Any Suggestions for a 13 Sec. 1/4 mile. on street tires?

[Brock Samson]

    OK,
i got my slips here from Samoa's drags...

but first some specs:

  My rebuilt 446 six-pack engine (stock six pack cam) was dynoed at the flywheel at 503 HP. and 510 TQ. with a leaky LS-6 carb from a 454 on a Weiland Stealth, now the carb is a 770 street Avenger on the same Stealth, it  has a 727 with shift kit. TTI 3 " headers, with cross over, pinion snubber, front discs brakes with the bias adjust under the seat and MSD 6-L with Billet Distrib. car weighs exactly 3,700 Lbs. without me.
   My plans were to go for the six-pack induction and reinstall the A/C and add torque boxes but $ and time became an issue. Now I'm looking at investing in some serious upgrades to reach my original goal of a flat 13 seconds in the quarter on street tires.

now here are last week's time slips:

the two where i didn't break traction show    14.371 @ 91.46 MPH
and...                                                        14.579 @ 96.12 





so i have questions?.. 

what gears and/or other improvments, would be optimum to get a flat 13. sec run on street tires? the Charger needs to be tractable in heavy traffic and on steep hills.

   I'm willing to invest some $ to change gear sets and/or even invest in a gear vendors O.D. with a shortend drive shaft, last I investigated a  few years ago it was a $ 2 K proposition. just for the G.V.
  I'm open to your suggestions and thank you all in advance.

BTW: i cut the lights @...

0.736
0.713
0.709
0.770

     what's a good, ball park, competitive, reaction time?.



Dave. aka Strat, Brock etc..

[firefighter3931]

Dave, the power numbers for your car are out of line with it's performance. The speed is off by at least 10mph....it should be trapping at 108-110 mph if it was truly making 500hp. The MPH is generally a good indicator of how much power the engine is making. 

Ricky (70 6pkrt) has an e-headed 446, 6-pack, headers, custom solid cam and his made 491hp on the Mopar Engines West dyno which is right about i thought it would make. Ricky had asked before the engine went on the pump and i said 500hp....i was off a little.  His car runs right at 13 flat (108mph) with street tires and a 4 spd....so there's room for improvement.  

The point is, you need to improve the power output and transfer it to the ground to go faster...simple as that. 

What were the 60 ft times like ?
what were the 660 ft times ? what MPH ?



Ron

[Brock Samson]

Thanks Ron I knew you'd step right up!



What were the 60 ft times like ?               
                                                  2.188
                                                  2.236


what were the 660 ft times ? what MPH ?


                                                 9.273   @ 77.17
                                                 9.272   @ 77.98          am i reading these right?. 


did i mention the car has a bone stock one legger 8-3/4 with 323 gears?.. S.S. Springs?..
oh, and solid motor mounts too BTW:..
there was an extra 100 LBs in the trunk plus my 185 pounds... 


 
   
 

[firefighter3931]

Dave, the 60ft times are killing you. You should be able to get them into the 1.80 range which will help tremendously. For every tenth you trim off the 60ft ET you will see 2 tenths at the big end. Based on that you would see close to a second drop in ET if the chassis is working like it should. 

The gearing is horrible for what you're trying to do and the 1 legger isn't helping at all.  I don't know how much stall speed you have but generally speaking a looser converter will help bigtime with the launch. 

The 6-pack cam is pretty mild but it should pull descent to 5500 rpm or so. I don't know what the car weighs....but for gods sake empty out the trunk !   

100 lbs is a tenth in elapsed time    A sticky tire will also help....if it's spinning off the line then you're losing valuable time.

I would start with the rear end and get a 3.91 suregrip in there. Depending on the converter that you have....swap that out and get some descent tires. Once the chassis and launch are sorted out then you can look to the engine for more power. 


Here's Ricky's thread for some good reading :

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,28602.0.html



Ron

[Brock Samson]

i'm gonna go back over my 1998-99 engine work, drivetrain and acc. paperwork, i have alot of info i'm sure i've forgotton...
  my master cyl. needs rebuilding and my guage panel needs some lights so some work will be going on anyhow.. i really want to get the car alot further sorted now that i have some time and some money...

any suggestions as to "better" tires?.. 

thanks ron!

