Magnumforce..Whats your choice?

[RIDELIKEHELL]

Just wondering as I'm looking into buying a complete front end from Magnumforce soon & wanted to see what people have used around here & their results. I'm also adding a front disc brake kit which I've yet to pick. I have a 68 Charger R/T I'm getting built here & want a good road feel, lose some weight & don't want to spend more than needed(I know this stuff isn't cheap). So here's the page I'm sure you all are familiar with.

http://www.magnumforce.com/magnumforce_tubular_kmember.htm

I was also pondering just using a completely stock assembly with new bushings etc for alot of savings but will it be a looser ride?

any input.

thx

Marc

[defiance]

What sort of use do you intend for it? 
Personally, I like the look of the AlterKtion, and have heard *VERY* good things about it. 

[RIDELIKEHELL]

I'm going to cruise to shows but will beat on it I'm sure a wee bit like I do the Magnum now. Not concerned with much other than good braking & decent handling around town.

[RIDELIKEHELL]

What sort of use do you intend for it? 
Personally, I like the look of the AlterKtion, and have heard *VERY* good things about it. 

Looks like nice stuff..hmmmm?

[John_Kunkel]

The Magnum Force setup anchors the top of the coilover shock in the same hole in the inner fender panel that the original shock mounts in; this area is not made to handle suspension loads and needs reinforcement.

The Alterkation is a self-contained unit that mounts the coilover on the crossmember; this puts no stress on the inner fender panel.

[Big Sugar]

I have to Agree with John ,You'll need to make sure your shock towers are sound ! They could use the "XV Motorsport"  Braces to strengthen things up.
    MagnumForce's Tubular K member does look good Though.




Ron

[Charger-Bodie]

What sort of use do you intend for it? 
Personally, I like the look of the AlterKtion, and have heard *VERY* good things about it. 

alterkation all the way Bill Reilly is a very cool guy to deal with too

[Rack]

Excuse my ignorance, but the Alterktion setup does away with your steering box, correct? It changes to a different kind (rack & pinion?) of steering?

[Rolling_Thunder]

The Magnum Force setup anchors the top of the coilover shock in the same hole in the inner fender panel that the original shock mounts in; this area is not made to handle suspension loads and needs reinforcement.

The Alterkation is a self-contained unit that mounts the coilover on the crossmember; this puts no stress on the inner fender panel.

I agree...    MAgnumforce is more of a race only piece...     locating the coil-over in the stock shock placement kills the inner fenders over time...     Alterktion is the way to go...    Bill is a great guy and he'll set you up with what you need

[RIDELIKEHELL]

Thx guys! I believe shock towers are sound enough but if they are going to be comprimised over time then the AlterK is the way to go..plus the webpage is alot easier to piece a kit together!

thx again

[Lostsheep]

Whats the weight savings gain with the Alterkation kit? Is it anywhere as close to as much as the Magnum Force? I have been real interested in the Magnum Force for a while.

[Brock Samson]

  what's the price and weight differences?..
anyone know?..

[defiance]

Price, looks like the magnuforce is a bit cheaper.  Hard to compare because the package availability is different, but getting as close as I could:

Magnumforce-
-No powdercoat
-power steering rack
-QA1 single adjustable
-with swaybar
-no brakes
--$3,295

AlterKtion-
-No motor mounts (they're not even an option on the mf kit)
-Power steering
-no ps lines (not included with mf kit, so this makes best comparison)
-swaybar
-QA1 single adjustable
-No tow loop
-any spring rate
-oem column
-2-joint shaft
-no column bushing
-brakes removed
-$3,394

So as close as I can get them to identical, they're about $99 different. 

They both have claims in the 100# to 150# less weight range.

