need advice on suspension and brakes

[71wrenchhead]

basically i can take apart and put together engines all day long, but when it comes to suspension and brakes, i have no clue what im getting into
im looking for advice on what to do/buy inorder to get what i want
the car
71 charger
318 w/ 904 auto  (for now, possible upgrade down the road)
i want it to be a cruiser, sit back, relax, listen to a nice low v8 rumble. Nothing crazy
what i want as far as suspension and braking is something to compliment the cruising aspect of the whole car
i dont want to feel like i have to lean when i get into some corners, and i really dont feel like having to stomp on teh brakes just to stop at a red light
so if someone could help me out and show me some kits and stuff, and explain what they would do for me, that would be unbelievably helpful

[71wrenchhead]

oh sorry, i forgot, also looking to stiffen the whole ride up with fender supports and sub frame connectors and other items like that, advice on those would be awesome as well
and as far as price limit....well, im looking at around 3 to 6, possibly more if its worth it, but like everyone else, the cheaper the better

[HPP]

Definetly get some reinforcement under there. Making the unibody structure rigid is the first and most important part of the foundation needed for future mods. Not only for the performance aspects but also because it eliminates sqeaks, rattles, and leaks that come from flex, plus it will help all panel gaps remain rock solid consistent.

You didn't say what you were starting with so that will have some impact on total cost to get where you want. With a 318, I'd guess it is lighter duty parts. Overall, you don't need to get too crazy with parts to upgrade for a cruiser. The factory style 11.75 front disc and 10x2 rear drums will be sufficient for a cruiser. Some heavy duty leafs, maybe a 1.0 t-bar, 1.125" front sway bar and either 1" under axle of .75 over axle rear sway bar would be a good overall cruiser combo. Combine this with a high quality shock and your set. I'd say Edelbrock as a minimum, but Bilsteins would be better.

Costs
11.75 discs, $150-500 depending on where/how you source the parts. Large and inexpesnive, these provide good stopping power and low cost
10x2 drums, assuming you have these and just need freshened $50-200. Inexpensive and effective. The rears only do 25-30% of the braking, so no need for discs here
New leaf springs $200. Your 318 units were weak to begin with, and now they are also old, so improvements here will be felt.
1.0 t-bars $200 on sale at PST, otherwise $300. Same as the leafs.
Shocks $250-400. Shocks are the heart of a suspension, much like a cam is to the engine. Quality here goes a long way to overall feel and performance.
Sway bars are around $150 each. Another part that was inadequate from the factory.
Obviously all new bushings and hard parts, $500 for a kit. Foundation work again. Need these to all be in new condition.

You can source things here and there and maybe come out on the cheaper end of the scale.  Or you can do a one stop shop at PST, Firm Feel, or XV. Also, make sure your steering box is in good shape. A rebuilt Firm Feel stage 1 or 2 box is also a good improvement for feel, but doesn't actually improve performance.

[71wrenchhead]

ok sorry, basically, i have a bit of work to do with the frame rails, the rears are bad from the aft of the wheel well back, and the fronts are in decent shape
so i was going to replace and reinforce those, i already planned on subframe connectors, and i also planned on replacing all of the suspension
i have a 2 & 1/2 car garage completely dedicated to tearing this car down to the little bits, cleaning it up, repainting and reinstalling
im doing a complete resto/mod, so nothing is out the window at this point
but for all intensive purposes, pretend its a brand new car with perfect fram rails and a perfect orginal suspension, im just asking about upgrades, ive already set aside money to bring those parts back to life
i really appreciate the advice, i have been looking at what other people are doing on here, and im just trying to seperate what i need from what is overkill

i apologize in advance for teh following noob questions   
what and where are these T-bars?
what differentiates a good set of shocks and springs from a not so good set?

thanks again for the help, like i said, i dont know hardly anything about this suspension junk, i never had to deal with it, i was always the engine guy in the shop

[HPP]

The list I laid out is a pretty basic set up that will meet your needs for ease of installation, reduction in overall cost, and effectiveness of intended usage. Overkill would be stepping up to coil over set ups, 13"+ four wheel disc brakes, billet suspension components, tubular components, and so on.

T-bars are the torsion bars, these are the springs in the front suspension of a mopar. They are the round bars that run mostly parallel to the front sub-frame, just inside the frame and attach to the lower control arm at the front and a frame cross member located over the transmission. The effective rate of the torsion bar is determined by its diameter. A bigger diameter is higher rate torsion bar. Stock bars were in the .82" to .92" range. Torsion bars are pretty basic and there is not a huge difference in quality between most providers. There are some differences in how the hex ends are set up between the different vendors, but even this is not a big deal for most. The factory t-bars have a 30* clocking on the ends. Firm Feel t-bars have a 15* clock and PST bars have 0*. I'm not sure what the Hotchkis bars are set at. The clocking will determine how much preload the installed bars have, and as a result, how far the adjusters will need to be screwed in. The more clocking on the bar, the less the adjuster bolts need to be threaded in. The adjusters, situated in between the two stamped pieces of the lower control arms, adjust the ride height of the front end.

