What is Killing my battery??? - And giving me 9V on START

[Canadian1968]

If anyone has read any of my other post. I am fighting with some electrical gremlins on a 68 CHarger R/T with an Electronic ignition upgrade.

I was able to get the car to start ,  but found out I was not charging , the car would also not idle ( possibly due to no charging low battery?? )
I got the car to charge ( the voltage regulator was not grounded well enough).

I checked the car was charging, but it would still not idle. I turned the car off and came back to it a day later, now the car will not start again!!!!!

Trying to go threw all my check points of connections ect.  I notice if I leave my battery hook up it seem to drain itself, nothing on , key not in ignition.  We are talking over course of an hour 12.3 V to 11.8  ( only turning key on once to check power points ). This is a BRAND NEW BATTERY  as well as everything other EFFIN ignition part that does not seem to want to work.

Anyway , what could be causing a drain on my battery, starter?  

When I turn my key to on position my ammeter drops almost a full notch , but doesn't move any more whne I can it, is that normal?

Also trying some quick test for my ECU.  With the key in run I should be able to get a battery voltage reading from the transistor ontop of box correct?  And I should get a good ground threw pin #4 ??

[nascarxx29]

Ive had this issue many times .Do you get a spark when + battery cable  is put on .I get a 12 volt testlight Inbetween the+ on the battery and pos + cable.The light will be on if somethings pulling on it .Everything need to be in the off position/all switches and doors closed.So interior light wont give you a false reading.Then from there take out 1 fuse at a time till light goes out.If problem persist you need to check and remove power from 1 item at a time.Ive had ampgauges short out and get they hot from behind the cluster

[Canadian1968]

hmmm I tried that.

My battery must just be taking a beating from all the cranking and testing.  Its still cranking fine, I was just worried about the voltage.

My other question. about the ECU. Shoud I be able to get 12v off the transistor ( in run)  I can only get a reading of .5V.

I

[nascarxx29]

Does this help
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,11020.0.html

[Canadian1968]

Nascar - Thanks for all your help! you seem to be the only one that responds to my threads !!

I just read up on a new test for the distributor.  To Test the reluctor 

If I put the two leads of my multimeter to the plug coming from the distributor, I should get an AC reading of at least 1V.  I will give it a shot tomorrow !

[nascarxx29]

You mean testing the pick up the reluctor is the trigger wheel .I like chasing down wiring gremlins

[Chryco Psycho]

A bad alt can cause a drain on the battery + you say it may not be charging , I would start by confirming it is charging & possibly having the alt tested

[Canadian1968]

No I DID have the alternator charging. last time the car was running I was getting a steady 13.5V  at my battery posts.

Here is the article I was reading :

got NO spark???

grab your digital volt meter...   set it to 2K ohms..  disconnect the 2 wire plug at the distributer.  you should have around 800 ohms.  give or take.. anywhere between 600 and 1,500 ohms is usually ok.

before you disconnect the volt meter. flip the setting to 2 volts AC or 20 volts AC range...    crank the engine if the distributor is in..  spin the shaft if it is out...    for the system to work. you need to see over 1 volt AC.   

if the pick up coil passes it's resistance test...  the gap is correct ,,,   replace the reluctor.   

the reluctor keeps a small amount of magnetic field.. so as it passes the pick up coil AC voltage is created to trigger the ignition module

it takes about 0.6 volts AC to turn the power transistor on.   if the pick up coil does not create enough voltage... the power transistor will not have enough voltage to turn on.. if its not on.. it cannot switch off discharging the coil primary...

testing the pickup coil takes only a few minutes..   testing the reluctor, a few seconds more...

rusty reluctors don't work well, sand blasted reluctors don't work well... if at all...    sometimes they just go bad... this is the only test to be sure... other than sticking a new one in..

hope this helps explain some of the hidden magic in the ignition system...


Read more: http://forums.moparmusclemagazine.com/70/7736595/general-mopar-technical-discussion/testing-early-chrysler-electronic-ignition-pick-up/#ixzz2BpafZpOL

[b5blue]

  A: Be certain battery is fully charged. B: Turn any and everything off. C: With grounding strap connected to the car and battery, disconnect positive at the battery. D: Put a meter set at a range that includes 12 to 14 volts DC between the positive post of the battery and the cars positive cable. It should read 0 volts. If it reads anything, that is your drain. You can find your drain by disconnecting things one by one, I'd start with the alt. by disconnecting it's wires completely to see if you get a 0 reading.
  Let us know what you have found. 
b5

[nascarxx29]

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=67882

[Canadian1968]

Well I did the test on my distributor.

I have 320 ohms resistance between the pins, but I get 0 AC when I crank it.  Pretty sure I need a new pick up / reluctor

[nascarxx29]

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,96075.0.html
Wasnt the electronic ignition conversion kit new from the start.Thats odd the pick up failed so soon.Dont forget the brass feeler gauge and 0.08 air gap setting setting

[Canadian1968]

Yes it is new, but so is everything else !!! I find it very hard to belive I have 2 bad ECU's ( which are also new.)