For me, several things were the lean me toward alterk -
1) no shock tower usage.  The shock tower was never engineered to sustain the weight of the car, and that's pretty much what happens with the magnumforce.  I could brace the shock towers, sure, but I've got one helluva lot of work to do on that car; if I can pay $100 extra bucks and get rid of that work, done.  And that's if mine were in good shape anyway - somewhere in the life of my car the passenger side tower was cut and re-attached... poorly.  So to use the magnumforce I'd have to have this completely rebuilt anyway.  With the alterk I can clean it up cosmetically and forget it.  I know, this is specific to me, but the general idea applies to everyone - applying much more force than was intended to hold up a critical component of the vehicle.
2) Motor mount availability.  My fab skills aren't really all that great, and as noted above, I've got enough work.  And I'm definitely not using a plate as recommended with the mf kit.  Motor mounts for my engine are available on the alterk
3) install ease.  I've heard several people who have said they had trouble getting the mf kits in.  minor fabrication or modification, usually, but still.  I've seen several reports of people installing alterks, and every single one I've seen so far has said all went as planned.
4) brake availability.  The standard 11" rotor kit available with alterk adds $300 to the price, and should be fine for my application.  The least expensive kit sold with the mf kit is in the $650 range.  I'm sure you could find it cheaper, but I doubt it'd be cheaper than $300.



Keep in mind I've never used either kit, so if I'm wrong, please do correct me - but I've been thinking about this and reading everything I could get my hands on for 6 months now (almost there, should be ordering in late june or july!  finally! ), so I think this is all pretty accurate.

[Lostsheep]

The only real MagnumForce issue that I have heard was it lowered his car 2" and it was a mother to align. The lowering I didnt really care about but it would cause a problem if I had already chosen my wheels and tire combo.

[John_Kunkel]

In the July 2007 issue of Mopar Muscle magazine they install an AlterK.

[Big Sugar]

All "K"Options I can come up with..Anyone else.

http://www.xvmotorsports.com/

http://www.magnumforce.com/

http://www.reillymotorsports.com/store/home.php?cat=255


http://www.hotrodsusa.com/store/cf.html

http://www.capautoproducts.com/

Ron

[defiance]

wow, that control freak one is new to me, and beautiful!  doesn't look like they have one that'll fit a '72 b-body, but it is truly pretty

The XV system is amazing looking, too, but I just can't come up with that much money... I'm really scratching and scrounging for the funds for the alterk

[Rack]

wow, that control freak one is new to me, and beautiful!  doesn't look like they have one that'll fit a '72 b-body, but it is truly pretty

The XV system is amazing looking, too, but I just can't come up with that much money... I'm really scratching and scrounging for the funds for the alterk

That's what I'm doing too. I just got the car dismantled so I still have a lot to do till any suspension is put back on it anyway. Gives me time to start saving pennies. All my money is currently going into my engine though.

[Rack]

Excuse my ignorance, but the Alterktion setup does away with your steering box, correct? It changes to a different kind (rack & pinion?) of steering?

Anyone? Please? Bueller? Bueller?

[defiance]

Well, it replaces (and includes) the steering box, so yes, the stock one comes out, and yes, it's r&p.

There's usually a GREAT set of install pics here
http://www.dodgecoronet.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=305
but the website's gallery isn't functioning right now...  Hopefully it'll be back up soon?

[Rack]

Thanks, Defiance. 

I'll keep checking that site so I can see the pics.

[defiance]

Actually, did a bit of digging, and it looks like the site changed their album software and the user didn't move the pics...  Sucks because I was hoping to use them as a reference when I finally got to mine (which is why I had it bookmarked in the first place

[Big Sugar]

Hey Guy's I sent a e-mail over to Ron at Magnum force with a few of the Questions mentioned here to date, And I got a very nice E-mail back today from Ron with more answers than the initial questions.
He's a True Mopar Guy thats for sure. Clearly Stands behind his work. Here's a Portion of what I received.

I'm sure that all the guys that make these other suspensions are great people and wonderful to deal with.  Accordingly the last thing I care to do is ridicule any of them and won't, however some of the topics covered in this forum such as shock tower reinforcement I don't think anybody knows the full story on.  The companies that integrate their upper shock tower mounts into their suspensions use a short coil over to accomplish this which shortens the suspensions travel.  Ours has more than 4 1/2 inches.  Stiffening any suspension pickup point is a good idea to eliminate any and all flex and we sell a forward strut kit to accomplish this which triangulates the entire front end of the car as well as tying in to the motor plate and creating a very rigid front end assembly.  Keep in mind that for many years we have installed these on cars, many of which are wheel standers, with absolutely no modification to the inner fender well and had them last thus far in excess of seven to eight years with no signs of structural failure.  This includes my own 69 Daytona Charger in which I have a 1400 hp all cast-iron 528 in.³ Siamese bore hemi with a 14-71 blower on top of it. Now that's some weight!  This is because the factory made that original shock tower area out of 1/8 inch material on B, E, and late model A-body cars. Still, adding forward struts to the front end of the car will not only make that mount more rigid but will also reduce flex of the front frame rails under hard acceleration or cornering. Something all of the suspensions in question can benefit from.



