71 GTX 440 six barrel four speed

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 bet this was a awesome car when new     love the 71 RR / GTX shape  

needs some  work now  ,    .......

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Plymouth-GTX-440-6-4-Speed/321688156565?_trksid=p2045573.c100034.m2102&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D28797%26meid%3Dc972fc3a95a84ae58314ced6d4840f72%26pid%3D100034%26rk%3D6%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D201304927832

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[polywideblock]

this guys selling a rebody "kit" for a real nice car      

he's even left the dash vin attached to a piece of dash so its still got the rivets

[hemi-hampton]

Somebody is going to have a rebody fake out there

[ws23rt]

Somebody is going to have a rebody fake out there

It's true   They will keep coming and the ability to identify original cars in the future will be harder because of it.

I get that bringing back a car from the dead to enjoy having one to drive is reason enough to make a replica.

Who knows what the future will bring anyway?  It may be fun for some to unravel a sorted history of a car.  That after all seems to be a big part of the hobby.( for now at least ).

[F8-4life]

Rough life for such a cool mopar.
Maybe because it was such a stand out car even back then it was also a target for thieves.

[JB400]

Unfortunately, it is still a target for thieves.

[Bandit72]

I hate to stir the pot...and I'm sure it's been hashed out here a million times aready...but when does a restored car stop being the same car? Best example I can think of right now is LEE1...in my opinion. That car is a rebody. They replaced EVERYTHING. But even on smaller jobs. If I had a 69 R/T HEMI car but was missing the original engine/ tranny/ drive/train....interior was shot, every panel is replaced with re-pop metal...even though I have a VIN and a fender tag is it really still a 69 R/T? Not in my book it's not.

[ws23rt]

I hate to stir the pot...and I'm sure it's been hashed out here a million times aready...but when does a restored car stop being the same car? Best example I can think of right now is LEE1...in my opinion. That car is a rebody. They replaced EVERYTHING. But even on smaller jobs. If I had a 69 R/T HEMI car but was missing the original engine/ tranny/ drive/train....interior was shot, every panel is replaced with re-pop metal...even though I have a VIN and a fender tag is it really still a 69 R/T? Not in my book it's not.

I don't think it's stirring the pot to discuss this. We deal with terms like original, rebuilt, restored, refurbished, etc. all the time. A lot of discussion comes from the meaning of the terms.

When a car is new it stops being that when the miles are added. The first oil change blows "originality".  From new forward their are no defined points that make a car fit one of the terms we use to describe it's transition.  Even we ourselves go through a similar change as we age. Their are very few traces of who we are that are original. If one has a heart transplant I think we still believe that person to be the same person ---Now if we were able to do head transplants would that be a rebody? No?

IMO traces of original DNA of a car such as the vin tag and any body stampings etc. will have value for the future of the hobby. If those items get so disconnected from a car that it's unclear where they belong-- then I think that car has passed  A car that carries those bits of DNA forward are zombies. They will cause questions about the car as long as someone tries to answer them.  This is the dilution of the value of these cars as I see it.

If a situation comes up where the identifiers are so ambiguous that the restorer is stressed about which way to go I say let the car die. Don't try to stretch a lie for a few possible dollars. It will cause stress for who knows how many down the line.

Just finish the car the way you like it and get a new vin/legit document.----Move on---

[Cncguy]

Spot weld cutters are so nice! Would have done those parts some good.

[ws23rt]

Looking through the pictures at what's left of this car all I see are crusty bones. The fender tag and the vin tag seem to have faired better.

If a car were to be built and those tags were to be used they would be the only connection to the cars past.  I think that point and history should follow what someone may build from it.

If a builder/restorer were to go forward with this and not include the history we see here then they are perhaps hoping to make a buck down the line.----Would this not be a bit scammy?

So as I see it this comes down to --what are the value of vin tags and the like when they are unattached to a vehicle as these are.
We have all talked about just those being sold alone and most seem to agree that it is not right/it is wrong---for all of us.  What we have here IMO is just that----

I try to look at this sort of thing as a buyer down the line.  If I saw this car restored (and knew the history/vin and fender tag only)I would see it as a driver not a rare collectable. And the point is why bother at this point in a restoration to push a fraud forward for all the potential  drama.

Hey all you smart scammers out there.---Use your smarts to make a good living without the stress of being found out.

I told my son years ago---If you look to make a few bucks on the street you will forever be looking back on where that money came from. -----He does well and without the stress--

[F8-4life]

Just a random thought while looking through these pictures.
Would the bid be higher or lower or any differant if the parts, say had been painted black?
I think the bidders like seeing the green and rust.

[Chargerguy74]

Is there not a way to revert these pics to original and undo the blackouts to reveal the VIN? I thought this was possible even after the edits were saved?