Opinions of this '68? A possible purchase for Limey?

[limey]

Hi guys, there was a thread running the end of last week where I asked your opinions on a blue '68. As I said at the end of the thread, I had my eye on another - again '68.
Anyhow I have now got some pics sent to me.
Here goes.

The vendor has had it since 1982, it was rebuilt in 1994, new rear quarters, new trunk floor, engine rebuild etc.
It has been garaged ever since.


It has a 318, 727 auto.











Price: £11995  ($20950) - I know that might seem expensive in the states, but don't forget the rarity factor over here!!

The bad bit, is it doesn't have it's MOT - (Government Test of Roadworthyness) - The steering drop arm was worn and the replacement one has fouled the headers and consequently the exhaust has split and is blowing.

Not a big deal, but it makes it a trailer job to bring it back from London to the North (where I am)

I'm not worrying about it being just a 318, remember I want it for a daily driver, (see Chargerbill's "getting too old for Hp" thread)

So what do you think? First impressions? Anything not right?
Thanks guys, Limey

[41husk]

What does it cost to ahve a Charger shipped over to you from the states?  I just think you could get much more car for that money overhere.  For $21,000 I would sell mine.  Lets say it cost $5,000 to have a car shipped, you can get a charger in that shape in the $12,000 price range ship it over and still have paid less.  You copuld get a turn key car in the low 20s and Have$25,000 in it and have your driver ready to go.

[89MOPAR]

 Ask why the trunk is painted black, check the drivers footwell for rust thru.
Offer that price when it passes MOT, if not , discount.  
Probably more MOT problems you don't know about that he is not disclosing, or he is ignorant of.  

[limey]

I've already looked into the cost of importing a $17k 383 Charger.
You would be surprised... 
Vehicle Price $17,000

Collection Allowance
$700
 
Transport to Nearest Port
$500

Shipping and Marine Insurance
$1,450
 
Price on UK Docks (sub total)
$19,650

Convert to £ £1 =$1.70
£11,600

UK Freight  Forwarding costs
£250

Car Levy
£1,160

VAT
£2,233
 
Total Ex Docks £15,243 ($26,636)

Thats not including a registration fee, and the modifications (SVA/homologation work) which need to be done to pass its MOT. Probably another £500 at least ($873)...
So...it seems best to look for what is already here, and I can actually go and see it, test drive it etc...!

[41husk]

Man, That is steep!  That may not be a bad price for a 318 project

[tan top]

hi nick , looks pretty good from here , what i would check is the under side of the the car , to see how good the  repairs were at the  rear , how  the flange of chassis rail and trunk floor is, has it been seam sealed properly / under sealed ,  the same for the quarter panel flanges etc, because if it has not, 12 years of  being exposed to British weather conditions they might be starting to rust badly. check all chassis rails  floor pans, A- post  /  inner & outer cowel   panel , because once they start to rot there it is a night  mere  to put right ( to do it properly strip every thing out ) takes time. have a good look around the rear window / roof for rust from in side the trunk . looks like is got power discs, think it might have been originally G4 gold  looks good

[JMF]

Limey, I agree with comments on here, looks a little too expensive, even taking in to account the rarity factor over here, do you buy Classic American Magazine? I think for that money you could at least get a big block and one in better condition, my Dad is an MOT tester, has his own garage, so if the seller is stuck he could always bring it to our garage, My dad has experience with American cars, he works on my 2 Mustangs and he did this Shelby, see links, the other month, plus i'd like to have a look round a Dodge Charger up close

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=9/25616092238.jpg&s=x1

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=9/2561610599.jpg&s=x1

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=9/25616113779.jpg&s=x1

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=9/25616131488.jpg&s=x1

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=9/25616151046.jpg&s=x1

[limey]

Thanks for the response...Tan top? just out of interest, how do you know it was Gold?
JMF - thanks for the offer. When you are looking at the possibility of driving a V8 Range Rover on a 600 mile trip with a car trailer, to see a car you may not want to buy, it is worth a lot to have the offer of someone who is impartial and knows his stuff to have a look at it first! (and dare I say it on this board - lovely motor! )
Cheers!
As for the price, this one was advertised in Classic American alongside a '68 big block for £14995. - now sold I might add!
Also as a reference, this is up for £8500 ($14843)on the Mopar Muscle Association UK website.....


Nick

[limey]

Click below to see more of the $14843 black '70..

http://www.mopartalk.co.uk/mopartalk/viewtopic.php?t=7087

Limey

[ChargerAndy]

Hey Limey, I think the 68 looks pretty good and agree with TanTop's opinions. I wouldn't go for the '70....... it looks like it's been modified too much IMO. I think it's better to get a non-molested car...... when I got mine I found out what molested means  but I survived it and got through the process.
    What amazes me is you dudes in England driving Chargers around. When I was there for 2 weeks in 1991, I didn't see an american car anywhere and the rental car was a puny piece of crap...... which actually was a good thing because the roads where so skinny and since there where no shoulders, I can't imagine driving a Charger there unless maybe if it were on the "dual carriageway" sheesh, that name always cracks me up  what part of "up North" are you from? Good luck, Andy 

[Silver R/T]

you could have 440 R/T clone shipped over there for that much money IMO

[tan top]

(1) the under hood picture ,gold paint showing through a scratch on the passenger side inner fender on the shock tower,
(2) paint flaking off the core support drivers side in front of the battery,
(3) drivers side roof pillar a little strip of gold paint showing between the  upper roof rail weather strip stainless moulding & windshield pillar stainless moulding.
the rear arches on that 70 charger looks to have been modefide to me.
i have  put an arrow on your pictures ,below

[tan top]

picture  number 2

[limey]

You should be a detective, Tan Top!!!
I was so busy looking at the motor I didn't look anything like as close!!
Yeah, the '70 looks tubbed and pretty rough. (No offence to the owner if you are on here - you say so yourself! )
I only put it on as a price comparison, not because I'm considering it.

