converting RV2 aircon to R134a gas

[Freoway]

Hi.  I know this topic has been touched on a few times.  Is there an overview somewhere of how to convert an RV2 system to R134a (or whatever the latest legal gas is)?  I understand that seals have to be replaced.  I will also need to replace the receiver/dryer as it's old, probably original.  Not sure about hoses.  The a/c did run about 15y ago, then the compressor seized, probably through lack of use.  Although converting to a new lightweight compressor might be a good option, I'd like to keep everything on my car as original as possible.  What oil do I use?  Do I keep the EPR valve?  I'm new to working on a/c's.  If it all gets too hard and I have to pay someone to do it, then at least I'll have half an idea of what I'll be paying them to do.  Compressor is off the car and I have a replacement RV2 unit which is a good working unit (no doubt will need a quick rebuild).

[John_Kunkel]

Welcome to the board.

Why do you want to convert to R-134? R-12 is still available.

By the time you rebuild the compressor, replace the dryer and hoses, the only added expense is the cost of the R-12 itself and the system will be operating as designed.

[Freoway]

Because R-12 is banned and very difficult to obtain in Australia.  If it was an option I'd consider it.

[Nacho-RT74]

I made it

Click on this gallery link. I think missed some page of the magazine when I took the pics ( and the mag is around 6500 mils from me to correct that ) but still is pretty much all the info

https://postimg.cc/gallery/ChwjbjB

There is a debate for the need of the EPR valve to be removed and replaced for a temp switch/sensor or not. On my car the R134 refrigerant worked still with the EPR valve mounted nicelly, but later I removed it to replace it for a temp switch and cycle on ar off the compresor clutch ( like A bodies made on 70s )... but then I disassembled my car for a deep body job, so I can't say yet what is better.

There it says replace the desicant gel from the dryer can reusing the can, but nowdays the dryer is available with the desicant gel needed for the refrigerant to be used. 4seasons makes those and Rockauto sells them ( BTDT ) as a direct dryer replacement. No adapting jobs needed. Just contact Rockauto customers service and they will provide the exact info and part.

The expansion valve FOR MY CAR was also available for the R134 refrigerant requirements adjustings ( also got from 4seasons throught Rockauto ). Your actual one could be readjusted thought. Once again, my AC system worked still with the factory Expansion valve without touch anything. Mostly sure I can get better performance from AC with the correct adjustments, but still works.

[AKcharger]

Welcome. Seals, dryer, remove EPR valve and install a tempt switch. Hoses should be fine.

Here's what I went through

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,139769.msg1735832.html#msg1735832

[John_Kunkel]

I have to disagree on the hoses, old hoses are a major source of leaks especially with R-134; the R-134 molecules are smaller than R-12 and will leak at a higher rate. Leaking gas won't be visible to the naked eye but will show up when the hose is wetted with leak tech (looks like frying bacon).

[Nacho-RT74]

I'm kinda agreed with John! I meant, is true a seasoned hose will hold better the R134a refrigerant than a non seasoned one designed for R12, however is also true than sooner or later the old hose will fail with cracks all around because they use to be dried. BTDT.

[Freoway]

Thanks for all the info.  Probably a dumb question, but how many seals are there in the compressor?  Are the seals just at the inlet and outlet pipes?

[AKcharger]

I have to disagree on the hoses, old hoses are a major source of leaks especially with R-134...

My system is working fine with old hoses and 134, but might be good to change them, I'm going to have my hoses remade this winter.

SEALS - if I recall correctly (when you buy a seal kit therir all there)
- 1 ea. Bulkhead suction line
- 2 ea. Dryer
- 2 ea. expansion valve
- 1 ea front of compressor
- rear compressor has gasket
- 2 ea. on front condensor

[John_Kunkel]

seasoned hose will hold better the R134a refrigerant than a non seasoned one designed for R12

Have to disagree again, a new barrier hose is better than any old hose with any refrigerant for the reasons I cited above. Some believe that pin holes in seasoned hoses have been plugged by the deposits left by in the circulating gas and oil. Even so, the pin holes are still there.

Gas leaks are invisible and many a new system with old hoses has leaked off a charge in a matter of days or weeks.

[Nacho-RT74]

I think you didn't read completelly what I meant!

[Freoway]

Thanks John Kunkel.  I've been looking around for a kit with the seals for R134a.  That gives me a good idea of what I need.

[AKcharger]

Thanks John Kunkel.  I've been looking around for a kit with the seals for R134a.  That gives me a good idea of what I need.

Got mine from year one

[Freoway]

Thanks AKCharger.  I hadn't heard of them before.    I had a look at their website, but couldn't see any seal kits for RV2 a/c compressors.  Maybe my search technique was wrong.

