Which is a Better Engine?

[BlaineKaiser450]

im evenutually gonna put a hemi crate motor into a 68-70 charger, but 1st i gotta find a charger in my budget that would be a good cantadate (sp?)

[firefighter3931]

Hemis were actually at 550.

Hemi's were 425...with a bit of tuning, they could hit 440-450hp....not 550

Yep, getting 440-450 HP out of a stock Hemi was pretty good back in the day.....and required lots of tuning with the carbs and ignition curve. The mild cam that was used to detune the street engines really mellowed them out. 


Ron

[Troy]

im evenutually gonna put a hemi crate motor into a 68-70 charger, but 1st i gotta find a charger in my budget that would be a good cantadate (sp?)

The words "Hemi" and "budget" do not belong in the same sentence. Seriously, many guys here have less in their entire car than what it costs to build and install a Hemi (I'm one of them). I sold off most all of my Hemi parts and decided I'd rather have a second car (ok, sixth car). It can be done, but it's a heck of a lot harder of you're pinching pennies.

Troy

[SmashingPunkFan]

Okay.

Well in your opinion, what is the BEST engine available for this ride?
I would go for a 440


Replacing parts difficulty? like are they hard to find?
440s should be too hard to find stuff for. Hemis are wayyy harder. For a pair of repro Hemi valve covers..its about 900. For a used Hemi air cleaner...they can go anywhere from 800-1800.

And where can you order one at? Like a 426 Hemi?
You can not order a 426 Hemi. You would have to get lucky to find a used one for sale...but you would be paying an arm and a leg for it.

Or do you have to find them?, or can you still order crate engines for them?
Various companys sell them. Just do a search on google for Mopar crate engines. And yes, you can order a variety of sizes of crate engines.



Tahnk you! 

Cool. Do you by chance have a site you would recommend? for repro parts? etc?

I found this site for metal replacement parts etc... http://autometaldirect.com/index.php

Thank you all!!   

[Rolling_Thunder]

most people who think the hemi made 550hp are confusing the street hemi with the race hemi...     I think if the street hemi had the same wicked cam the race hemi did with tuning it could make close to 550

[SmashingPunkFan]

Anyone know of any good sites for Charger parts?

Thanx

PEACE.

[Brock Samson]

as i told you via PM your gonna need to do a lot of reading on this site using the search function, but stay away from the off topic and the comedy section cause the guys who post there are freakin nuts. 

[Ghoste]

And merciless.

[69bronzeT5]

but stay away from the off topic and the comedy section cause the guys who post there are freakin nuts. 

Have you looked at your stats lately Dave

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[mally69]

69bronzeT5
Old Timer

Posts: 5,325




Beware of the post whore........

[Jon Smith]

If hemis really made 550 horsepower then why didn't they go any quicker than 13s at best?
60s HP figures are all over the place... the introduction of SAE horsepower in 72 was probably an attempt o set a standard

[mally69]

If hemis really made 550 horsepower then why didn't they go any quicker than 13s at best?
60s HP figures are all over the place... the introduction of SAE horsepower in 72 was probably an attempt o set a standard

good point, but I beleive there is a guy either here or moparts that has a stock hemi that is turning high 12's ..

[superduperbee]

most people who think the hemi made 550hp are confusing the street hemi with the race hemi...     I think if the street hemi had the same wicked cam the race hemi did with tuning it could make close to 550

One of my buddys picked up an original unrestored 65 Hemi Coronet S/S with aluminum front end and race hemi. Engine dynoed right around 600 hp before sending off for rebuild.

[Death1970Proof]

I agree with lots said here. Keep in mind for the price of a hemi you can have a SICK fast 440 that would eat a hemi.  Or get a 400 block and stroke it to a 451 and be a little lighter than a 440. Probably best bang for the buck there. The 383 and 400's are much stronger in the main webs as well. There's a ton of options but as far as hemi goes Id forget about obtaining one, to expensive along with any part that goes on them.

Want a screamin high winding powerhouse?? How about a 383 with a nice solid cam and a set of Indy heads 

I may get flogged for this as well, but I happen to be a small block guy. They are the way to go for less weight on the front end (better handling)and you can use a beefed 904 instead of the 727. 727's takes close to 50hp to turn. 904's take about 25hp. 318's which are usually give away engines (Free if you move them!)  can be punched/stroked to 390 cubes. Or how about a 360 pushing 408 cubes 

Just my 

[SmashingPunkFan]

They are the way to go for less weight on the front end (better handling)and you can use a beefed 904 instead of the 727. 727's takes close to 50hp to turn. 904's take about 25hp.

I'm sorry, and I'll say again. I'm fairly new to Chargers, I love them, and what to know ALL that I can about them.
I don't mean to sound stupid, or have a stupid question, but you don't know unless you ask?.... and the best place to ask I've found so far is on here, cause you guys know TONS!!! 

