Steering column and Dash

[john108]

I am addressing the steering column and Dash as they are obstacles in the way of removing the power brake booster and wiper motor from the engine compartment.  I am trying not to jump around but have little choice here.  I would like to remove as little as I have to from the interior at this time.

It appears that to be able to disconnect the booster and wiper motor, the instrument cluster has to be removed and to do that, the steering column has to be lowered.

I have the service manual and have read many posts here that touch on these subjects.  But, it is not totally clear to me except some of you can do it in your sleep.  I guess that if I had removed them once before, I might find it easy.

I will start with the steering column.  I would like to ask, exactly which bolts or nuts are removed, and do you have to drive out the drive pin on the column, in the engine compartment?  I have attached a photo that I would appreciate that the comments are addressed to.

It appears to me that the 2 nuts and bolt identified as "A" would remove the bracket supporting the column.  The 2 bolts marked "C" attach the column to the firewall.
The drive pin is another question?
I don't think that the 4 bolts marked "B" need to be removed but I don't know??
Electrical connector???
Please identify anything else,
Thank you  --  John

[tan top]

 if your car is NOT column change , but floor shift ,  remove  bolts & nuts  ,

A - B - C  , & electrical multi plug ,  then look at second picture i posted

if column change ,  dont remove bolts C , but remove bolts D instead , plus nessaray linkage   , column can be removed complete with column firewall plate  

  then remove coupler roll pin

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Steve, great detailed post as usual!!


BUT honestly John, to remove the booster or the wiper motor, the instrument cluster not the steering column does not have to come out at all....the 4 booster nuts retaining it to the firewall can be easily removed from under the dash....one of them can be a PITA but with a swivel & extension it can be done. 
Wiper motor is the same.....three nuts & it pulls out from engine compartment.  while its pulled back from firewall you can get the nut off the bellcrank link & remove the whole unit.

[john108]

Chris
I think your 1st sentence is telling me that both the steering column and cluster do not have to come out.  You must be a Super Mechanic with all the right tools, to get to all the booster nuts.  I had to remove the support bracket under the steering column to barely see the top left bolt.  I can get a universal/socket on the threads but not engage the nut.  I only took 1 nut off so far and leaving the easiest one for last.  I think things have to move to provide better access.
We didn't address the nut and bolt through the brake link.  I managed to remove the nut off the bolt but the bolt doesn't appear to pull out far enough to release the link.  It bumps into the brackets supporting the brake pedal.  I don't see how any of this could be put together without everything in the way being removed, but I have no magic.

I haven't addressed the wiper motor yet as I haven't even been able to see past everything to find it, yet.  I need more space under there or borrow your magic hands.

Steve
I have a 727 with console shifter.
I removed "A", "B", and "C", removed the roll pin, and disconnected the electrical connector.
A few other posts referred to lowering the steering column a couple of inches rather than removing it.  I may have to remove it anyway but I would like to know how to do both.  Can it be lowered to provide more access to the booster and wiper motor nuts, as well as the instrument cluster??
Do you have to remove the steering wheel and anything else in the horn ring area to move or remove the column?
Do I have to remove the 2 bolts that you refer to in the engine compartment (bearing area) just to lower the column?  Of all the bolts referred to in this post, they would be the easiest but I don't know what may fall out?
With what I have removed so far, the column wiggles slightly but doesn't move/drop.

[john108]

Hi

Steve: I removed the 2 Bolts on the steering column (engine compartment near firewall) as you suggested.  The PIN is out.
When I grab the thin shaft between the Pin and firewall, the area shown in the picture slides in and out 1/2 inch, but nothing happens in the area where the pin was removed.  It feels like something is stopping it from moving further.  I didn't want to force it.  What am I missing?
The white ring, near where the 2 bolts were removed appears damaged and if that cylindrical area slides through the firewall, it will have to be cut off.