Some other key areas to address are things such as the fact that our lower control arms are located forward of the front axle centerline, similar to that of the original suspension, which gives maximum header clearance aft of that area.  You won't believe how easy it is to install a set of Hemi headers in an A-body for example.  We've worked closely with TTI  to evaluate the incorporation of their headers into our suspension systems with great results.



As for brakes we offer derivatives of 5 different Wilwood kits from lightweight drag set ups, all the way up to six piston 14 Inch road race brakes in solid, drilled and slotted, and powder coated or polished configurations.

We offer single or double adjustable coil overs from either Aldan or QA1.

Our sway bar uses massive billet aluminum clamps on an adjustable tubular 4130 chromoly splined unit with 4130 rod ends. 

We have spindles to lower the car 1 1/2" or 3 1/2".

We offer custom powder coating to help color-coordinate the whole package and add an aesthetic value to the superior construction.



Perhaps most important is the issue of materials and weld quality.  Our k-member does not simply span the entire front distance of the front of the car using a single piece of cut, mitered, and butt-welded mild steel or aluminum, but instead creates a series of multiple triangulated tubes to do so in a much larger span using superior materials like TIG welded 4130 chromoly which is substantially stronger than mild steel, allowing for an additional weight savings as well.  Adding our sway bar creates another solid connection that spans the entire front end of the car, as we use an outer housing and great looking billet clamp assembly rather than a bar that pivots independently inside of a pair of bushings.  This encases the sway bar itself entirely inside the housing. After you remove your original suspension take note that the only thing connecting the two frame rails is a thin piece of sheet metal known as the core support.  Now imagine tying it all back together with nothing more than a single piece of tubing spanning the entire width of the car. How much torsional rigidity do you think that offers?

The overall design leaves a phenomenal amount of clearance for big tube headers, shoebox style oil pans with a larger capacity and no increase in sump depth, as well as ease of oil pan removal as there are no materials running behind the sump of the pan. Imagine running 9 quarts of capacity and not have it hang below the k-member!  Milodon and Moroso make specific pans for Magnumforce Suspensions.



For the lower control arms we utilize 1-1/8" 4130 chromoly material in the Magnum Pro suspension and massive 1 1/4" material in the XRT version with chromoly Teflon lined rod ends rated from 28,000 to 40,000 pounds of radial load capacity.  No stainless here! These are the Rod ends you would see underneath the back of a Pro Stock car which speaks volumes for strength. I've actually been shocked to see that there are some companies out there that are making control arms out of extremely small 7/8 and 1 inch mild steel direct threaded material, resembling a design that one might see underneath a 2500 lb Street Rod. Our upper control arms do not require that you cut apart the original mounts to get them to fit either and we don't incorporate any General Motors aluminum parts into our suspensions.  Some of these were originally designed for a sub 3000 pound car with over a foot of aluminum small block engine setback.  In fact we have just recently had our own spindles cast right here in the US from materials that are up to 50% stronger than even the original spindles were.

All our suspensions are TIG welded as well which anyone who's ever done so knows mandates an extremely tight fit on all related components and also results in vastly superior strength and appearance.



Our suspensions have been used on cars built with/by/for Boyd Coddington, Barry White, Chip Foose, Jimmy Shine, Dick Landy, Troy Trepanier, Steve Strope, Street Concepts, Kenny Wayne Shepard, and Joe Rogan as well as featured on shows such as Wrecks to Riches, American Hot Rod, Monster Garage, Speed Shop, and Rides.



Our suspensions are the only ones licensed by DaimlerChrysler Corporation themselves and there's good reason for that.



Thanks very much,

Ron Jenkins

Magnumforce Inc.

408-559-6633

http://www.magnumforce.com



Ron

[scottmiller]

Wow... all these suspensions system look really nice, but they are some serious $$$.  I wish I could afford one.  Even if I could I would probably spend the money elsewhere on the car.

I am keeping in mind that Richard Petty did 200+ at Daytona with a factory torsion bar suspension.... so I will let mine eat. 

-Scott