stroking a 500 block

[Animal]

Thinking of getting a 500 mopar perf block & strokng it , been trawling around for info but drawn a blank, can any of you guys giude me in the right direction.

I wanna use the 500 block as it's got the 4 bolt mains , but i have'nt a clue what it will go to when stroked , also no one lists any parts combos to get the job done.

Are any of you guys running a 500/650 cube stroker?

TIA.

[Mick70RR]

Adam, I think these blocks are 4.38" bore (0.060" over) and make 500 inches with a 4.15" stroke crank. Can't think of any reason why a bigger crank wouldn't work and there's plenty of stroker kits you could use.

[Animal]

Good to see you on here Mick , seen you've been on for a while.

Have'nt seen any info on 500 blocks being stroked , would of thought it would be the way to go , bullit proof bottom end to boot , also not much $$$$$$.

Thinkin why mess with the 400/440 block , when you can go 600+ cubes , also saving on a lot of machine work  , also , I'm wondering if 440 source would be up to the job of supplying the parts , maybe have to go Callies crank , thought i'd post on here Mick , as no one back home has any info on it.

[Mick70RR]

I'm on here all the time, there's a wealth of knowledge on this site and someone will answer your question I'm sure.

[Animal]

Got no info on the block spec , need to know the max you can stroke it , could you go to 4.5 stroke with no problems?

Steep learning curve these strokers.

[Mike DC]

 
Those cylinder walls are so thick you could get it way over 500" with no problem.  And a 4.25" crank probably isn't even a challenge to work into that block setup, let alone something bigger. 

[firefighter3931]

I haven't built anything that big but with the Megablock you can go with a 4.5 stroke w/o too much difficulty. The trick is finding a set of heads to feed that much displacement and matching the cam to the rest of the combination. You'll be looking at a set of Indy 440-1 or 572-13 heads to feed that beast....and that's where it gets expensive. 


Ron

[Animal]

Thanks guys,

Decided to go for the Mopar performance siamesed 440 block four bolt mains , finished @ 4.500 , along with a 4.5 stroke , this should give me around 570 cubes , i take it custom pistons will need to be ordered? , also worried about piston stability (ron mentioned it) , oil pickup & rod clearance.  Maybe there aftermarket blocks have more clearance.

Willing to go smaller on the stroke , don't wanna rebuild it every so often , could use a 4.37 stroke @ 556 cubes or maybe a 4.twenty five stroke if more reliable , still giving me 540 cubes.

Open to any suggestions or criticism , still trying to get me head round it.

BTW , my number two on the keyboard don't work.

TIA.

[Animal]

Did'nt see your post before i posted Ron.

Does'nt look like much difference between the 500 block & the 440 aftermarket , as they use the same bore size , maybe more meat on the bores.

Seems you can't purchase the 500 block without the rotating asbly , giving a 4.15 stroke.

[firefighter3931]

I'm not up on the new blocks....they are just coming to market and being made by "World Products" for Mopar performance. World has been in the aftermarket game for a long time and these blocks will be a top shelf part. The 500 block might be a race block ? 

If it was me ; i would go with a 4.25 stroke crank/7.1 rod for 540 cubic inches. The internal pickup will fit fine and you can run a stock style oiling system. The pistons will have enough skirt to be stable in the bore so longevity won't be an issue. You'll have to check with the piston manufacturers for a slug once you decide on how much compression you want to run and decide on a cylinder head. The chamber volume on the head of your choice will determine how much dished volume the piston will need to hit the target compression ratio. Cylinder head flow/port volumes will determine where and how much power the engine will make.



Ron

[Animal]

Ron was thinking maybe Indy or Bi heads? , don't mind spending the $$$ for a good reliable combo , whatever is decided , (gonna be posting  ) i take it any piston can be custom made?

Can these aftermarket blocks take a bigger stroke? , i take it the deck height is the same as the original blocks? , in other words , would a 4.5 stroke fair any better in an aftermaret block opposed to a mopar block.

Just wondering , as i thought you once mentioned the ideal stroke for longevity would be a 4.15 stroke. (RB motor)

Once i have all the info , gonna order the block , think this is gonna be a long thread. 

Thanks

Adam.

[Mike DC]

 
There probably isn't such a thing as going too big with the cylinder head choice on this one.   


I mean, you can take a stock muscle-era 383 short block that has nothing more than headers & a mild 440 cam, and it will show real-world street benefits by switching to a larger head.  This proposed stroker motor is gonna have a good 160 extra cubes to feed on top of that.   

 

[firefighter3931]

 
There probably isn't such a thing as going too big with the cylinder head choice on this one.   

Depends on the application. 

A B1 is a huge port race head designed for high rpm power....using it on a "street/strip" build 540 wouldn't be my first choice. 



Ron

[Mike DC]

Yeah, you're probably right with the B1 in particular.  That's a hell of a big race head. 


I was just thinking more along the lines of the common "consumer grade" street & strip wedge heads from Edelbrock, Indy, MP, etc.

   

[mally69]

what kind of Hp are you looking for

[Animal]

Don't really know what HP/torque a 540 would make.

Maybe go for indy heads , or the Eddy Victors , just taking a stab in the dark with this , also gotta figure what cam specs , should i go roller lifters & what heads would be suitable , i'm all ears.

Going with the 440 aftermarket block , 4.500 bore size , just need help in pieceing the puzzle together. 

Seeing as the build is gonna be using a 1.67 rod ratio , should i have any concerns , it appears 1.5 or less could be problematic regarding the cylinder walls?

