broadcast sheet question, strange code

[Lord Warlock]

Does anyone know what a 7 means if it is on the broadcast between the N88 and N96 fields?  There is a field that has no identifier between the two, and my sheet has a 7 typed in there, never have figured out what it meant. 

if you go to the old webpage i did a long time ago, and scroll down to the bottom, there is a scan of the broadcast sheet there.  http://home.comcast.net/~natgregory/ChargerRT.htm and can see for yourself what i'm talking about.

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Ahhh ha!!  That is the little known N97 noise reduction package for '69

More commonly found on CA ordered cars but was an option available across the country.

PS---me thinks you already asked this question  

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,21384.0.html

And...

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,53661.0.html

And...

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,50351.0.html

[cdr]

Ahhh ha!!  That is the little known N97 noise reduction package for '69

More commonly found on CA ordered cars but was an option available across the country.

PS---me thinks you already asked this question  

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,21384.0.html

And...

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,53661.0.html

And...

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,50351.0.html

dang your good 

[bill440rt]

dang your good 

TOO good, actually. 

[Lord Warlock]

damn, i gotta lay off the drugs, forgot i even asked that before.... thats what i get for staying off the site for so long between posting episodes.  

thanks anyway....lol.

A previous owner must have swapped the dual snorkel air breather for one without the snorkels.  When i got mine it had the round breather without snorkels.

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

It is also possible it rolled through with that option being missed.....I have a few cars that have J45 hood pins on the original window stickers but non actually installed on the car.....

[buckeyecharger]

Just 6T9,

I got one for you, since we're on the topic of air cleaners? My 69 383 HP (#'s matching) has a pie pan that says "383 Four Barrel" and is orange. Why doesn't it say "383 Magnum"?

Thanks,

[69CoronetRT]

I got one for you, since we're on the topic of air cleaners? My 69 383 HP (#'s matching) has a pie pan that says "383 Four Barrel" and is orange. Why doesn't it say "383 Magnum"?

Is it an automatic or four speed?

[tan top]

I got one for you, since we're on the topic of air cleaners? My 69 383 HP (#'s matching) has a pie pan that says "383 Four Barrel" and is orange. Why doesn't it say "383 Magnum"?

Is it an automatic or four speed?

yeah
remember something about this before    has your car got A/C ?

[buckeyecharger]

Automatic and AC. unsilenced air cleaner.

[69CoronetRT]

Automatic and AC. unsilenced air cleaner.

69 Chargers with automatics did not get the 335 horse HP Magnum engine. They got the 330 horse.

69 Chargers with a four speed did get the 335 Magnum.

No 69 B body with A/C, regardless of transmission, got the 335 horse engine. All recieved the 330 horse.

Contrary to a lot of incorrect information out there, VIN code H and sales code E63 only tell you the car came with a 383-4bbl. It does not tell you which version of the engine came in the car. There was the A body 383-4, the B and C body non HP version and the B body HP version. All coded H and E63 yet all were different asemblies.

[Dino]

A 5hp difference?  How weird.  What were the real world figures on those really?

[cdr]

Automatic and AC. unsilenced air cleaner.

69 Chargers with automatics did not get the 335 horse HP Magnum engine. They got the 330 horse.

69 Chargers with a four speed did get the 335 Magnum.

No 69 B body with A/C, regardless of transmission, got the 335 horse engine. All recieved the 330 horse.

Contrary to a lot of incorrect information out there, VIN code H and sales code E63 only tell you the car came with a 383-4bbl. It does not tell you which version of the engine came in the car. There was the A body 383-4, the B and C body non HP version and the B body HP version. All coded H and E63 yet all were different asemblies.

well today is not a loss! i learned something,thanx

[Just 6T9 CHGR]

Just 6T9,

I got one for you, since we're on the topic of air cleaners? My 69 383 HP (#'s matching) has a pie pan that says "383 Four Barrel" and is orange. Why doesn't it say "383 Magnum"?

Thanks,

Left that one for Doug who is well versed in this topic

[buckeyecharger]

Thanks Doug, so besides the 5hp, what is the difference in the design of these two engines? Is it the block, the crank, heads, I always thought and was told my 383 was an HP motor. Yes, it has the H and E63 code, I also have the large radiator. I always thought that there was the 383, 2 barrel- non-HP and then the 383, 4 barrel- Hp motor. I learned something today too!

[69CoronetRT]

Thanks Doug, so besides the 5hp, what is the difference in the design of these two engines? Is it the block, the crank, heads, I always thought and was told my 383 was an HP motor. Yes, it has the H and E63 code, I also have the large radiator. I always thought that there was the 383, 2 barrel- non-HP and then the 383, 4 barrel- Hp motor. I learned something today too!

Block, crank and heads were all the same.