[Nacho-RT74]

Seals can be obtained individually by the size usually at local AC parts shop. Being in Australia who is getting hard restrictions about the R12a use, mostly sure local shops could get the acc to make the change and upgrade. I bet you are not the first one with this issue around there. Being in Venezuela, where this is not a restriction yet, I could get several seals to replace for the hoses at a local shop, so I can't think that could be a problem around there into the 1st world.

You need to get green color seals which makes difference on the seals made for the R134a refrigerant. I guess for any smaller molecules refrigerant actually.

Compressor gets as far I recal 5 seals, one on each hose outlet, one for the oil pump on back and two for the front cap, big one for the cap itself and the other one for the crank. I never have seen the main one ( crank ) diff then the black one. That seal is actually made on graphite and is very delicated. Needs to be handled very carefully. If you touch with your fingers the graphite section it will be damaged. Must be get wet with oil first as far I recall to prevent damages too.

FYI, 4season items ( dryer and expansion valve ) comes with the right seals for the replacement parts when getting these replacements for R134a. At leats the ones I got from Rockauto.

Also FYI, there is a "new" refrigerant around called to be the real straight R12a replacement for automotive use, but can't recall the number of it

[AKcharger]

Darn I thought that's where I got them...we'll here's some

https://www.ebay.com/itm/393578430441?epid=702399661&_trkparms=ispr%3D1&hash=item5ba31a3fe9:g:Ss0AAOSwNm5hREet&amdata=enc%3AAQAGAAACsPYe5NmHp%252B2JMhMi7yxGiTJkPrKr5t53CooMSQt2orsSU8qUIAeVPdz29zRlje3Lg60JWXyugBy7YG5iINqzcfhnFqTMj20p7HrGqUFPEa%252BnJeEFND9RNcfOxPtmxbA35fBSiWslPDscL9XcvrfQux3DrnjZkroT7rhg%252BhD2ihBBLKkcD0Qqr9zokpOpAq2VHqu8y36p16jvj%252BbAykMWoIqCroYsK8BfBBo2Nn%252FjSdYAYf55q0N1n6mO3dACaQy7JyJz8uGeFX1Rn32cfCDOUsDOwbGzXE9tCxkN%252Bie3hmybtx60pmjOEd%252BbC3yhUU1t3bQGS694iXpIZx5nlfIKTKVoUcr5g%252B3LPSQSzZyvLdS%252BFVBL1LKWKzHRzAQJJrHC%252FL8UgfVwRCcs0rbG67zmV25nnp9YHjid7gsPgnB7vKAgkYfMuk7FSfTvWsL5oxFZ5u0mz5cZtkeorkCMiOOL%252Fh%252F9WrlQEBT50MsIdbVY0SgQo4dOjMf3JOS6V%252B3xav%252B1uUVwSYEMBwxUr1Rr5fo3xoTSSgXVZ6pmIUOZZZF6znYtGx42CyvBxN90g%252BCU244Yks7%252F6gaG7OH%252FZYc0uRCYMzfklqOOJlynxNfIAf0xbZUrWpDz1itfHdFM8c8SEYfrO0RY6E4eXz4HWmOAKQ0lMdPVQDTTpkDscTWcpn%252Fuh73Jkn5RFCagGmcignayAlywlBApEVPApw1q3zJ6vUMNY3Us3M0a0ef%252Fdic1M0FaJibe6z5uHw6gKqXvwaMm2B4IUgIk0Wl%252Bhqpp9RsQY8Fs9v%252FuhgBOv%252BqjGqvxSAN1cAgL7DkJVQinUf3JvPsa7VTcZPllklSFz7ELVTuOykVcWYqfMVUqAI1gyI9oxJvweERV00ap47oks84qnMlit7ONEYpyhs%252FmHtHC9OZN7hLc%252B5I%253D%7Campid%3APL_CLK%7Cclp%3A2334524

[Nacho-RT74]

Damn a full box of seals to just use maybe 10-12 in total! LOL

The compressor seals are not on that range of sizes. Just outlets thought, but definitelly not the oil pump cap and front cap

[Freoway]

You'd think there would be a seal kit for an RV2 compressor.  Maybe there is, but I couldn't find one.  I've got two compressors now, so I can keep one on the car to keep the belts in situ.  I bought one seal kit which I'm hoping will have basics.  Nacho-RT74, I guess you get all your bits from the US like I do?    Are there many mopars in Venezuela? 

[Nacho-RT74]

Venezuela is full of old Mopars still riding around, but most on them in really bad conditions. Chrysler had an assembly plant there up to 1979 assembling same USA models with minor differences about trims, but when the automobile crissis in USA made to Iacocca to cut expenses and I guess some international plants were closed for that reason. Then came back in 92 but not with the same success. Many other competitors entered into the market in Venezuela along the lates 80s and earliers 90s ( Asian brands ) which weren present back in the 70s so it was harder to Chrysler to get the same earlier success.