But what is the difference between these Trannys?   
The 904? and the 727?
Like which is the 4spd?
Which of them is the manual tran?

I'm sorry, I feel stupid asking a question like this, but you got to ask to find out some how.

[Ghoste]

Not stupid.  904 was a lighter duty trans used behind smallblocks.  The 727 was heavier duty and used mainly behind big blocks although there was a smallblock version.  The 833 is the four speed.  There's more but consider that a basic.

[Death1970Proof]

They are the way to go for less weight on the front end (better handling)and you can use a beefed 904 instead of the 727. 727's takes close to 50hp to turn. 904's take about 25hp.

I'm sorry, and I'll say again. I'm fairly new to Chargers, I love them, and what to know ALL that I can about them.
I don't mean to sound stupid, or have a stupid question, but you don't know unless you ask?.... and the best place to ask I've found so far is on here, cause you guys know TONS!!! 

But what is the difference between these Trannys?   
The 904? and the 727?
Like which is the 4spd?
Which of them is the manual tran?

I'm sorry, I feel stupid asking a question like this, but you got to ask to find out some how.

Hey, No problem! We are here to help! We didnt know what we know without asking somebody!

The 904 is the standard duty automatic commonly used behind 318 powered cars. Not as strong as a 727 stock but it can be beefed up to be everybit as strong or stronger than a 727. Only takes about half the power to turn also. The 904 has a shorther tailshaft than the 727. A 904 will not fit behind a big block...

If you have a big block car with an automatic, It's a 727. There are two basic versions. One was used behind small blocks and the other was for big blocks.  The difference being the bb trans of course has a larger bellhousing than the sb trans. The guts are fully interchangeable between the two however. To my knowledge all 340 cars were equipped with the 727 trans to handle the extra power they produced. Some 318' vehicles did use the 727 in heavy duty applications such as trucks,vans,taxi's,and 4x4's trucks as well. Many 360' vehicles had the 727 as well. My old '76 plymouth fury patrol car had a 360/727 in it. Of course the tail shaft length is longer than the 904. The 727 is considered by many to be the toughest trans made. 

As far as four speeds go you had a few. You had a basic A833 4 speed that had a 23 spline input. Some '69 mopars used an 833 that used a larger clutch if I can recall which I believe were used in the hemi cars and 69.5 superbee's and roadrunners w/ the 440 six pack. Someone will have to chime in here and help but I  believe it was an 18 spline unit that had an 11 inch clutch to where the other trans used a 10.5 clutch.  Some cars used a 3 speed trans as well which I think was called an A230. In the mid 70's there was an a833 overdrive trans released as well. Great for economy but many would dislike them for performane because of the gap between the gears. Just  Hope this helps...

[SmashingPunkFan]

Cool, thanks you guys for the help!!

But hey, if anyone else wants to add what they think, then do


So, I think I may have this. I'm wanting to get a 1970 Dodge Charger R/T, if I find one in whatever condition it may be
To run through the options, I have what choices a for a manual transmission?

Because I've decided that's the tranny I want. Automatic is what most of them seem to already have, so... 


Thanks again guys, this is the one place I've learned the most about Chargers. Big help, really big help.

[Ghoste]

If you want an RT, it means it came stock with a 440 (the 440 Six Pack and the 426 Street Hemi were both optional in the RT) and this defaults to a 727 if it's an automatic or an 833 if it's a four speed.  Those were the only two transmission choices for the RT.

[SmashingPunkFan]

Awesome.

So 833, and the 727 are the onlyTransmissions for the R/T. Cool.

Thanks! 

[mally69]

Also, don't fear having an auto. The 727 is a bulletproof tranny, and also with the correct stall convertor etc.. can make the car hook up and be way more consistent if you take it to the track. 4 speeds are just cool and fun to drive but also put alot more stress on drive line parts..

[SmashingPunkFan]

Yeah, auto's are cool, but I feel like when your gonna be driving that much HP, you need COMPLETE CONTROL over the engine.

I've driven both. The only time when I like auto, is when theres a lot of other people in the car. But manny is just... I don't know... it's like your holding the engine in the palm of your hands.


I'm just gonna have to look for tranny parts then.


Thanks again!

[SmashingPunkFan]

Oh... I'm sorry, but another stupid question emerges from me again.

Okay, I found a website that sales brand new crate Hemi 426s http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/426hemcratmo.html


Here's the question, crate trannys? is it possible?

any places maybe even selling used rebuilt ones?

Just curious, cause I'm really thinking about going for the 833...

[Ghoste]

For a manual try Brewers or Passon, they both sell rebuild four speeds.  For rebuilt automatics there are a large number of suppliers.  No "crate" tranny's as far as I think you mean (new cases etc.), just rebuilt.

[SmashingPunkFan]

Okay, cool.



Thanks!