Muscle Motors or Indy Cylinder

[areibel]

One thing I've noticed, you keep mentioning "resale value"?  Dropping huge $$ on any motor isn't exactly going to guarantee a return on investment.  If you want a Hemi, OK, but if it's not in an original Hemi car don't count on getting a dollar for dollar return if you're looking to sell!

[Ghoste]

  X10.  Adding a Crate Hemi does not a Hemi car make.  Just adding the engine does not even automatically make it a Hemi car clone, there are a lot of other special parts needed.  Do this for the love of having a Hemi or you could end up quite disappointed.

[charlie45]

Clearly I'm aware that by putting a crate Hemi in there, doesn't make it compare to an original 426 RT car.

My point is merely that when you are dropping 20-30K in a car like this, you obviously consider what will enhance the "re-sale value" to some extent.

I've done enough car projects to know that you're not going to get your money out of something like this... The question is much more does it make sense to spend a few extra grand on a Hemi 528 versus a 500 Stroker, and would the Hemi hold the value better and make the car more sought after...?

[Cooter]

The problem I've seen at least around here, is once you have that "Hemi" accociated withthe car, then it better haul ass, or it'll hurt.
One guy here bought one of the very first Mopar 528 Hemi's and stated he had the "Fastest car in three counties" in front of me and my buddy and his friend with a little valiant at my buddies shop. Jarod (My buddy) never said a word. Asked him to prove it against the "Little blue car", with a 440.

Long story short, I thought dude with the Hemi in a 1964 Plymouth and a 4-speed, was gonna cry. 3 outta 3 the Blue car crushed the Hemi.

Spinning, missed gears, etc. all play a role, but the "Hemi idiot" didn't take this into consideration when he claimed he had the "Fastest car in three counties" either and got his feelings hurt.

[Ghoste]

Charlie, based on that I think my opinion would be "probably".  The stroker would be so much cheaper to build but the Hemi would certainly make the car more sought after.  As to holding its value better, thats the part where I think probably. (but I'm often wrong)

[JB400]

Here is my if it's worth that.  A hemi is everyone's dream engine; everyone wants one ( maybe not everyone).  It definitely has the "Awe" appeal.  However, someone wanting a charger, while fascinated by the Hemi, could also be intimidated by it and might not even bother looking at your car.  In this case, more people will be looking to buy a 440 powered car because they are more affordable.  Usually, someone looking for a particular option like a Hemi, will concentrate mostly on what is avaible with that particular option.

If it was me floating in your boat, I'd shove a Hemi in it and be happy.  When you do sell it, put the 440 in it and offer the Hemi as an option.  That will broaden your target market and give the next buyer the option.

[cdr]

Here is my if it's worth that.  A hemi is everyone's dream engine; everyone wants one ( maybe not everyone).  It definitely has the "Awe" appeal.  However, someone wanting a charger, while fascinated by the Hemi, could also be intimidated by it and might not even bother looking at your car.  In this case, more people will be looking to buy a 440 powered car because they are more affordable.  Usually, someone looking for a particular option like a Hemi, will concentrate mostly on what is avaible with that particular option.

If it was me floating in your boat, I'd shove a Hemi in it and be happy.  When you do sell it, put the 440 in it and offer the Hemi as an option.  That will broaden your target market and give the next buyer the option.

sure am glad, i'm not everyone   

[Cooter]

Here is my if it's worth that.  A hemi is everyone's dream engine; everyone wants one ( maybe not everyone).  It definitely has the "Awe" appeal.  However, someone wanting a charger, while fascinated by the Hemi, could also be intimidated by it and might not even bother looking at your car.  In this case, more people will be looking to buy a 440 powered car because they are more affordable.  Usually, someone looking for a particular option like a Hemi, will concentrate mostly on what is avaible with that particular option.

If it was me floating in your boat, I'd shove a Hemi in it and be happy.  When you do sell it, put the 440 in it and offer the Hemi as an option.  That will broaden your target market and give the next buyer the option.

sure am glad, i'm not everyone    

Really?
Let's see....
500 C.I. stroker wedge is selling for $13.5K and a 500 C.I. Hemi is selling for $13.5K.....

Which one do you buy for your Charger?

[heyoldguy]

A 500 ci hemi for $13,500? Where? I might buy one. How complete? What power? What components are being use?

According to their website, Muscle Motors will build a 650HP/650TQ, pump gas, 528 hemi for $17,499. By the time you add all the parts to fire it and dyno test it, it comes to something like $20,000. For $20,000 we could build a pump gas wedge that will make 800HP.

Still, if you can get the same quality and price for a hemi as a wedge, the hemi would probably be a better deal.

[cdr]

Here is my if it's worth that.  A hemi is everyone's dream engine; everyone wants one ( maybe not everyone).  It definitely has the "Awe" appeal.  However, someone wanting a charger, while fascinated by the Hemi, could also be intimidated by it and might not even bother looking at your car.  In this case, more people will be looking to buy a 440 powered car because they are more affordable.  Usually, someone looking for a particular option like a Hemi, will concentrate mostly on what is avaible with that particular option.

