What's this tell you about the need for reproducing grill parts?

[bull]

It ended with a $305 bid for the right side and a $185 bid for the left. I hope Premiere Plastics gets its ducks in a row soon. I could eventually use one of each.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=006&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=160184739539&rd=1

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=006&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=160184738169&rd=1

[terrible one]

  Another thing I'm glad to already have. . .

[skip68]

That sucks.     Supply & demand.  I too am glad I don't really need anything.

[MM1R/T]

I was watching those auctions, too. Had a feeling that they were going to go that way.

I hope that SOMEONE (BE/A, perhaps?) repros these soon. The demand is obviously there.

[bill440rt]

I saw the photos in a recent thread about the repro '70 grilles, & I must say I'm a bit disappointed. There are several major flaws the clearly distinguish them from an original. Why go thru the trouble repro-ing a part only to do it incorrectly? Doesn't it take just as much time to do it right? 

[Troy]

Those have good tips on them which probably explains the price. The ads didn't mention whether the stop tabs on the headlight doors were intact as well.

I saw the photos in a recent thread about the repro '70 grilles, & I must say I'm a bit disappointed. There are several major flaws the clearly distinguish them from an original. Why go thru the trouble repro-ing a part only to do it incorrectly? Doesn't it take just as much time to do it right? 

I have asked that question sooooo many times....

Sadly, the simple answer is that most consumers don't care. Basically, most consumers are cheap and will buy an incorrect part that costs less to make than a perfect replica that cost more to make simply because they are missing the part completely and need something to fill the hole and get their car on the road. A smaller group really isn't concerned about having a part number (especially if it's usually hidden once installed) but they do care about fitment/looks. The smallest group wants an exact duplicate and can afford it. However, these guys will generally buy NOS if they can find it. Manufacturers have to balance quality/price with the likely number of parts they can sell. Plus, most can't afford to keep a massive amount of inventory on the shelves from huge production runs even though the cost per piece would be lower. As far as I know, none of the plastic grills available are made the way the factory did it and the quality (or lack of it) is evident. To do them correctly would cost too much - effectively pricing them out of the market.

Troy

[bill440rt]

A thicker mounting tab is one thing, but to have grille openings that are completely smoothed over and filled in is another. Someone who is restoring a '70 Charger and wants to replace the grille, a prominent part of the car, is more inclined to buy a correct part vs an incorrect repro. They already made the holes in the center part of the grille, why not hollow out the holes around the outer edges? How much additional tooling would that really be? How much would it really affect the final price? Even if the part is $100-$150 more because of this modification, their sales of these parts would increase, no doubt.
Most consumers, especially Charger owners, are gonna be disappointed with these grilles. The biggest gripe among Mopar owners is not the lack of repro parts, but the lack of QUALITY repro parts.

[Troy]

I agree and that's been my argument all along. Of course, I'm not making any of this stuff so we're at the mercy of the people who are. A perfect example is the rear valence corners. They have to go through the exact same stamping/bending processes whether they are the right size or the wrong size. So why make them wrong? It has to be cheaper for the consumer in the end to weld on a correctly fitting part than to do hours of body work to get it right. Another good example would be most woodgrain decals since the printing process is identical for correct colors. It literally costs the same amount to do it right! Plastic parts seem to have poorer quality than metal or fabric but maybe that's just my experience.

Troy

[bull]

Another thing I'm glad to already have. . .

I got lucky a while back and picked up a grill from a craigslist seller that is complete, otherwise I'd be screwed. What's cool is even though the grill was broken the guy had the wherewithal to save all the pieces so they can be reattached. I'm hoping to get my hands on a pair of good ends to repair my other grill, but at $490 plus shipping for a pair of used ones I can hardly justify it right now.

[68RT4ME]

Why these companies call some of this stuff "Reproduction" is beyond me. A reproduction should be just that. A part reproduced to look exactly like the original otherwise, it's just "similar". It just tells me they are out to make a quick buck and aren't interested in getting the details right. Then they wonder why sales are low. 

[JimShine]

I am not up on what Premier Plastics status is, but here was my correspondance with them this past summer about the headlight door sections:

Good Afternoon James,

The buckets are $100 each and the doors are $40 each. Shipping without knowing your zip will be roughly $23. Please let me know if I can be of further assistance, thank you.

Best Regards,
Angela

James Shine <jimshine@jimshine.com> wrote:
Hello Angela, I am interested in buying the passenger side bucket and maybe even the door. Let me know the details.

Thanks!
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Sexton
To: James Shine
Sent: Monday, August 27, 2007 6:01 PM
Subject: Re: Charger grille


Hello Jim,

Yes they are. Please let me know if you have any questions, thank you.

Best Regards,
Angela

James Shine <jimshine@jimshine.com> wrote:
Hello, are the 1968-9 headlight door buckets available yet?

Thanks!

Jim

[bull]

Jim, there have been some issues:

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,36149.0.html

[Charger_Fan]

I saw the photos in a recent thread about the repro '70 grilles, & I must say I'm a bit disappointed.

These are the photos you're talking about, yes?
http://1970chargerregistry.com/70messageboard/viewtopic.php?t=4400

[Mike DC]

If PP keeps the idea out there that the grille items are "already done" but it never get there year afer year, we could be worse off than if they'd never gotten into the game in the first place. 