Chris:  The area under the dash is packed full of stuff, I can't see the wiper motor nuts at all.  I think it is mostly AC related stuff.  I don't know if the instrument cluster and/or radio were out, some access may be gained.  Being you can do it in your sleep, would you please walk me through it.  I have the cluster perimeter screws and radio Bezel off. 

If the steering column was out of the way, I think I can get to the booster nut but may have to remove brake pedal stuff to remove the bolt that goes through the link.

Can the whole dash cover come off.  The windshield is out and I have access to the perimeter bolts (at the base of the windshield).  It appears that a lot more holds it in and stuff attached to it in some way?

Thank you  --  John

[tan top]

 more often or not , the coupler needs prying free of the splines oun the steering box input shaft ,
get a large flat bladed screwdriver between coupler & steering box & carefully pry the coupler back up the steering column shaft , will go about 1/2" or there abouts , to disengauge coupler from splines , ( should not need to go crazy doing this , litle tweek should do it  , also  
carefull when prying  you dont damage the steering box imput shaft oil seal  , )

((Chris is right you can get to loads of stuff under the dash , with out removing the column ,  with all sorts of 1/4 drive scockets &  extentions & stuff , but i cant get under there anymore   , find is quicker to whip column out every time , once you know how to do it , its a 5 minute job , ))

[tan top]

I think your 1st sentence is telling me that both the steering column and cluster do not have to come out.  You must be a Super Mechanic with all the right tools, to get Steve
I have a 727 with console shifter.
I removed "A", "B", and "C", removed the roll pin, and disconnected the electrical connector.
A few other posts referred to lowering the steering column a couple of inches rather than removing it.  I may have to remove it anyway but I would like to know how to do both.  Can it be lowered to provide more access to the booster and wiper motor nuts, as well as the instrument cluster??
Do you have to remove the steering wheel and anything else in the horn ring area to move or remove the column?
Do I have to remove the 2 bolts that you refer to in the engine compartment (bearing area) just to lower the column?  Of all the bolts referred to in this post, they would be the easiest but I don't know what may fall out?
With what I have removed so far, the column wiggles slightly but doesn't move/drop.

in answer to your earlier post
to lower column  only , you can eaither  remove or un-do so only catching by a couple of threads nuts bolts A  in your picture ,  &  slacken off  the four fire wall bolts marked D

what i normaly do is take the whole lower plate out  by removing bolts B also

[john108]

Steve - I pulled bolts/nuts "A", "B", "C", "D", and the pin.  Very minor prying where you showed.  With some running back and forth, I got the steering column completely out**.

Chris & Steve- I was now able to remove the difficult 4th nut holding the brake booster but additional dis-assembly was required.  The bolt through the booster link was too long to be removed internal to the bracketry.  I had to remove the 2 other bolts associated with the brake pedal linkage to be able to pull the booster out far enough to remove the booster link bolt.  BOOSTER OUT**!

I was also able to pull and twist the wiper motor out far enough to access the center bolt attaching the linkage to the motor.  A vice grip on the link and a box wrench on the bolt **The wiper motor is now removed.**

I don't know how any of these parts can be put back in place!

Thank you very much for your help.  --  John

[tan top]

 
 thats good you got it sorted    , guessing its a complete resto on your charger ??  any pictures ? whats the plan stock type rebuild or ??  

[john108]

Steve – It will be an 80 / 20 resto.  The car is not in bad shape for being 44 years old.  I bought it off the showroom floor back in 1968 (Charger R/T).  It was my daily driver and I did my share of street racing.  My daughter liked the attention she received when I let her drive it when in high school.  It has been sitting around for quite a few years now.  I started working on it a few years ago but got side tracked.

I had sanded down what once was a vinyl roof and painted it with POR-15, as well as the inside surface of the roof.  I purchased new seat covers, bucket seat inserts, carpet, headliner, vinyl top, etc. from Legendary (all sitting in a bedroom).  I also bought a bunch of engine hardware, other than rotating components, with plans for a 505.  I am looking for an extra block for the build.

