21)   Copper Tubing - 6 meters

[mikesbbody]

Pete (71beeman) runs his 71 super bee on lpg but he can run it on gas as well (its not lpg dedicated)

[Mike DC]

I wouldn't think propane would make the same HP-per-gallon as a gasoline motor would though.


All things considered, I think I would rather just do the traditional MPG mods to a gasoline motor & drivetrain.  It's not interesting but it's feasible and it works.



 

[1969chargerrtse]

Pete (71beeman) runs his 71 super bee on lpg but he can run it on gas as well (its not lpg dedicated)

Wow    Hopefully we can get comments from him. 

[chargerrt]

I wouldn't think propane would make the same HP-per-gallon as a gasoline motor would though.


All things considered, I think I would rather just do the traditional MPG mods to a gasoline motor & drivetrain.  It's not interesting but it's feasible and it works.



 

I don't know why you wouldn't get the same HP...it's a higher octane rating than any gas that you will get at the pump and it burns more efficiently.  There was a Chevelle on the Power Tour last year (I believe...) with a small block 427 that ran on propane.  I'm pretty sure it was making a somewhat streetable 1,000+ HP.  I'd like to do the propane conversion myself, but the problem is finding gas stations that have propane.....

[chargerrt]

I wouldn't think propane would make the same HP-per-gallon as a gasoline motor would though.


All things considered, I think I would rather just do the traditional MPG mods to a gasoline motor & drivetrain.  It's not interesting but it's feasible and it works.



 

I don't know why you wouldn't get the same HP...it's a higher octane rating than any gas that you will get at the pump and it burns more efficiently.  There was a Chevelle on the Power Tour last year (I believe...) with a small block 427 that ran on propane.  I'm pretty sure it was making a somewhat streetable 1,000+ HP.  I'd like to do the propane conversion myself, but the problem is finding gas stations that have propane.....

Actually...it was a 527.  Here's some more info on it.  I believe the company for the propane conversion stuff is somewhere in the article
http://www.autoblog.com/2007/10/31/sema-2007-1-000-hp-propane-chevelle-by-mothers/

[NMike]

propane has only 80% the BTU's of gas. all else being equal, propane makes less power.

however, you can up the compression because LPG is about 115octane. good for high compression motors. runs like fuel injection, no cold start(choke). you do need hardened exhaust seats, and big ugly tanks.

[69_500]

It will definitely work on a 440, it has already been done to a HEMI Charger.

Do a search on the site for the Propane X Charger 500.

 

[bordin34]

Didn't they also make a Propane X Daytona? I think I saw it on Cars in Barns once.

[mikesbbody]

Pete (71beeman) runs his 71 super bee on lpg but he can run it on gas as well (its not lpg dedicated)

Wow    Hopefully we can get comments form him. 

If you do a search for LPG you will probably find another thread on it (i seem to remember one) infact, at the time i thought it was a bad idea and even said so (sorry peter) but have since had second thoughts. I do know in australia the government gives you cash back to help with the cost of the conversion pete say's it drives fine and he gets good mileage when using the LPG.

[694spdRT]

My dad installed one on his 454 big block Chevy pickup back in the '70s during the last "gas" crisis. It was a system the allowed you to run either gas or LP if I remember correctly. I do remember as a young kid barely getting to a vacation down in Florida. The truck broke down and had to be towed 40 miles where the local Chevy dealer blamed it on the LP conversion kit.

Not long after that Dad traded it in on a slant six Dodge pickup.

The tanks are what I would be concerned with on a Charger. There was plenty of room in the back of the pickup though.   

[nakita7]

I've owned 2 propane vehicles, absolutely love it! I have also seen 2 Mopars on propane, very cool, and yes, cheap to run. I hear all kinds of knocks on propane, I've NEVER been stranded from a propane vehicle. Less emissions, motor is way cleaner inside, runs just as good in my opinion. I've never had mine 'not start' in the winter. You have to maintain them (change the filter in the mixer regularly), and they run excellent. Get a conversion if you can find one and get it installed properly, and you will love it. I have absolutely nothing bad to say about propane, at all...

[duo-stripe]

Here in the Netherlands..gasprices get out of hand..we pay € 1.55 for a liter of 95 octane, that is about $ 9.30 a gallon!
a lot of guys in Holland drive there US cars on LPG but if it isn't set up properly it will lean out and burn the valves; the valveseats wear extensively and it is not very healthy for the pistonrings either..
so..i drive my cars on 95-98 octane..it'll cost a little more but it won't hurt the engine.
i'd rather drive a little less miles with a healthy engine than fry it up with lpg.
but that is my honest opinion.

Grtz Marcel

[MoParJW]

My car runs on propane, it's less than half the price of gasoline over here in Holland

If it still ran on gasoline I wouldn't be able to drive it as much as I do now.
And I just love to make long distance cruises

[69_500]

Didn't they also make a Propane X Daytona? I think I saw it on Cars in Barns once.

Don't recall a Propane X Daytona, but there was a Cal Gas Daytona.

[1969chargerrtse]

My car runs on propane, it's less than half the price of gasoline over here in Holland

If it still ran on gasoline I wouldn't be able to drive it as much as I do now.
And I just love to make long distance cruises

Can we get a link of the manufacture?

[MoParJW]

My car runs on propane, it's less than half the price of gasoline over here in Holland

If it still ran on gasoline I wouldn't be able to drive it as much as I do now.
And I just love to make long distance cruises

Can we get a link of the manufacture?