Will have to have enough manifold vac to run the brake servo.

Once i know what parts to use I can start ordering.

I'm all ears.

Been reading through the previous threads , all great info , also daunting @ times.

Thanks guys

[aifilaw]

I skimmed through the head, and about 1/3 of the way down immediately thought of the brodix B1-BS heads... definitely my choice...
and then noticed firefighter beat me to it

Those are my suggestion as well though, would definitely feed the beast.

[firefighter3931]

Yeah, you're probably right with the B1 in particular.  That's a hell of a big race head. 


I was just thinking more along the lines of the common "consumer grade" street & strip wedge heads from Edelbrock, Indy, MP, etc.

   

Mike, those B1 "originals" have huge ports.....like 400cc or so. That much port volume would make even a 540ci motor lazy off idle. The guys using them usually launch at 5000+ rpm and aren't too concerned with low speed manners. 


I'm thinking the Indy cnc ported "Big EZ" with a chamber volume of 345cc would be a much better choice given the intended application.



Ron

[firefighter3931]

I skimmed through the head, and about 1/3 of the way down immediately thought of the brodix B1-BS heads... definitely my choice...
and then noticed firefighter beat me to it

Those are my suggestion as well though, would definitely feed the beast.

The B1-BS is a small head that's suited to race 440 type builds. Out of the box they are not impressive at all....they actually flow less than an eddy RPM head. They do wake up with some porting though.....but that gets expensive. There are better options out there for this type of application. Indy has this segment covered pretty good. 



Ron

[Animal]

Got a parts list together..........

Indy EZ heads , low port for stock headers.

Schubecks solid lifters

Harland sharpe roller rockers,.

Not sure on crank , maybe Callies , or is there an alternative? $$$$$$$$$$$

Scat or manley rods?

Mopar M1 intake , or maybe indy ,needs to fit under stock hood.

Do i need to use the indy valley gasket?

Ross pistons.

indy valve covers

850 mighty demon. Already have one , sorry Ron.

Still want to use the stock oiling system.

What I have already fitted............. 4.10 rear end in a Dana 60 , 9 inch 3000 stall dynamic converter , torqueflight has a steel drum fitted , aluminium prop shaft , gear vendors , caltracs , ranchero 9000s , MSD , TTI headers , 3 inch X pipes , 3/8 fuel line , Carter HV fuel pump , frame cons.

Have'nt a clue on cam , timeing gear (maybe JP) or anything else i have'nt mentioned

Done some homework , but there's only so far a plumber can go.

TIA.

[Challenger340]

I missed something. 
Whats the application here ? 
Street ? Race ? Street/Strip ?
What's the intended fuel ?
How much power you want and more precisely "where" in the rpm range for what tire & gearing.

I've done Engines at 900 H.P. with 440-1 heads on 528/540 inch stuff, Ron I think you may still have some of the dyno sheets from a few years ago,
But, that stuff ain't real streetable if 'ya know what I mean ?

I may be able to offer some "suggestions".

Bob out.

[Animal]

Gonna be a street strip motor , 10.5:1 comp , pump gas , also gonna give it a 300 shot nitrous.

The Charger is used on the road , so won't be trailoring.

Hope i've covered it all in the above post , as that will be the combination with the new motor.

Thanks
Adam

[Challenger340]

Biggest Block issue to address initially,when going the sizes you've mentioned on the Mopar Megablocks, is the 4.84" bore spacings limitations for cubic inch in the heat department for a street aplication, as it relates to cooling with the siamese cylinder walls.
Also, remember the siamesed exhaust ports, and the heat buildup.

Any way you cut it, the bigger the compressor and BTU's of heat energy burnt, the bigger the heat sink in the block to be controlled.
I'm NOT just getting at the need for a BIG Radiator.

There are more ways than one to "skin a cat". Same goes for "how" you're gonna approach a "street" buildup in big inch deals.

Need as much info as possible at this point, driving style, intended mileages/useages, "expectations" of E.T. & mph if you're gonna Drag it, car weight. EVERYTHING you can think of.
Header primary Diameter/Collector/Exhaust Dia.
Fuel System & Delivery including tank P/U dia./supply line Dia.
Frame Connectors ?  Keep your doors closing "nice".
Nitrous ? How much ?

Some suggestions off the top of my head;
SCAT 4340 Crank, now available directly from SCAT, they were the supplier of the Mopar Performance Cranks under license, all are 8 bolt flange.
Available in pretty much any stroke you want.
EAGLE H-Beams are fine. Relevant to what final Stroke/Rod Length you go with, maybe dump the 8740 capscrew in favor of an 2000 or L-19 series.
2.200 Chebby Journals, if you end with too short a combo, you'll have to go SCAT or Manley for a 2.200 with the 1.004" Mopar width.

Power is easy to make !

Making power that "lives" in the application is hard !

Bob out.

[Challenger340]

I'm gonna dig out a 545 we did using INDY "sr" heads a few years back. The "sr" heads are the same as the "ez" heads except for the stock exhaust port location.
I can't remember, but I think it was around 800 H.P. with Maxwedge porting, and a solid Flat-Tappet Cam. It may be a good starting point for 'ya to look at and refine for today.
Adjust for the 300 H.P. of steroids.

Stay tuned.
Bob out.

[Animal]

Stayin tuned.

Glad you mentioned the heads , gotta stay with stock ports , already got the TTI headers buttoned up on the edy heads in there @ the mo.

Adam