[Cooter]

Yes it is new, but so is everything else !!! I find it very hard to belive I have 2 bad ECU's ( which are also new.)

Chrysler electronic ignition and replacement modules.....JUNK IMO. Yes, even the famed "Orange" box everybody seems to believe in. MSD, or some other kind of aftermarket ignition. Not saying THIS is your problem, but Hard starting and backfiring, loading up, missing when warmed up, etc. are ALL symptoms of JUNK replacement Chrysler ignition modules. Also, just becasue somethings new, treat it like it's 30 years old.(China junk)

[mhinders]

  A: Be certain battery is fully charged. B: Turn any and everything off. C: With grounding strap connected to the car and battery, disconnect positive at the battery. D: Put a meter set at a range that includes 12 to 14 volts DC between the positive post of the battery and the cars positive cable. It should read 0 volts. If it reads anything, that is your drain. You can find your drain by disconnecting things one by one, I'd start with the alt. by disconnecting it's wires completely to see if you get a 0 reading.
  Let us know what you have found. 
b5

This is a good way but I think it is better to set the multimeter to the "DC current" setting. Start with the 10 Amp setting, if it shows very little, or nothing, set the meter to next lower current scale and look again. Go all the way down till you have some reasonable readings. If you still have nothing, you either have no current drain from your battery, or you have a blown fuse in your multimeter, or your multimeter cannot measure such small currents.

[Canadian1968]

OK Hold on to your seats !!!

First test I did today was to check cranking voltage at my coil - During cranking ( start ) I am only gettting 9V to my + coil.  When in RUN I will get either 5-8V on the coil, depending what resistor I am using. While in RUN I get 11.3V on the other side of my resistor ( power side) 

So........ I am NOT getting full battery voltage from my DBL*wire (N on bulkhead) in START , but I AM in RUN. ALSO loosing approx 1V between my battery and testing at the bulkhead.
Now my brown wire which goes to the otherside of my resistor ( ING 2 I belive)  in RUN I get 8V, in START I get 9V when testing at bulkhead

    RUN DOWN : 
         DBL* Wire  = 9V in Start
                          = 11.3V in RUN
         BR Wire      = 9V in Start      
                          = 8V in RUN

SECOND TEST:

I then tested for draw on my battery again.  When I first touch the test leads between the + post and + battery lead the meter always shoots up to approx 11 V and then drops rapidly down to 3 -2- 1 and fianlly settles at .6V I popped out all my fuses one my one I cannot get rid of the .6V draw.

I then disconnected my Battery lead at my Alt. , the meter will drip to .3V but will not 0 out.

So what are some thoughts !!!! 

[Chryco Psycho]

is the door open / dome light

[Canadian1968]

no the doors were closed

I have the dash all pulled apart again , cleaned up a a couple wires that were hanging around ( grandfather had 8 track installed at one time) Hopefuly it was one of those wires that was causing the small draw.   Before i put the dash back in .  Do my starting problems sound like they could be related to the ignition switch ?

I don't want to have to pull the dash out again.

[John_Kunkel]

OK Hold on to your seats !!!

First test I did today was to check cranking voltage at my coil - During cranking ( start ) I am only gettting 9V to my + coil.  When in RUN I will get either 5-8V on the coil, depending what resistor I am using. While in RUN I get 11.3V on the other side of my resistor ( power side) 

So........ I am NOT getting full battery voltage from my DBL*wire (N on bulkhead) in START , but I AM in RUN. ALSO loosing approx 1V between my battery and testing at the bulkhead.
Now my brown wire which goes to the otherside of my resistor ( ING 2 I belive)  in RUN I get 8V, in START I get 9V when testing at bulkhead

    RUN DOWN : 
         DBL* Wire  = 9V in Start
                          = 11.3V in RUN
         BR Wire      = 9V in Start      
                          = 8V in RUN

Are you performing those tests with the wires connected to the ballast? If so, the results are meaningless because of the feedback across the ballast. With the wires disconnected from the ballast the double blue wire should have battery voltage with the switch in RUN but should shut off in START....the brown wire should have battery voltage in START but should shut off in RUN.

SECOND TEST:

I then tested for draw on my battery again.  When I first touch the test leads between the + post and + battery lead the meter always shoots up to approx 11 V and then drops rapidly down to 3 -2- 1 and fianlly settles at .6V I popped out all my fuses one my one I cannot get rid of the .6V draw.

I then disconnected my Battery lead at my Alt. , the meter will drip to .3V but will not 0 out.

So what are some thoughts !!!! 

Voltage readings are irrelevent, as stated above you want to use the current setting to check for parasitic draw.

[Canadian1968]

OK I tried it with the wires disconnected from the ballast.

DBL* = OFF in START                 BR = 9V in START
         = 11.4 V in RUN                     = OFF in RUN

so pretty much the exact same numbers only I am getting an actually OFF reading.  SO I know I need more than 9V to START which I am not gettting from BR wire. WHY? 

Ignition switch or my starter is causings me to loose volts some how?? Because when key is in run i get my battery Voltage ( threw DBL*wire )

I am assuming this is the root of all my problems here !! The car will not start off 9 V correct?