Its a custom built system done by the previous owner.
Over here there are lots of shops that build propane systems, can't give you any info on complete kits, sorry 

[71 Bee Man]

I had heard running a car on propane brings the price to about 2.50 cents per gallon?  Anyone have any converstion information or know if we can do it with our big 440 motors?  Cruising is important to me, I'd seriously consider a change over, my carb sucks anyway.   

I know it's probably not much use to you, but I have posted on here in the past about how my 383 71 Bee is running on L.P.G (Liquified Petroleum Gas) here in Australia.

The problem guys from over your way commented on was the fact that Propane apparently isn't very economical in the States.

here in Australia at the moment, normal gasoline is about $6.50 - $7 per gallon. It was $1.65 this week per litre. L.P.G on the other hand is currently 62 CENTS per litre ( roughly $2.40 per gallon). It is actually cheaper for me to run my 383 Dodge than it is to run my petrol driven 4 cylinder Mitsubishi. And here's the clincher.......here in Australia the Government actually gives you $2000 back on the cost of a conversion (which costs around $2,700). How good is that ?

Here our L.P.G is a blend of Propane and Butane, and is specifically for automotive use. I find that the car drives great on it, and while you do use a little more L.P.G than petrol, who cares when the price is what it is. Also, there is a slight power drop, but again - if I'm cruising to a car show 7 hours away I save heaps, and if you want power you just flick the switch back over to petrol.

Peter
Sydney, Australia.

[1969chargerrtse]

I had heard running a car on propane brings the price to about 2.50 cents per gallon?  Anyone have any converstion information or know if we can do it with our big 440 motors?  Cruising is important to me, I'd seriously consider a change over, my carb sucks anyway.   

I know it's probably not much use to you, but I have posted on here in the past about how my 383 71 Bee is running on L.P.G (Liquified Petroleum Gas) here in Australia.

The problem guys from over your way commented on was the fact that Propane apparently isn't very economical in the States.

here in Australia at the moment, normal gasoline is about $6.50 - $7 per gallon. It was $1.65 this week per litre. L.P.G on the other hand is currently 62 CENTS per litre ( roughly $2.40 per gallon). It is actually cheaper for me to run my 383 Dodge than it is to run my petrol driven 4 cylinder Mitsubishi. And here's the clincher.......here in Australia the Government actually gives you $2000 back on the cost of a conversion (which costs around $2,700). How good is that ?

Here our L.P.G is a blend of Propane and Butane, and is specifically for automotive use. I find that the car drives great on it, and while you do use a little more L.P.G than petrol, who cares when the price is what it is. Also, there is a slight power drop, but again - if I'm cruising to a car show 7 hours away I save heaps, and if you want power you just flick the switch back over to petrol.

Peter
Sydney, Australia.

Great info, thanks for the US conversion info also.  Any idea of manufacture and web address?

[0X01B8]

Here our L.P.G is a blend of Propane and Butane, and is specifically for automotive use. I find that the car drives great on it, and while you do use a little more L.P.G than petrol, who cares when the price is what it is. Also, there is a slight power drop, but again - if I'm cruising to a car show 7 hours away I save heaps, and if you want power you just flick the switch back over to petrol.

Thanks, that doesn't sound so bad actually.  When I hear about alternatives I immediately think it's gonna pretty much turn my car into a golf cart.  Half the fun of the Charger is that it goes "vrrrooom" when you step on the gas and it sounds, well, like a big motor.      I'm assuming LPG doesn't alter the exhaust sound, or does it?   

[71 Bee Man]

Here our L.P.G is a blend of Propane and Butane, and is specifically for automotive use. I find that the car drives great on it, and while you do use a little more L.P.G than petrol, who cares when the price is what it is. Also, there is a slight power drop, but again - if I'm cruising to a car show 7 hours away I save heaps, and if you want power you just flick the switch back over to petrol.

Thanks, that doesn't sound so bad actually.  When I hear about alternatives I immediately think it's gonna pretty much turn my car into a golf cart.  Half the fun of the Charger is that it goes "vrrrooom" when you step on the gas and it sounds, well, like a big motor.      I'm assuming LPG doesn't alter the exhaust sound, or does it?   

The sound is still great. The car runs great - it just doesn't have the "kick" that normal petrol (gasoline) has. But you know what ? I don't care at all. the cost saving and the fact that I get to use my car whever I feel like it make it more than worthwhile.

I have a friend down here who says to me "Yeah, but I want to be able to lay some rubber when I want to". Truth is I could still spin 'em if i want to, but the truth is I generally just drive my car because I enjoy being in it. Here's the clincher - last week it cost hime well over $100 to fill his tank............mine cost $40.

I jump in my car whenever I feel like it. i take the kids to school, go for a coffee......just drive it when i want. Is it worth the ever so slight drop in performance ? You betcha.

As i said earlier though, i know it's different over there with regards to cost and quality of gas (Propane). Do some research though, and I'm sure if it's financially viable for you, you won't regret it. My car loves running on the L.P.G.

Peter 
Sydney, Australia.

[dodgecharger-fan]

Great topic.

Does anyone have any experience with Natural Gas conversions and driving vehicles using NVG?

It's somewhat appealing because I can get an appliance installed at home that would allow me to fill up the vehicle from the same pipe that provides heating fuel for the house.

I expect to get varying answers on this one due to the widely varying costs and acceptance levels of NVG. It's true that in some places natural gas is just not used as a residential heating fuel because there are less expensive options available in the area, but that's what we've got here.