130 amp alternator

[ronv]

Hello All,
I am new here so I am not sure if this subject has been covered.
I have a 70 Charger with a 440. I do have power steering but no A/C. I have MSD 6al, nitrous, dual electric fans and a CD Player. Soon I will be adding an electric fuel pump and an amp for the stereo. My problem is that I need an alternator that will put out 130 amps.  I ordered a Powermaster but it is too long and will not bolt in or align. The MSD alternator will not work due the alternator bolts into the cylinder head. Does anyone have any suggestions for a bolt on alternator or brackets to install a longer alternator?
Thanks for the help.

My engine
440   .30 over
Barry Grant 750 Mighty Demon
Comp Cams cam and moly roller rockers.
Edlebrock heads
M1 intake
Be Cool Cooling
TTI coated headers

Thanks again

[owatajrkiam]

I'm in the middle of upgrading my system right now.Find an alt. from a 89-91 dodge full size van 3/4 ton as these had 90 to 130 amp ratings,it also has a 2 groove pulley instead of the serpintine system.I do believe some of the rams and dak's had em.This alt. will drop right in w/just a little massaging on the factory spacers on the bracket.This amperage will FRY you're stock wiring system.DO NOT install this system without bypassing the stock amp gauge as the stock system was marginal at 45 amps.Go to www.madelectrical.com .He has a great article and step by step instructions on how to upgrade in the "Electrical tech" and go down to "bypassing the stock amp gauge".I didn't need my stock gauge anyways as i have an autometer volt gauge and the factory one is inaccurate anyhow.This site has awesome info on relay systems for brighter headlites,fan relays,and everything else you need to know on elec upgrades.Go to http://www.davesmopar.com/ then go toF.B.O. systems message board on this site.scroll down to tech articles from members,then click on" Denso alt swap".This is a detailed swap in a 68 charger w/440.it even uses the stock brackets,etc. He's even done the research on the parts you're going to need such as part #s for alt belts and length's etc.He used one from an 02 van and just changed pulleys.This is a total bolt in swap and if you ever need a new one,it's only down the street at napa,pep boys etc.Check out all the other info from Dave on ignition swaps etc.No mopar gearhead should be without the info these guy's have on ignition systems.PHEW i think my computers out of breath!.Good luck.Glen.

[owatajrkiam]

I forgot to mention that this is the "mini"alt.While yer at the boneyard (or at pep boys for all you's "moneys no object"guys).Pick up that "mini"starter while you're at it.This is the most outrageously simple "I should have done this years ago" swap you will ever do to you're mope.By the way,I love this site.I,m from the "C" body camp.69 Monaco 500/340 w/727/3:55s.Keep in touch with our sites on the webb as we share the same,Engines,trannies,electrical issues,etc.If you,ve looked everywhere for that hard to find driveshaft,etc for you're Charger,try poking under a full size "C",you may just be suprised at what you will find.MOPARS RULE!.Glen.

[ronv]

Thank you for all the great info. And especially the warning about frying my wiring. I just had dash,engine and the head lamp harness changed and that could have been costly to pump all those amps in there.

[dkn1997]

I did the denso dodge van 130amp alt on my 68 with a 440.  one of the best things i did for the car.

I love it because it's a bolt  in,and  is dual field remote regulated like your stock one.  cost me under 150 bucks.  But I did get a takeoff alternator new off ebay for 75 bucks.  I bought it from an ambulance conversion shop.  if you go with a pre02 alt, you won't have to find the special plug for back of the alt for the field wires. 

see the link below, I wrote it and that's my alt in the pics.   email dkn1997@aol.com or call my cell 516.909.9860 if you have any questions.

http://cuda66273.proboards23.com/index.cgi?board=Tech&action=display&thread=1081309590

[dkn1997]

I forgot, my price was also including buying a plug and reg to convert my car to dual field.  your '70 won't require that.  also, don't let anyone tell you you have to buy special brackets.   YOU DON'T  I used my stock brackets.  I did have to trim the factory spacers a bit.

it does sit pretty close to the head, but just make your connections before mounting the alt and you should be ok.   also, it sits perfect for belt alignment with the GM pulley on there.  no shimming required.

[Mopar2Ya]

Is this setup w/the newer alt better than a 100amp tuffstuff alt? Can the denso style newer alt be used on a '70 w/A/C?

[dkn1997]

I don't even know what a "tuff stuff" is.  What I can tell you is that if you use the denso, no matter how far from home you are, you can get another one.  Also, even though it's probably made in taiwan, china, or malasia, at least it's supposed to be in a mopar.

Another thing to consider when choosing this denso swap is price.  Check egouge and you will find deals.  I did.  I have seen the 90 amp units go for 30 bucks.  90 is more than enough for most things you will run.  also, the denso will charge great at idle.

there are 2 130 amp units on ebay right now for under 40 bucks. one of them says under 10miles on it.

[Mopar2Ya]

TuffStuff is a company that makes chrome products they have a direct replacement for the mopar alt just in a 100amp(powermaster has 75amp). Ebay link: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1,1&item=8044814145&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3APIC
I like the denso idea better. Do I have to do the ammeter bypass? I just bougt all new wireharnesses & don't want to cut/drill/splice the new stuff all up. Can I bypass the ammeter w/o doing all the cutting/splicing? Thanks.