I am back to it now with the engine compartment almost emptied of large objects.  I am also looking at the dash to see what needs doing and removal, because I wound up under the dash to remove the components in the engine compartment hanging on the firewall.  The Dash Cap is cracked and I have to determine how to remove it as well as how to get into the area below the cowl.  I will add information as I progress.

[tan top]

 wow !! original owner eh !! awesome stuff    ,  bet you have some good storys from back in the day ,
looking forward to reading & seeing progress pictures & stuff John  



the dash pad can be removed with dash frame in the car , but is easier to remove  when its out !!
as you mentioned the windshield is out !! thats half the battle , cause  the top bolts for the dash are under the windshield gasket

[john108]

The Service manual has 1 sentence and a tiny picture associated with the dash pad (page 23-57).  It looks like it is held on by 6 studs and nuts.  I would need a trained mouse to get at those nuts.

You indicated that the Dash Frame can be removed?  How is this done and what else has to be removed to get at it??
The 5 bolts along the base of where the windshield sat are exposed and can be easily removed.  What is next?
Here is a few pictures.

[tan top]

to remove the dash as one assembly , with gauges & wiring etc
 disconnect  the three separate harnesses from fire wall block connector in engine bay , then push the  multi plug block connector in side ,  
speedo cable  ,
gray tachometer wiring that goes through fire wall , if you have a tick tock tach
heater air ducts &  wiring & cable from fire wall heat control valve to heater controls ,
remove radio or just the wiring to it  & to the speaker ,
left fresh air vent control
remove driver side kick panel then
disconnect / un plug ,  dome , center console ,  trunk lamp wiring as required  , then the yellow door pin switch wiring  ,
remove passenger side kick panel , disconnect yellow door pin switch wiring ,
 un clip aerial / antenna  cable from dash frame

then follow green arrows in picture below  ,
carfull dash fully assembled is heavy & has sharp edges , wear suitable gloves when lifting , best to get a helper , be on the safe side



been  well over 11 years since in put mine back together after i done the   resto ,  & closer to 14 since i stripped it to a bare shell ,  if any one sees something ive missed  , feel free to ad to the list to help John out , as i use to remember all of this ,& could do it blind fold    , but starting to forget lots of stuff now ,

[john108]

I was afraid that is what you were going to say.
I can see why the service manual left that out!

I am guessing that half of that stuff has to come out just to get the 6 nuts off the dash cap!??
Now I understand why they sell a dash cap that glues down over your existing dash cap.

[tan top]

  to remove the dash pad only , 
remove
gauge/instrument  panel
heater control panel
glove box liner
best to remove radio too , giving more room ,

[tan top]

here is a couple of pictures of a removed dash i saved , where green arrows are is where the nuts are that hold the dash pad on  , they are right inside the dash frame , & can only be reached by a sutable  1/4 drive extension bar & scocket ,  when fitting  , to stop the nut falling off while guiding nut in the scocket with extension bar , to dash cap stud , put a tiny bit of body calking in the scocket to keep the nut in place ,
also need a extendable magnetic , to fish out any nuts that fall , difficult to get out other wise ,

*** picture borrowed saved from this site , forget whos it was ***  

[john108]

Thank you Steve -
How did you get that entire dash out of the car without removing the instrument cluster, radio, glove box, etc.?
I am going to the pet store tomorrow to get a trained mouse to help recover stray NUTS and maybe a small monkey to do the wrenching.
I wasn't planning on tackling the dash so soon.  I was concentrating on the engine compartment, engine and transmission, etc.  I was also touching on the exterior of the car. 

This car is a maze. To get the trim off the outside along the 1/4 window required removing the rear seat & seat back, side panel, and 1/4 window.  I thought that was complex but the components on the firewall and dash make it look easy. - John