buying tips needed! - buying drivable, or buying fixer-upper

[brianbutts]

First of all, I'm totally new to this but stoked to get started. I'm looking at buying either an un-drivable '72 Charger Rallye 440 that "needs work" or, a "drivable" '73 Charger SE 318 fixed up at a shop..

I am just getting started and have some cash to spend working on the car upfront, but not sure which to choose from. The cheaper I can get either car running and daily drive-able, the better.

Option A : Get the drivable 318 for $5500 (obo) drivable, and work on it gradually to beef it up, but possibly spend more money upfront.. I know a 318 would be easier on gas mileage, but I'm not sure it will be enough kick for my appetite. My buddy told me he'd be weary of getting a fixed up car from a shop because they tend to make the outside look good, and patch up major problems with the engine, etc. Thoughts?

 

Option B : Get the Rallye for however much he'd take for it (he's asking $6000 but I was thinking more like $3500), but spend time and more money on just getting it drivable... I really like th exterior features of the Rallye and that it's a 440. Obviously not at all gas efficient, but has a lot of kick. However, I'm not exactly sure the condition. I called the owner, and he said that some guy had previously tried to steal something (engine parts?) and took the intake off. Since the intake has been off, the owner hasn't put it back on and hasn't been willing to crank the key, because of debris possibly in the engine. He said it need a rebuild, reupholster needed, etc. Not even sure if it has AC. So, this one has a lot of work needed, possibly, but in the end, more of a fit for me.

 


Again, I'm new to this and would love a first project, but not sure how deep I want to dive.. Any suggestions on which to go with - get a drivable car first or a car with work needed? Any idea how much money and time I'd spend getting Rallye drivable? I'm not looking to race or necessarily get it show-ready, but do want a comfortable car that I can work on and can be drivable and last me a while.


Thanks, guys!

[c00nhunterjoe]

I would go over both cars with a fine tooth comb.

The 440 car will be more fun but the guy is asking too much for a non running car. You might as well figure on a motor and trans rebuild right off the bat.


The318 car looks good at first but like you said, you never know. Take someone who knows the cars with you to look it over. The 318 won't satisfy you for long but I do see a\c in the pic.....

[Ghoste]

And in the end it costs the same to restore a 318 car as it does a 440 one.

[jaak]

The first car is a 73 (or 74, can't see enough details in the pic), not a 72 and it isn't a SE either.

The 72 has cooler options....it is a rallye so it has rallye hood and doors, it has the hide-a-way headlights, and a BB, so thats a big plus.

It all depends on your budget and what you want to spend in the long run, the 72 seems to need a lot and that equals $$$$. If the green one checks out good, you can cruise around in it while you buy/collect parts for a BB conversion...when you buy everything, spend a couple days swapping everything out...BAM you got a nice BB cruiser, that looks good, and you don't have to worry paint, interior, etc.

To me the green one is the most for your $$$, but in the long run if both cars were sitting side by side both completed, the Rallye will bring more (even though you wouldn't get back what you invested).

Just some things to consider,
Jason

[Scaregrabber]

The 440 Rallye is a much better buy. The Rallye will be worth much more when finished and it will be a lot more fun to drive. The green one you can drive now but I have a hunch that everything that is done to it will have to be redone over time. The green car likely is hiding rust and bondo, the rallye you can see what you are getting right now.
However if you have limited mechanical abilities the rallye will be over your head.
I would check to see if the rallye is an original 440 car, you can do this by checking the serial #, if it is then you have to look at the serial # on the block to see if it is matching #'s or not. If it isn't matching #'s I would look for a 67-72 Chrysler New Yorker with a good running 440, buy it and swap the engine into the Rallye, that's the quick way home with it.

Sheldon

[brianbutts]

Thanks for the feedback guys. I really do want to go with the Rallye, but I am weary of biting off too much and being in the deep end as soon as I put down the cash for it. I agree that when all is done, I would enjoy the Rallye much more. I just don't know if I'd be able to afford all the parts to get it drivable, on top of the cash already put down for the car.

Scaregrabber - The Rallye was originally a 340, now a 440. Is that bad?

