Thermostat Question:

[Captain D]

Hello all,

I just had a quick question to run by you guys, if I may please. Basically, we put our 69' Charger in a relatively short parade today and everything performed flawlessly with no problems. The only thing I was curious to ask you about was:

For 100% of actual driving/cruises, the temperature gauge norm always reads exactly 170 degrees. However, when actually driving very slow in the parade setting, the temps ever so slowly began to rise since we were not getting greater airflow through the radiator. For about the last 15-20 minutes of the parade, I noticed the gauge slowly increase to approximately the 200 degree range. After the parade was over, I was anxious to increase the speed of the car and the temps naturally dropped back down to the normal 170 degree reading. Since I tend to wrack my brain over these things, do you feel that there was any damage done to the head gaskets, etc. when the gauge was reading the 200 degrees for the final 15 minutes (approximate) of the parade?

For my 383, we have a 3-core aluminum radiator with a 180 degree thermostat (running 50/50 Prestone pre-mix coolant), but I probably should invest in an electric radiator fan before the next parade event...

Thank you for any and all input,
Aaron

[c00nhunterjoe]

From what i recall you only have the factory gauges. No mechanical gauges right? The stock gauges are not what i would call "accurate" to say the least...lol. but, assuming you got up to 200, no worries the motor is fine. Your issue sounds like a clear case of airflow. You have more then enough radiator to cool your mild motor. I cant remember what fan/shroud combination is on your car. Sounds like you need a different shroud or a better fan. I wouldnt jump to an electric fan just yet.

[c00nhunterjoe]

I thought this was your car. Do you have any idea how many phone calls i got today asking if it was me or someone i knew! 

[A383Wing]

what fan blade and-or fan clutch are you running?

[flyinlow]

Probably did not hurt it. Later model BB Mopars had 195* thermostats anyway.

Improving your cooling system would be a good idea long term.

.

[Captain D]

Hi there Joe (my 'stunt double')! That's us alright (the girlfriend and I) after this very same parade I'm stressing over, lol,  . That's funny that you mentioned that - I get asked the same thing about you...asking if I live up near Shrewsbury, Pa.  

But, yes, you're correct - all factory style gauges. As for the fan/shroud details, I can get the specifics and post back again shortly as we're just about to head out the door now. 'Thank you' for the replies thus far, guys and I'll be sure to keep in touch...
Best regards,
Aaron

[Captain D]

Okay, on my way out but some quick info: 22'' inch aluminum, 3 core, radiator with stock/factory 383 fan. And, the shroud:

A 3'' universal chrome fan shroud (I realize not the greatest, but available at the time):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Universal-radiator-fan-shroud-3-chrome-steel-cooling-ford-chevy-dodge-gm-chevro/250980708290?_trksid=p2050601.c100085.m2372&_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20140211132617%26meid%3D8273277049910846427%26pid%3D100085%26prg%3D20140211132617%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D4%26sd%3D250980708290%26clkid%3D8273279041275547752&_qi=RTM1562569

In a worst case scenario, how can one tell (or what can I do to test) if there could potentially be an issue?
Thank you again,
Aaron

[A383Wing]

here is a test I always use.....with engine idling, if a rag will stay put on the front grille by itself, airflow should be good.

I also use the non-thermal fan clutch which is engaged at low speeds to provide the most fan RPM.....also use fan that has enough pitch in the blades to maximize airflow as well

[c00nhunterjoe]

I am running a stock 3 row, 26" truck radiator and shroud with a pep boys special flex fan. I have a spacer on the pump to get the fan closer to the radiator. No issues running warm. Rock solid on 180.

[Captain D]

Thank you gents for the replies and info,

A383Wing - In your photo of the fans, the one on the left is exactly what mine looks like + the number of blades. Also, good tip on the rag test - I will try that shortly.

As for the 200 degree temps, in general, I was doing some searches and (surprisingly) I've read a lot of posts which stated that those temps (200 degrees) actually isn't a hot average and may be closer to what perhaps a normal range/average should be. Its when it starts getting over 210 + is when one should be concerned; especially if the temps doesn't cool down with greater speed.

With that being stated, I also read where a member noted that a 'normal' driving temp should never be under 180 degrees as the oil wouldn't be hot enough inside the block. As a result, cause internal block issues. Is that right? In that case, I probably should change out my 180 degree thermostat to a 195 (190* if available anywhere...?) on account that mine reads a constant 170 degrees when cruising. While its no problem making the thermostat swap, and if this info is accurate, I just wish that I would have known earlier as I was originally informed that a 180 thermostat with a solid 170 degree number reading were both perfect,   Do you feel that (based on my current numbers) that I should swap out the 180 thermostat with a 195 degree thermostat?