The basic general differences between the 69 B body 330 and 335 were:
cam and valve springs from the 440HP assembly
windage tray
carb (AVS on HP vs Holley) I have run across a Charger BS that shows there was a carb switch late in the year but for how long or the reason...I don't know. Research continues....
Silenced vs unsilenced air cleaner canister.
You'll see references to HP exhaust manifolds. There was no difference in the 4bbl HP vs non HP manifold. There were only 2bbl and 4bbl manifolds.

[hemigeno]

carb (AVS on HP vs Holley) I have run across a Charger BS that shows there was a carb switch late in the year but for how long or the reason...I don't know. Research continues....

Hi Doug!     Your comment got me to digging around in some paperwork here, and oh boy, is it confusing!

There were multiple changes made to the 383-4 B-body carburetor lists during the model year - one change even happened on 7/26/68, before production actually began.  I tried to figure out what the codes should have been before that change, but it needed too much guesswork so I'd rather not speculate.  It's still impossible to say how long it took to implement any production-run changes.  The second change was made to the engineering manual on 12/16/68, but like usual, there was a transition time before the production line saw the new carbs.  Even the transmittal document used when the engineering change was sent to the assembly plants shows the "Effective Date to be determined".

Here is the revised application chart as of 12/16/68, for all B-body models unless noted otherwise:

Brand/Number/Build Code  --  Application
Carter/4615/77 -- Manual transmission and no air conditioning
Carter/4711/98 -- Manual transmission with air conditioning
Holley/4440/38 -- Automatic transmission and no air conditioning (all R/W/X models EXCEPT 'Bee & 'Runner)
Carter/4682/95 -- Automatic transmission and no air conditioning (only 'Bee & 'Runner)
Carter/4638/91 -- Automatic transmission with air conditioning


It appears that prior to that last change, the 4440 Holley carb was to be used on automatic 'Bee and 'Runner cars that had air conditioning.  I guess they initially figured the Magnum engine could handle the same carb - even with A/C - as the non-HP engine.  After that date, all the auto&air WM/RM cars got the same carburetor as the rest of the B-body models.

What carb code does your late-built "exception" have listed?   

[69CoronetRT]

Geno,

I'm out of town so I don't have access to the sheet. I'll check when I get home.

IIRC, the Charger BS I have shows the B body non HP assembly, which eariler in the year codes for the Holley, codes for an AVS indicating a change at some point late in the year. I do not recall if the car is an A/C car or not. I don't know if there is a TSB that addresses the specific change. D69-14-1 (Issued 2-12-69 http://www.hamtramck-historical.com/images/TSBs/1969/D69-14-1%20page1.jpg) addresses the 4440 but not specifically. It is a little confusing in their use of the term HP.

At some point, we should put our heads together and come up with a grid showing the B body engine assembly numbers, model applications with transmissions, SPDs and carbs to see what we can determine for changes.

[69CoronetRT]

I went through my B body 383 BS tonight and here's what I came up with compared to Geno's list:

Carter/4615/77 -- Manual transmission and no air conditioning. 925 engine assembly code. 335 HP. Available in all 69 B bodies.

Carter/4711/98 -- Manual transmission with air conditioning 897 engine assembly 330 horse. Avail in all B bodies
Holley/4440/38 -- Automatic transmission and no air conditioning (all R/W/X models EXCEPT 'Bee & 'Runner) 900 engine assembly. 330 horse
Carter/4682/95 -- Automatic transmission and no air conditioning (only 'Bee & 'Runner) 926 engine assembly 335 horse HP
Carter/4638/91 -- Automatic transmission with air conditioning The 899 330 horse engine assembly. All B body Autos with A/C. I only have one example of the 899 assembly with 91 carb. SPD is 616. This is the carb change I was referring to. An 899 assembly from 515 (and all earlier examples) still had the 38 carb so the change took place sometime in May/June of '69

It appears the 899 (Auto with A/C) assembly used the 4440/38 carb up until May/June when the 91 carb starts showing up.



Does anyone else have information on May/June 1969 built Auto with A/C B bodies and carb numbers?

OR

Auto without A/C 900 engine assemblies?

So for 69....

B body 383 four speeds, regardless of the model, R*, W* and XP, got the 925 335 horse HP assembly
B Body 383 four speeds with A/C, regardless of the model, got the 897 330 horse assembly.
B body 383 automatics with A/C, regardless of the model, got the 899 330 horse assembly
B body 383 automatics (Except RM and WM) got the 900 330 horse assembly
RM and WM 383 automatics got the 926 335 HP assembly

[hemigeno]

Hey Doug, are you going to the MCACN show in a few weeks?

[69CoronetRT]

Hey Doug, are you going to the MCACN show in a few weeks?

Regrettably no. Fall is a hard time for me to get away.