[firefighter3931]

any suggestions as to "better" tires?.. 

thanks ron!

Dave, the MT drag radials are awesome ! These are DOT tires that hook like slicks. 


http://www.mickeythompsontires.com/strip.php?item=ETStreetRadial





Ron

[Brock Samson]

I been out sockin the hedges,.. will a GM "Dana" "Posi" gear set, from a '69 El camino SS, fit the Charger's pumpkin?.. 

[firefighter3931]

I been out sockin the hedges,.. will a GM "Dana" "Posi" gear set, from a '69 El camino SS, fit the Charger's pumpkin?.. 

Nope, you need an 83/4 centersection. You can build yours with new gears and a suregrip unit or keep yours as a spare for roadtrips and buy another complete unit. The great thing about 83/4 rears is that the pumpkins can be swapped out in less than an hour, so having 2 of them is the best of all worlds. 

The only thing easier would be a gear vendors OD unit....then all you need to do is hit a switch. 



Ron

[Brock Samson]

i'm tired of dickin around with this piecemeal stuff,.. i think im gonna take a trip to Magnumforce,..  Thanks..

[Rolling_Thunder]

3.73 gears with a sure grip unit...    and some 275/60/15 BFG drag radials...           at that point you should be into the mid 13's...           I would also say your stock 6 pack cam is a little limiting.

[Steve P.]

Dave, if you like how the car cruises now but want more from the KICK IT IN THE ASS group. here's my suggestion:

sure grip
4.10 gears
275/60/15 MT drag radials  These are 28 inches tall.
Gearvendors overdrive unit
relocate your heavy ass battery to the trunk.  Weight in the ass is better that up front in MOST cases.
2" longer than stock rear shocks. 3 if you can find them..
Adjustable pinion snubber.

The gearvendors unit will take the 4.10's back to about 3.2 in overdrive. This will keep her streetable.

Now if I had the money for the GV unit I would be going to 4.56's.. OD would put me at a happy 3.5...


We really need to know more about your build. Motor and Tranny.. Converter, shift kit, valve body, etc... A shot of your dyno sheets would help too..

[greenpigs]

So where did your Charger end up in the 1\4 ? I was doing as search and came across this thread.

[70sixpkrt]

Just saw this post. This is my setup:
440 bored .030=446
KB 237 pistons .003 deck height
Forged crank .010 under
Eagle 4340 H-beam rods
Comp is 10.25:1
Eddy heads 84cc with stage 1 and bowl blend
Straightline Cam 234/242@.050 540/525 solid with 112 lsa (4* built in) installed straight up
6-pack aluminum manifold with stock carbs. (Using ProMax stuff)
Comp pro-magnum 1.5 rockers with 3/8 Smith Bros. pushrods
TTI 1 7/8 headers with 3" X cross-over exhaust to the tips
MSD 8546 dist.
MP MSD 6AL
Dana 60 with 3:54

It was dynoed at 491hp/535 torque
13.01 @107.93, 2.08 60', 295/50/15 BFG Radials street tires spinning all the way down. Remeber it is a 4 speed.

[BSB67]

Wow. 2.5 years old

[375instroke]

Those numbers do suck for a 500HP motor.  My '69 Coronet 500, with stock chassis, leafs, shocks, 275/60-15 on 15X7, untouched junk yard '69 Imperial 440 and trans except for a stock Thermoquad and Trans-Go TF-2, light distributor springs with stock points, and 3.91 Sure-Grip, was able to run 14.2@98MPH at Carlsbad, CA.

[greenpigs]

So 375 going off your MPH and using the moroso speed calculator the car has the potential for a 13.2 ET? 

[mauve66]

if it hooks good

[375instroke]

You put those numbers in there correctly?  Using 4000lbs, I get 277HP on the MPH, and 248HP on the time at the flywheel.  Do these numbers sound plausible?  The lower HP estimate off the time makes sense due to the street tires killing the 60' time.

[greenpigs]

I just used MPH and it shows 290 HP @ 4000 lbs on the slide.

[ChgrSteve67]

For a few minutes I though Dave changed his mind about selling his Charger.

I would like to take my Charger down the strip but I think I will get my cross country trip out of the way before I take her out and start breaking parts.