If it was me floating in your boat, I'd shove a Hemi in it and be happy.  When you do sell it, put the 440 in it and offer the Hemi as an option.  That will broaden your target market and give the next buyer the option.

sure am glad, i'm not everyone    

Really?
Let's see....
500 C.I. stroker wedge is selling for $13.5K and a 500 C.I. Hemi is selling for $13.5K.....

Which one do you buy for your Charger?

the wedge,my point is, a hemi is NOT what i just have to have or even want

[charlie45]

First off:

Guys, thank you all for the great feedback and insights.

This is forum is great, and the passion that you guys all share for these amazing cars really shows here in your pro-active support in providing a newbie like myself great information.

So Thanks

I'm still not decided on what the best route is, but that is what this process is all about: carefully outweighing the different options. Especially if you're dropping 20-30k, you need to be clearly convinced of the best option...

I'm also thinking since I'm in Germany and there's a guy here who runs a top-methanol dragster team and he builds engines on the side (he's close to Munich; http://p-s-r.com/?p=748&lang=en), that maybe I'm just best off ordering the best of the best parts from the states, and having him re-build my block to a 500 stroker. He's built a few Mopar 500 strokers and has gotten positive feedback. Point is: I'm not as mechanically capable as any of you guys on here, and If I have any problems with my engine, I can go right to him and have him take care of it since it he built the engine... That's a service aspect that I would not have with a Muscle Motors, Indy, or Ray Barton engine...   

If this guy builds top-methanol dragster engines, than this should be a pretty safe bet... no? What do you guys think?

[JB400]

If he builds good engines and has a strong reputation, then that is who I would go with.

[Cooter]

Gotta watch those overseas "Mopar guys"...Some like to charge 40 Hours for exhaust installs.

[charlie45]

Gotta watch those overseas "Mopar guys"...Some like to charge 40 Hours for exhaust installs.

I know, I was the one who learned that first-hand with one guy... 

I heard from two other people however that this guy is reasonable and isn't out there to gouge you. He basically he only builds engines on the side and does it because he enjoys doing it...

[charlie45]

If he builds good engines and has a strong reputation, then that is who I would go with.

Well, I don't know about strong reputation. However, I have two people that speak highly of him. I figure that if he primarily builds top-methanol dragster engines, than I would imagine building a 500 stroker is a fairly simple feat for the guy... Its like having a neuro-surgeon do basic stitches...

[R2]

No experience with INDY but most of the comments speak for themselves regarding their reputation.

AVOID Muscle Motors in my opinion.  Personal experience with them,nothing but issues, customer service not good, quality control poor, etc,, again my experience, your results may vary. Go visit their shop someday, and then form your own opinion.

Best Machine does great work, not cheap, but you get what you pay for.  Chuck and Pete do solid work, and customer service is great. They did a motor for me, no issues.

Dwayne Porter is awesome. I would use him without reservation.  Current motor he did runs better than expected. Very reputable.

[charlie45]

Thanks for all the insightful feedback.

I went ahead and ordered a 528 (650hp) Hemi from Ray Barton 

Engine should be ready in a few months... Will keep you posted.

[Bigtree]

Muscle Motors #1 Best bang for the buck.....period. Indy, imo all about the bling.

[mach123]

Maybe be should be MM or 440 source with stealths, hmmmmm

[1974dodgecharger]

whatever happed to the best power per dollar?

[500Jon]

Hi Charlie and All,
You Germans have really got your shit together over there with the Mopar scene!
Here in the UK it seems a bit dull at the moment.
Don't see many peoples here in blighty buying crate 440's or Hemi's LoL!
As a long time Moparman (30 years) I've seen alot of engines.
Always thought that Bigblocks would die out, but 'BIG is still BESTE'.
New vs Old???
I always like old myself, built and raced lots of 440's
But after several trips to Cali and driving Hemi-cars at Juliuses shop,
ITS GOTTA BE A HEMI now LoL
I bought a 69 hemi engine from Julius and an ex Barton 572 hemi from Cannonball Watts here in England.
One for my 69 Charger500 and one for my 71 GTX.
Just gotta get my shit together and finish these cars  

So whats the news on the engine Charlie???

Cheers 500Jon

[War wagon]

I realize the op has bought a hemi but to answer the original post which is better from my experience this past summer I would say muscle motors.
I bought a 572 short block from muscle motors built to spec and purchased a set of indy 1 heads cnc'd from indy.
If I had it to do over I would just buy the heads from one of their authorized distributors rather than indy direct. Great products IMHO just as other have said a royal pita to deal with.
Muscle motors have more than proven themselves IMHO as have others. I originally called FHO for the build since it's real close and my father has already done business with Tim but the wait time too build a 572 wedge short block was at least a year before he could start. LOL HEMI's come first with Mr. Banning 

[1974dodgecharger]

Lucky dudes with hemis...wish I had 20k lying around for a hemi.  I want it for the power dont care if I'm matching or not......

[Charger-Bodie]

Lucky dudes with hemis...wish I had 20k lying around for a hemi.  I want it for the power dont care if I'm matching or not......

I don't really care about the power. I just think it's awesome to open a good and see a HEMI lurking there.

[1974dodgecharger]

Lucky dudes with hemis...wish I had 20k lying around for a hemi.  I want it for the power dont care if I'm matching or not......

I don't really care about the power. I just think it's awesome to open a good and see a HEMI lurking there.

That too i fall in love every time......