[dkn1997]

It sure does look nice, but it also looks like a new version of the same alternator design.  I don't know what goes into the tuff stuff unit, but I can tell you that the old style stock units do NOT charge the best at idle.  rebuilds are worse.  I have heard many people of different boards say that 1 wire alternators are not that great. bear in mind, just what I heard.  The charging at idle is what made me go this route.  I could have gotten mine rebuilt to a higher amp rating, but at the time, almost everyone I spoke to told me that it would still not charge as good as the modern denso at idle.

You can use many different "stock" new alternators.  AR engineering makes brackets for several different alts, toyota to name one.  But consider that the mopar one is the one I know will fit into the stock brackets with next to no mods.  you could easily go back to a stock one because you don't touch the brackes themselves to get the denso to fit.

If you go denso, and you already have a dual field alt, then the only wiring add on is an extra heavy 4g wire from back of alt to starter relay.
I was told that the current will follow the path of least resistance and that if you put the extra 4g in, that the current will not run through the bulkhead connector or the amp gauge.  I am no electronics expert, but I have been running this setup for years and have had no issues.

my amp gauge is still hooked up, but always reads a little to the discharge side.  Does this mean that not as much current is running through it as before?  maybe, maybe not. 

My project was kind of involved because I never heard of anyone doing it before me and had to ask a ton of questions.  also, converted from single to dual field.  with that said, I sort ran out of steam at the end and did not do the ammeter bypass like I planned. 

[phat69charger]

I'm not a electrical expert but I changed my Alt. to a 100 Amp one wire GM Alt. I don't know about dual field alternators so I looked it up and this is what I found http://www.robdiesel.com/techinfo/cars/dualfield.htm , It looks like it allowed for the Regulator to be electronic instead of it being a electric Mechanical one, to me that's just more part to trouble shoot if your having charging problems, there's pretty good logic on the http://www.madelectrical.com/ site why not to run the Amp meter gauge http://www.madelectrical.com/electricaltech/amp-gauges.shtml

Ronv, what's your reason you need so much amperage? do you have a high current stereo amplifier to power? I see you really don't have any power accessories like power windows, seats or modern car accessories, what's all the amperage for?

[dkn1997]

If you run a mechanical regulater and it has been changed within the last 10 years, it's electronic now.  crack open the case on any replacement mechanical reg and you will see a circuit board thre instead of the old spring that the OE mechanical ones had.

ON the amps issue, yes, 130 seems excessive, but it's good insurance IMHO.   You may not have power accessories now, but who knows about the future?  It's not so much the amps as the charging at idle.  I had 2 old style alts that could not keep up with an electric fan and elec fuel pump. 

again, you can go lower, like 90. 

[Mopar2Ya]

This is the same denso? http://www.partzfinder.com/CHROME_Alternator_175_A_Mopar_Jeep_p/tsp-7510-nc.htm
Does anyone else offer a denso in chrome/polished? Can a dual pulley be put on(from an old style or other source) so I can use a denso w/my A/C setup? Thanks.

[owatajrkiam]

I just got 2 alts at the wreckers from 88 and 89 dakota,they have the 2 groove pulleys so you can use you're air,they are the small denso units.
look for these years ,napa has them listed and they state serp. or 2 groove,you can also retrofit the pulleys on a newer alt.If you need a pulley and cant get let me know,i'll mail you one.Glen

[doctorpimp]

Thanks for all the info guys!
I'll be doing this upgrade to my car (much, much,MUCH later - gotta build an engine etc first )

[dkn1997]

If you get a denso with a serp pulley, just buzz it off with an impact gun, buy a new nut, and install a 60's/70's Gm pulley on it.  works fine.

[Mopar2Ya]

Thanks, I plan on getting a denso style alt soon. I can only find one chrome unit that's over $300. I have a polished CAA A/C unit so I'd like a matching chrome/polished alt. Does anyone know somewhere that sells a more reasonably priced chrome/polished denso alt?

[Wakko]

This looks like a great upgrade.  Which alternator do I need, one bracket on the bottom and one threaded bracket on top?  I've found a bunch of Dakota alternators on Ebay like this one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Dakota-Durango-Dodge-P-U-Van-Alternator_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33573QQitemZ8014324229QQrdZ1

[dkn1997]

that looks like the one.  on the polishing, if you take your time, you can get the stock one to shine pretty good.

[Mopar2Ya]

On a '70 does the stock voltage reg work w/the denso or do I need a newer style reg that is used w/the denso? Thanks.

[dkn1997]

stock 70's reg works, but depending on the alt you get, you may have to get a special plug that connects the field wires to the alt.  I got one from a member over at moparchat.  That was the year that plug came out (02) so the dealer had no idea what I was talking about.  by now, you could probably get one easy.  before that guy got me the connector, I rigged something up with a couple of female connectors and it worked fine.

Older alts just have two threaded studs to mount the field wires, just put a couple of ring terminals on your field wires and go...

I still can't believe more people don't do this swap.  mine cost under 150 and that's only because I paid 75 for the alternater and had to buy the regulator and special connector for it.  post 68 owners would not have to do that. 

If I was to do another one, I would buy a used alt off of ebay and probably only get a 90 amp.  I got the 130 because I planned on putting A/C in and power window, etc....at least I know I still can.

[squeakfinder]

I have dumb question's. Are the stock solid state voltage regulators the same? That is from say from 72 to 79 roughly. Do they cover the 46 to 130 amp alternators?

[dkn1997]

stock reg works, that's what I run

[phat69charger]

Here's some good info about 12 Voilt systems although the site is about boat systems: http://www.boatus.com/boattech/12volt.htm

[66charger73]

What size wire do you use from a 130 or 90 amp alt to starter relay or main bus and what do you use as a fusible link for that size wire?