Some old Mopar part dealers still survived up to today but the stock never was replaced back. I had luck to find MANY NOS parts on these dealers when I began to restore my car, betweeen 99 and 2008 or so. But some fever about Mopars in Venezuela also began as soon Fast & Furious movie came out to the scene and this stock came down faster.

To fix mechanical parts with stock replacements is still fairly easy in Vzla, but most of them to Small blocks and related to A bodies. Find big block parts is really hard.

But yes, to finish my restoration, maybe 60% of the parts ( small parts, not big sheetmetal or glasses ) to my car have been imported from USA. Specially because my Charger which was assembled in Vzla was equipped with diff options than USA Chargers and I decided to "clone" an USA rallye version with my Charger. Hence why I imported lot of parts unavailable on the local market.

I'm right now in Spain, and hoping to bring up my Charger from Venezuela someday.

About compresor kits! I don't think you'll find a kit specifically made for R134 since it never existed back in the day and the RV2 never was thought for that. As mentioned, you can get seals individually, but STILL the crank front seal will be the one it is. On a side note, if the crank front seal needs replacement, is the same used on the old classic square York compressor. BTDT.

[AKcharger]

... Chrysler had an assembly plant there up to 1979 assembling same USA models with minor differences about trims...

Huh, I didn't know that??

[Nacho-RT74]

Sure, My Charger was assembled in Venezuela. And even it was the same USA body ( CKD ), it got diff trim than USA Versions... it got an exterior Rallye look, but with SE grilles and standard cluster LOL... and buckets were shortbacks made locally. and some stuff more. And was badged as R/T

71 charger got the R/T look, but with 318 4bbls engine made in Mexico with HiPo pistons and 340 Cam and intake. These engines were designed by AutoMex to offer an HiPo engine on their market since Mexico didn't allowed to assembly big blocks there. So Chrysler de Venezuela took these engines for 70 Coronets "R/T" and 71/72 Chargers "R/T". Althought big block were allowed in Vzla ( mine got the 400 Magnum, 60s Monacos, NewPorts and Fury III got 383s, NewYorkers got 383 Up to 71 then 72/73 got 440s )

Dodge Aspens made in Venezuela got Volaré grilles. Just 4 doors and SW offered

There was a Coronet version made locally which on 75 was assembled with Fury grill and was called Special edition ( not Coronet Special Edition, but just Special edition )... then on 76 all Coronets got the fury Grill.

78/79 Lebarons were assembled on same specs than USA versions 4 and 2 doors, but I THINK without the lean burn system as far I know.

the 74//77 period Chrysler of Venezuela assembled this Special Edition line based on Coronets to replace the NewYorker which was removed from the local offer. These Special Editions got a full deluxe trim to set it into the NewYorker market level

on 70 Plymouth locally offered their last models... Satellite and Valiant, but on 71/74 Chrysler of Venezuela offered a low trimmed Dart with 225 and was called Valiant, while the Dart still was on market with 318 and on an upscale on trim.

all Mopar lines, Dodge, Plymouth and Chrsyler were assembled on the same assembly plant in Valencia Venezuela, which by those years period ( 69/79 ), was the modern assembly plant in Latin America.

earlier plant was in Caracas, and there were asembled several models too, mostly Valiants, Darts Belvederes and Coronets. On early 60s, Diff Darts levels ( Senecas, Phoenix, Pioneers ), Some Polaras and 440s same as Valiants and Lancers. On 50s Several Plodges, such as Kingsway, Diplomats and of course originals Coronets and Belvederes.

[AKcharger]

 
Thanks for sharing!

[Freoway]

Thanks Nacho-RT74.   It's interesting to see how Mopars vary from country to country.  We never had much on offer in Australia, except for the locally built Australian version of the Valiant.  It was a copy of the Plymouth Valiant in the US from 1962 onwards (gorgeous cars with the slant-6 motors, beat the local Ford and GM products hands down for styling and power).  We didn't get a V8 until about 1966 (the 273ci) and later the 318 around 1969/70.  Our Valiants continued to look like US versions, just with minor mods around grilles, etc.  The most successful/famous of all was our locally built Aussie Charger (much smaller than the Dodge Chargers).  Beautiful looking cars (in my opinion).  Very fast with a six-pack (triple side draught
Webers) 265ci V8.  The 318's weren't as impressive, but the 340 was a nice addition but only a few sold.  I'm sure you've probably seen a picture or two of these Aussie cars.  It's a shame Chrysler Australia ran out of puff in about 1981.