Rust Treatment Feedback Please

[RallyeMike]

What is the premier/favored rust treatment encapsulating treatment these days?

I broke my rule of "never buy a rusty car" and now I have one to play with      The car looks like it was very solid before the last owner let it sit outside in the wet NW weather for about 10 years. Stripping out the interior found plenty of gunk and corrosion on the bottoms of the doors and quarters where water has seeped past bad side window seals. This is just a quicky hot-rod driver project and not a concours Hemi restoration, so any expensive treatment like electrolysis, etc. is not in the picture.

For now I have cleaned all this out and I'm getting it dry. It looks like I got to this early enough that skins and patches will not be needed, but I need to stop existing rust in its tracks on inside sheet metal surfaces of the doors and quarters.  Of course, these areas are very hard to get access to.  I need to do the same thing on the bottom of the roof, trunk. tops of quarter, etc. where condensation has created surface rust that should be treated.

About 12 years ago I test-painted three products on rusty metal shed roof, and frankly..... and they all did not meet my expectations. 10 years later, Marhyde Rust Treatment seemed to have worked the best, but it was still bubbling and flaking off. The brown Eastwood Rust Encapsulating Paint was the worst off.  I have heard of POR 15 and Rust Bullet. I'm looking for any real world feedback on what seems to work for you guys. I like the idea of the watery rust converters as I think they will seem down into the nooks and crannies that need to be addressed  

I wish I could say that I was early enough to save the floors and trunk, but those will be getting replaced.

[b5blue]

I just went through the same thing a year or two ago and did lots of testing. I treated areas and then did destructive testing to cut back through the treatment to see for myself what was going on. NOTHING soaks through the rust to get to bond with steel. I found repeated attacking with OSPHO worked best, if you can keep applying a wet film of it and wire brush or green scrubby agitating it will continue to remove rust as long as wet. The crap is full of acid so be careful, it will burn you. I made a spray rig to inject it inside frame rails and seams using an Eastwood extension wand adapted to a spray bottle from Walmart that worked very well.
Rust Bullet is hard as a rock when dry and I didn't like trying to sand it as it gums up the sanding disks/paper. Black Rust Encapsulator worked very well if thick enough coating is used.

[green69rt]

I just went through the same thing a year or two ago and did lots of testing. I treated areas and then did destructive testing to cut back through the treatment to see for myself what was going on. NOTHING soaks through the rust to get to bond with steel. I found repeated attacking with OSPHO worked best, if you can keep applying a wet film of it and wire brush or green scrubby agitating it will continue to remove rust as long as wet. The crap is full of acid so be careful, it will burn you. I made a spray rig to inject it inside frame rails and seams using an Eastwood extension wand adapted to a spray bottle from Walmart that worked very well.
Rust Bullet is hard as a rock when dry and I didn't like trying to sand it as it gums up the sanding disks/paper. Black Rust Encapsulator worked very well if thick enough coating is used.

Agree with b5blue that nothing gets through the rust.   I've used POR15 and as long as you can get it down to some light rust on the metal it'll stick, just painting it on top of loose, flaky rust doesn't work.   I also used the POR15 metal prep solution.  It's a solution of phosphoric acid and zinc phosphate.   The acid eats the rust and the zinc tends to plate out on the metal to prevent rust from coming back (you can't see the zinc that's left behind)  but the zinc is not a long term solution, still need paint   If you use it you need to wipe or sand the parts down to get the powdery zinc phsphate residue off before painting.   However getting into hard to reach places will be a problem.

Bottom line is that I haven't heard of anything that is a magic bullet (other that a body dip and even it has problems.)  Just need to take your best shot and move on.

[CDN72SE]

I applied Rust Bullet in 2011 but don't have real world experince with it as my car is still sitting in my garage. I used about half of the one gallon container; I did the engine compartment, the interior, tail panel and most of the trunk, I used a sponge roller. This is my 72 Charger SE.

Before:


After:






Few more:










Ok, here's the last one:

[b5blue]

In many areas I was concerned about compatibility, adhesion of epoxy primer and any following coats like body filler. Bullet is probably the hardest coating in this category so it would be ideal for floorboards and such as a stand alone coating. I was very careful to remove the OSPHO after treating with clean dry cloths and scuffed with green scrubbies, wiped with pre prep then shot epoxy or Rust Encapsulator to seal. I seems to have worked, nothing has let loose.