Good leaf springs are determined in a few different ways. Quality of metal, ability to retain arch, ability to maintain rate, assembly method holding leafs together, material between the leafs, location and layout of the eyes, and quality of the bushings. High end, performance oriented leaf springs for racing applications from a custom builder can run upwards of $500-800 per side. JC Whitney replacements can be had for as little as $80 each. Semi custom set can be found in between these two extremes. They combine a reasonable but not precise rate, ability to maintain arch, and a long usage life. These type of leafs can be found at Firm Feel, Hotchkis, and Espo. I have typically used Mopar Performance springs for my projects as they are also a reasonable cost option.

Shocks are a lot more complicated. Again I will use the engine analogy-shocks are to the suspension what a camshaft is to an engine. They will determine the operating range, behavior, duration of performance, and over all feedback level the driver receives. As a hydraulic dampening device, there are an assortment of ways to make better shocks. The most basic shocks are simple oil filled canisters with a metering plate in them that slows the movement of oil from one chamber to the other. High end shocks have a varying number of valves that are both loading and inertia sensitive with differing oils and gas pressure to help in response. The really high end units even have remote reservoirs to hold additional fluids and gas to reduce fading. A custom built shock with rate and application specific valving with remote reservoirs for a racing application can run upwards of $2000 each.  The better the shock can control the suspension motion,the greater its ability to controlled increased springs rates will maintaining a comfortable. So, shocks is an area with a very broad range of options. If your new to the suspension game, best bet is to avoid any adjustable or custom units and go with a good off the shelf unit. IMO, a good starting point for a cruiser is the Edelbrock line. They are direct bolt ins that have semi custom valving. Some guys like KYB shocks, but as a high pressure gas shock, these sometimes create a harsh ride. The best all around semi custom shock out there are Bilsteins that are valved per application by Race Car Dynamics and are sold through retail outlets like Firm Feel and Hotchkis. You can get away with some basic parts store, nitrogen gas charged shocks if you are going to stick with the original rate leafs and t-bars as a way to cut back on the budget further. It seems the Gabriel and Monroe gasmatics or gas adjusts are capable of providing adequate control for t-bars up to .96 in diameter and the stock XHD leaf springs.

No doubt this will bring up more questions as you get through the build process. Post them up as you have them.

[71wrenchhead]

well, now that i learned a metric f*&^ton today, off to look at some of these parts with a better understanding
thanks a lot i seriously appreciate the help, i have been trying to figure this stuff out on my own for a while and just could not get my head around it at all.

dc member assistance gets    from me

[HPP]

Sweet!

While that was a fair amount of info, we've just scratched the surface. C'mon back when you get more questions.

Obviously there are several ways to approach this. Buy pieces here and there, or go to a single vendor and get a kit. Here are some of the major players in the mopar suspension game. All of these guys are also more than willing to discuss options, pieces, prices, and compatibility of their parts. Some are very high end, some have high end and mid range stuff, some have rebuild parts, all are worth a look.

Firm Feel - http://www.firmfeel.com/
Hotchkis - http://www.hotchkis.net/
XV Motorsports - http://www.xvmotorsports.com/
Performance Suspension - http://www.p-s-t.com/
Just Suspension - http://justsuspension.com/
Alterkation - http://reillymotorsports.com/
Control Freaks - http://www.freakride.com/

[71wrenchhead]

oh dear god, that is a lot of stuff

sooo, i spent some time going through it and found this
http://justsuspension.com/the-works-kit-for-mopar.html
i would upgrae to the bilstein shocks, and the 11" front disks
also i removed the rear brakes entirely, as you said i wouldnt need to upgrade them to disc
no steering box, as im looking at that firm feel box, i just want to call them and ask which would be best for what i want

so, 2 questions
1 is this a good kit that basically has what i need?
2 which leafspring option do i go with, or do i pick something from somewhere else?

and thank you again, something that is all in one is perfect for me, as i dont really know what all goes into the whole suspension setup like i said.

[HPP]

That is a very complete kit. Probably one of the most inclusive ones on the market. The only pieces it seems to be missing is the master cylinder and steering box.  I have not used Just Suspension myself, but I have heard a fair amount of positive feedback on them on other mopar boards so they are probably a safe bet. For leaf springs, go with the 5 leaf option. With a 318 you aren't putting massive amounts of torque down to the ground and the 5 leaf set will be a little softer than the 6 leaf set.

[71wrenchhead]

thats what i figured, puttin it on order with my next check, not telling the wife at all 
cant wait to get a call   "what the hell is this huge box they are trying to give me, and where the hell am i supposed to put it!?!?!?!??!!"