I'd love for them to make it happen and I'd spend money with them if they did.
But at some point, they need to either sh*t or get off the pot.   

[69_500]

Hmmm, maybe its time to break some of those spare grille's out of the attic. Last time I was up there I had 14. Only one of them is in perfect condition, and about 6 of them are really just for parts, but if anyone needs one let me know. The 500 doesn't use the same grill so there is really no reason to keep them for me anyways. 2 of them even have the whole frame work and hoses and canisters.

[bill440rt]

I saw the photos in a recent thread about the repro '70 grilles, & I must say I'm a bit disappointed.

These are the photos you're talking about, yes?
http://1970chargerregistry.com/70messageboard/viewtopic.php?t=4400

Yes, that's them. There are also no provisions for the side metal mounting brackets, either. Although it's better than a glued up jigsaw puzzle grille, it is still a quickie "cheapo" reproduction part. It fails to successfully fill the void needed for an accurate repro part.
Me no likey, & I wouldn't put one on any Charger I'd own.

[Red440]

I saw the photos in a recent thread about the repro '70 grilles, & I must say I'm a bit disappointed.

These are the photos you're talking about, yes?
http://1970chargerregistry.com/70messageboard/viewtopic.php?t=4400

Yes, that's them. There are also no provisions for the side metal mounting brackets, either. Although it's better than a glued up jigsaw puzzle grille, it is still a quickie "cheapo" reproduction part. It fails to successfully fill the void needed for an accurate repro part.
Me no likey, & I wouldn't put one on any Charger I'd own.

Since its my grille in the pictures, i feel the need to say something.

As i said in my original thread, if you are restoring to concourse condition, this grille is not for you, but for me that is not the plan. Another thing is that prior to the purchase i spent a lot of time on Ebay trying to score an original one. They usually ended up in the  $1000,- region and they were not always in that good condition. So i found the repro grille as good value for my money.    Sure they are not identical, but it works for me. 

[Charger_Fan]

That grille is definitely better than a badly cracked grille, or no grille. If the car is gonna be more of a driver, I would probably buy one of those too. After all, from 20 feet away, it would probably be pretty hard to tell the difference.

I was hoping the detail would have been better on them too, but for the reasons I stated above, I'd buy one.

[hemihead]

I find the problem with repro parts is that the orginal parts are very expensive so there is a demand for that part . Then when someone does repro it, the new part is just as much, if not more, expensive than the original. So then the part manufacturer says they can't sell enough so they won't make any more parts. I understand they have to make a profit, it is a business but do they have to make all their money back on the first sale ?
There are way too many greedy people in this hobby.

[dodgecharger-fan]

"What's this tell you about the need for reproducing grill parts? "

It tells me I got the short end of a good deal.   

And I mean that, it was still a good deal for me.
I traded a grille and a half for some parts. I thought I did well.

Somehow I didn't think used grilles were getting THAT much noney.
Still, I'm happy with what I got out of it.

[Mike DC]

Get less attached to having everything perfect and the whole thing becomes less of a problem. 
As long as it's bolt-on parts it can always be changed out later. 

[bill440rt]

I saw the photos in a recent thread about the repro '70 grilles, & I must say I'm a bit disappointed.

These are the photos you're talking about, yes?
http://1970chargerregistry.com/70messageboard/viewtopic.php?t=4400

Yes, that's them. There are also no provisions for the side metal mounting brackets, either. Although it's better than a glued up jigsaw puzzle grille, it is still a quickie "cheapo" reproduction part. It fails to successfully fill the void needed for an accurate repro part.
Me no likey, & I wouldn't put one on any Charger I'd own.

Since its my grille in the pictures, i feel the need to say something.

As i said in my original thread, if you are restoring to concourse condition, this grille is not for you, but for me that is not the plan. Another thing is that prior to the purchase i spent a lot of time on Ebay trying to score an original one. They usually ended up in the  $1000,- region and they were not always in that good condition. So i found the repro grille as good value for my money.    Sure they are not identical, but it works for me. 

Red440, my comments were in no way directed at you personally. I apologize if you felt that way. After being so excited to hear that someone was reproducing these grilles & then finding out that there are distinct differences in them from originals, I was very disappointed. If it works for you, great!
To me, that is a prominent part of a '70 Charger, & it simply would not suit my tastes. Different strokes for different folks.

Get less attached to having everything perfect and the whole thing becomes less of a problem. 
As long as it's bolt-on parts it can always be changed out later. 

Mike, it's not a matter of having it perfect, it's a matter of having it right. The problem lies in that parts like these are deemed "acceptable" to some people. What's next? "Ahh, it's OK if those tail lights don't have the proper shape", or "That tail panel doesn't have to fit perfect for me." Sorry, I'm NOT about to start lowering my standards. No way!
Prime example: I went thru about FIVE SETS of the pot metal '69 Charger repro tail panel trim with Firestone Collectibles because they weren't even the right contour of the tail panel. They are a first-class company, but the batch of parts he had were no good. We eventually worked it out & I got a good set.
Ever swap a grille on a '70? The last thing I want to do is take the front end apart again on a freshly restored '70 Charger. A project car is one thing, but on a car you just finished?? Major pain in the a$$. Not to mention the out of pocket expense paying double to fix the problem.

I'd really like to see some close-up shots of the repro '68-'69 grilles. Anyone know if they mount differently or have filled in holes?