[green69rt]

All these ideas are good but IMO the problems is those hard-to-get-at areas like the rocker seams, lower door seams etc.  I don't think there is a real good solution for those other than dipping.  Like I said, work them hard, do what you can, spray whatever product you come up with then move on...  otherwise you'll never get finished and you'll always want to do another step.

Also if you are going to paint over them, ALL of them will require scuffing before primer.  Don't think about skipping that step.  Cure time is VERY important.

Looks like you are doing the right stuff.

[RallyeMike]

There are quite simply areas that cannot be reached without dipping, but much of it can be hit with spray or if on a rotisserie - flooding it. While I know that nothing penetrates rust to metal, it takes both Ox and H20 to create rust, so anything that seals the rust from these two elements for the longest time possible will do the job I need.

I guess the one thing I did not consider in my question was finish quality. Sanding and painting over in some areas will simply not be an option, so it would be nice if the product had a finished appearance to it 

[fy469rtse]

Do the best you can , 100 times better than the factory did, nearly every car I have seen on here and my own have paint in areas the factory never did
And then Fish oil, liquid and spray, I used the straw nozzle to concentrate spray in cracks and crevices , good for the inside of doors down the bottoms where the skins meet in cnrs and tight ,
Would rather have fish oil filled up in these areas than crud and water

[b5blue]

The 24" extension wand from Eastwood has turned into one of my best weapons against rust.   
http://www.eastwood.com/ew-rust-encapsulator-w-ext-nozzle-black.html
You can make a "rig" to clean it out after using with a tube and syringe to force lacquer thinner through it. Break the white plastic cap off the brass tube fitting then drill a small hole in the end of a spray bottle sprayer so the brass fitting will press fit into the nozzle. Now you have a thin injector tube on the end of a sprayer for getting OSPHO or any thinned coating into gaps and areas inaccessible any other way. (Inside frame rails, between frame and hood or roof and so on.)   

[RallyeMike]

Good tips, but what is "Fish Oil"? I hope you don't mean the real thing. I have a hard enough time keeping the cats off the car without that attraction!

[Musicman]

Rust Bullet 

[daytonalo]

All above really just kind of putting lipstick on a pig ! You must sandblast , no soda !!! Thats a whole new subject

[polywideblock]

Good tips, but what is "Fish Oil"? I hope you don't mean the real thing. I have a hard enough time keeping the cats off the car without that attraction!

don't know how they make it but it stinks like old fish and has been a staple rust preventative for years  use it on  inside doors, rockers etc  anywhere water can get it can get. great for  boat trailers caravans etc

                                        http://www.septone.com.au/detail.asp?item_cat=11&item_number=354&page_num=1

[charger_fan_4ever]

All above really just kind of putting lipstick on a pig ! You must sandblast , no soda !!! Thats a whole new subject

X2

[stripedelete]

The fish oil is interesting.   Is it an environmentally friendly alternative to waste oil or does it harden up?

Has anyone used Boiled Linseed Oil and Penetrol? (4:1) 
I've used it on trailer frames etc.   Inexpensive and seems to work, but nothing is forever.

[RallyeMike]

All above really just kind of putting lipstick on a pig ! You must sandblast , no soda !!! Thats a whole new subject

X2

The car is a pig as mentioned and I am looking for feedback on lipstick. Not every car is a $50k project.

[b5blue]

   I just bought my 3rd gallon of OSPHO (36.00) in 19 years and lost count of how much Rust Encapsulator used. Both work well with each other. I'm still finding grit from the spot sandblasting I did 3 years ago in my driver 70.
  Rust never sleeps! (Unless it's killed and covered.)

[hemi-hampton]

All above really just kind of putting lipstick on a pig ! You must sandblast , no soda !!! Thats a whole new subject

X2

X3

[1973rallye]

I used Rust Bullet as well. Sandblasted underside, floor pans, engine bay, trunk. I let it set up and painted single stage topcoat. Will it last? No idea as the car will never likely see water again as long as I own it. For me it was more piece of mind and unlike Por 15, no pre treatment was necessary.

[Mike DC]

 
POR-15 is good stuff if you are willing to work within the drawbacks that the company warns you about. 

The stuff needs a rough surface to adhere to.  It needs to be topcoated with something else (anything, even cheap spray paint will work) to keep sunlight from turning black POR-15 into dark purple.  And there are certain circumstances for getting the topcoat to stick. 

If you jump through all those hoops successfully then the results are pretty damn good IMO.