Also, I am thinking (down the road, obviously) about a conversion to a 5 speed. Any insights? Is it possible to get a manual trans out of an older car that I could put in it, instead of buying a brand new trans? Which used trans would fit? Is it a big big job?

Can anyone give me an estimate of cost and time to get the Rallye running? I've seen that most rebuilds will be $2000+ but I'm not sure to what extent they are talking about. I don't want to do bare minimum just to get it running, but I'm not going to be showing this car, so I just need it to run and be mostly reliable. Any estimate would be appreciated.



Thanks again, everyone.

[Ghoste]

A 340 Rallye is still desirable IMO but the 3rd gen crowd will answer better on it compared to a 440.   The 5 speed conversion is tough to beat using a conversion kit.  You might be able to get the trans cheaply but the hassle of getting it in there may not be worth it.  What other mods are you planning for the car?  It's hard to say what it would cost to get either of them running without knowing more about them,

[elacruze]

If both are realistically in the budget, I'd look very very carefully at the stuff you pay high dollar for-particularly bodywork. Both cars are money pits if you have to get rust work done. Or redone.

If both bodies are solid, I'd go for the 440 car. You can find a decent running big block (383, 400, 440 doesn't matter) for not much money and stick it in to drive it. Interiors are relatively inexpensive, can be done one piece at a time, and can be done in the driveway. Paint is the same for both cars.

The caveat here is how serious are you about driving it? A car you take out of service is much more likely to be put back into service quickly as opposed to a project you never got to drive, however close it may be. Plus there's the dreamer effect, dawdling on improvements and upgrades for so long you never pull the trigger on the shortest road to driving it.

[brianbutts]

So you're saying it'd be easier to buy and put an engine in, rather than do a rebuild?

[brianbutts]

Also, found this today. Would this fit the Rallye? If so, would it be worth getting?

"Dodge np465 4 speed manual transmission and bellhousing fits 440. Was in working order when pulled out, has been sitting dry for several years, sold as is. "

[Ghoste]

Not without cutting a hole in the floor.  You'd better off getting an 833 that was meant to go in there.

[elacruze]

So you're saying it'd be easier to buy and put an engine in, rather than do a rebuild?

Easier yes. Cheaper, probably not all in but cheaper and faster than rebuilding the engine that's in the car. You could probably find something running not too far away that you could throw in the hole for $500 or less.

The trans you show above is a truck trans, you definitely don't want it.

[Scaregrabber]

     There's nothing wrong with a 340 rallye at all, however max value seems to go to cars that come from the factory with big engines and definetly to cars with 340 and larger engines that are original to the car. For the asking price the fact that is a 340 car with a 440 and one that doesn't run at that, I think I may rethink my value on it.  I would look at this car only for a lower price because you will have to spend $2k and up getting it running and that would be with a used, good running engine out of a donor car. It could take more than $2k to get it up for you. For me I'd figure $1k for a used Chrysler (cause I'm nuts and I'd put a 440 back into it) for an engine and $1k at least for some tires, mufflers, brake parts, antifreeze, oil etc. that's just to get it running (I do all of my own work and have the tools).
     Your best bet with your experience is probably not to buy either one of these cars and wait for a running, solid, better car. Sorry, I just don't like the look of the green one, it just screams that it was put together fast to make a few bucks, the paint looks a bit shoddy and the C-body road wheels were certainly not installed because they look good on a Charger. However if you check it out (especially if you can take an impartial expert with you) and prove me wrong that's fine too, just check it over carefully.

Sheldon

[Ghoste]

The option C that Scaregrabber just mentioned- none of the above- could be the best one.  You talked about getting it running quickly as a daily driver kind of vehicle, does this mean it will become your sole mode of transportation?

[brianbutts]

Awesome, seriously thanks again for the input. I like the idea of getting a running engine and dropping it in one of the cars, but would it be easier (considering my lack of experience) than a rebuild? Could this one work if it's in good shape?

http://dallas.craigslist.org/dal/ptd/3213684338.html

[Chryco Psycho]

if your budget allows my Charger is still for sale fully restoered 71 R/T Clone 440 / 4 spd

[brianbutts]

@Chryco Psycho - Do you have a link to pictures? How much, where is it located?