Thank you again for any input,
Aaron

[c00nhunterjoe]

Stay with a 180 stat. The problems come if you go under 160. 180 is ideal. 200 is too hot in my opinion. If you change stats then i would go to a high flow 180 but coolant flow is not the problem in your case. Airflow is. You said you have the fan on the left. Does it have a clutch on it or is it direct drive? Not to doubt you, but are the blades facing the right way? And a few shots of your shroud would help to see how the fan sits in relation to the shroud and radiator. I looked through all the pics ive taken of your car and i have no good angles.

[Cooter]

Chrysler also had a TSB on "overheating" back in 1968-9. Wanna guess how mopar fixed the guages reading on the high side??
Yep, they replaced the factory guage with "NORMAL" range moved up higher/closer to the "hot" side.

I think you might need to replace the fan clutch.

[c00nhunterjoe]

I would also reccomend confirming the actual temperature with a mechanical gauge or infared gun.

[Captain D]

I certainly appreciate all of the info once more,  . Many thanks Joe for all of the info on acquiring a better fan shroud for my 22'' aluminum radiator (Champion Radiators). I will be hunting for one, but if anyone recommends anything specific or has a good used one up for sale - I'm all ears.

Just as a side note, below were just a few of the threads that I had initially saved that discussed 200* temps being surprisingly in the okay average (I was just nervous about possibly messing something up w/ my engine by running the approximate 200* for 15-20 minutes and I was looking to see if I was okay if others experienced similar encounters, more or less). On the other hand, I suppose as long as I actually drive the car to generate greater air flow, and no more parades for awhile, I should be okay in order to keep my temps down,  . Anyhow, here they are (some 383 and some 440):

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,70221.0.html
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,64181.0.html
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,17444.msg192332/topicseen.html#msg192332
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php?topic=32309.0;wap2

Thank you all again for the input,
Aaron

[c00nhunterjoe]

Just to touch up on what we spoke about on the phone. Parades at 200 will not hurt your car. However, with the amount of surface area your radiator offers, it shouldnt go over 180. The problem was clear based on your shroud not even covering the fan or radiator itself. Its more of a finger protector then a shroud. A suitable stock style shroud should solve your problem. I have a few local mopar nuts that should have one. I will check with them and see if we can accuire a used one local. 

[Captain D]

Hi Joe, sounds awesome - thanks man!   I look forward to keepin' in touch and this is true, "The problem was clear based on your shroud not even covering the fan or radiator itself. Its more of a finger protector then a shroud." Not only a funny statement, but a true one at that, lol.

[1974dodgecharger]

add a pusher fan to help?  I had temps in 220 before in AZ heat when it was 115 or so in stop and go traffic and with pusher fan I was able to stay under 200 in stop and go traffic.

Do all General Lees look the same?  No. 1 on the side, orange, and confederate flag on top?  Man, I swear the person who owns this car is all over the world driving it at all parades....

[Captain D]

Do all General Lees look the same?  No. 1 on the side, orange, and confederate flag on top?  Man, I swear the person who owns this car is all over the world driving it at all parades....

To answer your question, lol, there are actually a variety of nuances in each of the eras that are different. You have: the Georgia, early California, late California, the two Reunions, and the 2005/2007 remakes. While G.L. owners can certainly mix-match eras, its always nice to see consistency that represents one particular era. For mine, I aimed for the early-to-mid California era. 

Thank you for the reply. Ouch, 220 degrees. Sure, I will definitely keep that idea in mind - thanks man. We're in the process of getting a better shroud installed and see how it may improve the situation. I'll be sure to post updates as things progress.
Best regards,
Aaron  

[c00nhunterjoe]

Oh i definatley mixed, mismatched, and added a whole lot of "personality" to mine...lol. 

[Captain D]

As things are in lieu of trying to zone in on my cooling question, I was just curious to see if anyone has this thermostat relay kit installed. If so, any pros/cons feedback? Here are two links:

http://www.amazon.com/PROCOMP-SINGLE-ELECTRIC-THERMOSTAT-RELAY/dp/B004M5LGLQ#productDetails

http://www.championradiators.com/Thermostat-Relay-Kit-185/170

Thanks again for any and all input,
Aaron