As for the posts about buying in the states and shipping over here, I guess the bottom line is can you get a better charger than this for $12000? 

Because a $12000 car will cost me almost $21000 when it is finally parked up on my drive, once the Car Levy and Tax etc are taken into account.....

Up until quite recently, a "historic" car could be imported for a lot less, but whether you import an '06 Charger or a '69 Daytona makes no difference now as to how much the govenment bends you over the hood of your new purchase at Southampton docks!!


So , a new slant to the thread question..

Is this car worth $12,000?

Cheers, Limey

[Jon Smith]

probably about the going rate over here these days, if theres no rot
theres something to be said for being able to see it in person, and not having the hassle of shipping it over

[JMF]

Limey where abouts in London is the 1968?

[limey]

Thats right Jon...
over here in the uk,
Rough but a runner:
£7000-9000 ($12,234 - $15,730)
Solid, decent paint, but still looking its age/small block:
£10000-13000 ($17,435 - $22,717)
Solid, decent but still looking its age/big block
£13000 - 17000 ($22,717 - $29,707)
Numbers matching, smart Big Block:
£17000 - 21000 ($29,707 - $36,702)
Numbers matching, restored Big Block:
£21000 - up ($36,702 - up)

For example, this really nice recently restored '70 Charger 500 which is up with Alan Carrington cars, for sale at £30,000 - $52,440
Last month it was only up for £25k -$43,694 - thats quite some price hike, but then thats the market...








 
Here is the info on the car........


Vin.  XP29LOG210061
Breakdown.X = Charger. P = Premium. 29 = 2dr. Sports Hard Top. L = 383 cid 2BC 8Cyl.
0 = 1970.  G = St. Louis, MO. 210061  Production sequence number.

This 1970 Charger 500 is completely original Californian car which has lived most of its life in southern Spain, it has an elderbrock hi-rise inlet manifold with a new 750 four barrel Holly carb along with a header exhaust system , power brakes , power stearing , new Torque thrust D American racing alloys shod with new B.F.Goodrich raised white letter tyres, NEW FRONT POWER DISC BRAKE  and new MASTER CYLINDER.  It has factory fitted Air Conditioning , new chrome and a fresh bare metal re-spray in its original livery of FF4 Light metallic green , and a unmolested dark green bucket interior along with the original dark green vinyl roof , the car is taxed and MOT,d and fully serviced and restoration costs in excess of £ 14,500 (about $23,000)and has just won "BEST AT SHOW" Belgian Mopar Nationals 26-06-05 .



Body code plate N95  R11  Y16  26  G33 H51 J25 L31 M21 M31 V1F A01 A04 B51
C16 C55 FF4 C6F8 EF8 324 047169 E61 D32 XP 29 LOG 210061

I hope this post gives some of you guys an idea of what your car is worth if you ever end up selling it to someone in Europe!!!
(BTW I am NOT looking at the green car above....WAY out of what I can afford at the moment...)
Aah....we can but dream!
Limey

[limey]

Hi, JMF.....its not actually in London, its in Bracknell......but anywhere south of Cambridge is London to me....

[JMF]

Yeah there's been posts about Alan Carrington before, when I was looking for a Mustang I went to his garage to look at his cars, they are very nice but he is way too expensive, that 1970 used to be £20k about a year ago and I believe he has had it for abouit 4 years so i'm not sure how he can justify putting it up £10k

[limey]

I guess he deals in a premium quality car, and most of the people who buy from him just want the car and have plenty of money. Also, he appears to be an enthusiast who is happy to keep the cars rather than sell them...its more an indication of the rocketing price of top end Mopars, and the subsequent price hike further down the scale. (see the other post bouth crazy money for chargers)
L
PS - also he has put £14500 in the car, and that has been over time, so that may account for it.
Still too much $$$ though!

[is_it_EVER_done?]

The pics of the 68 look darn good - tic-toc-tach, console, passenger mirror, wood grain steering wheel, power steering and brakes. The chrome on the bumpers looks bad, so I would pay close attention to how good the rest of the chrome is inside and out.

I would check on how good it looks in person (straight body, decent paint, non pitted chrome), check on the condition of the upper door pads as they aren't reproduced. Is it disk or drum brakes, does it have a swaybar, are there any rust issues, and general condition of the drivetrain and body (inside, out, and underneath), do the headlight doors work, are the car door hinges in good shape or do they have up and down play in them, crawl inside the trunk and look at the underside of the package tray/rear glass areas for any rot, and make sure it doesn't leak like a sieve (there are quite a few rags on the garage floor where it looks like it is normally parked.

just remember that a 318 in a heavy Charger gets annoying after awhile due to it's lack of power. On the plus side, it could be stroked to 400 inches with huge torque, for a reasonable amount of money should you decide that you want some power.

Overall, the pictures should warrant a personal look. Just make sure that you write down EVERY point that you want to check out before you go see it! Otherwise it's easy to be blinded by the overall package instead of being analytical.

When it's all said and done, if you want it, offer him about 10% to 15% less than you are willing to pay. Use any issues you found while going through your list of points to check, and the fact that it's a "lowly" 318 car, as bargaining points - I only point all this out due to the fact that you seem to be willing to add more value than I think you should, due to the fact that the car is local. Remember, restoration costs will be substantially higher due to your location, which could easily eat up any savings on VAT, shipping. etc.

I certainly hope everything works out for you. The pics look good. If it checks out (and the price is right), you will certainly have a cool car.