Starting problem when hot - advice?

[DPL]

Hey everyone,

Here's the issue.  My car starts just fine when cold.  When I get it nice and hot and shut it down, it won't start.  Its exactly as though the battery is nearly dead (maybe one turn and then clicking).  In fact, when I put my emergency battery pack on it, it turns over super fast.  If I just leave it until the next morning, the car starts fine.

I originally thought my starter was at fault and installed a mini starter.  I have TTI headers so I thought maybe a starter heat shield is needed but this doesn't explain why it turns over fast when my battery pack is attached.

Needless to say, I keep that battery pack with me at all times! 

Anyone else experience this?

[Dino]

Hey everyone,

Here's the issue.  My car starts just fine when cold.  When I get it nice and hot and shut it down, it won't start.  Its exactly as though the battery is nearly dead (maybe one turn and then clicking).  In fact, when I put my emergency battery pack on it, it turns over super fast.  If I just leave it until the next morning, the car starts fine.

I originally thought my starter was at fault and installed a mini starter.  I have TTI headers so I thought maybe a starter heat shield is needed but this doesn't explain why it turns over fast when my battery pack is attached.

Needless to say, I keep that battery pack with me at all times! 

Anyone else experience this?

I did and it was the battery, replaced it and was fixed.  Ballast resistor may be at fault as well.

[BrianShaughnessy]

Where's your ground (black) battery cable going to?      Might want to take that and put some nice star lock washers under that so it bites in good.
It should go to the front of the driver's side head for what it's worth.
Also make sure you have a auxiliary ground from the rear of the passenger side head to the firewall.

[c00nhunterjoe]

Nice heavy gauge, fine strand cables backed by a healthy battery.

I basicly used welding cable for mine. I have a 1000 cca battery in the trunk with 00( might be 000 can't remember) cables going up to the starter. I put a heavy ground from the battery to the frame rail, a heavy ground from the head to the frame, and a decent ground from the alternator to the frame. Also used a heavy cable for the solonoid to the starter. I have a stock starter that is 12 years old that 3 header tubes are touching. It cranks over real fast still. Heat is bad for a starter but not nearly as bad as voltage drop and high amp draw.

[Brightyellow69rtse]

any chance the timing is too far advanced?

[charger Downunder]

I always run an extra ground from the engine to the body.

[68 RT]

I would also check timing. 

[DPL]

Awesome, thanks everyone, I will report back after the weekend

[twodko]

My car boils the fuel off in the carb after driving for awhile and its up to operating temp. Vapor lock uh huh.
One o' these days I'll install the heat bypass kit which should solve the problem. Might be happening to your car. 

[squeakfinder]

My car boils the fuel off in the carb after driving for awhile and its up to operating temp. Vapor lock uh huh.
One o' these days I'll install the heat bypass kit which should solve the problem. Might be happening to your car. 

Was just talking about that at the Auburn WA Charger meet. Suggestion is that it's caused from the cross overs on the intake gasket not being blocked off.

[Chryco Psycho]

the fix is a Fel Pro intake gasket 1214 for B engines & 1215 for RB

[twodko]

the fix is a Fel Pro intake gasket 1214 for B engines & 1215 for RB

What is the diff between B and RB engines? 383 440?

[Brightyellow69rtse]

rb engines are a little taller so intakes dont interchange.

[twodko]

How can I tell on my 440?

[Chryco Psycho]

361,383 & 400 are B engines
413, 426 wedge & 440 are RB engines

[twodko]

Thank you! I learn something new here damn near every day. 

[DPL]

In my case it turned out to be bad ground.  Which one I don't know for sure because I re-did both the engine and battery grounds.

It's all good now!  Thanks everyone

[Dino]

In my case it turned out to be bad ground.  Which one I don't know for sure because I re-did both the engine and battery grounds.

It's all good now!  Thanks everyone

My car boils the fuel off in the carb after driving for awhile and its up to operating temp. Vapor lock uh huh.
One o' these days I'll install the heat bypass kit which should solve the problem. Might be happening to your car. 

Hey Twodko,get the felpro crossover block, did it on mine and no more hot starting issues!  A phenolic spacer between carb and manifold would be a good idea as well as long as you have the hood clearance.  Oh and use permatex ultra copper on both sides of the valley pan.  I did not use the paper gaskets on mine as the intake manifold met up with the heads just fine.

[Cooter]

A friend installed one of those "Ball valves" like you would find in an air line between his carb and fuel pump. Gets out, shuts off fuel, turns on right before he needs to fire it. Just a thought.

[Ghoste]

S o back to my original question, then is it fairly similar to the new Hemi's?

[twodko]

That's my plan Dinoman! It's all about cash these days........the lack of it. 

[bakerhillpins]

My car boils the fuel off in the carb after driving for awhile and its up to operating temp. Vapor lock uh huh.
One o' these days I'll install the heat bypass kit which should solve the problem. Might be happening to your car.  

Hey Twodko,get the felpro crossover block, did it on mine and no more hot starting issues!  A phenolic spacer between carb and manifold would be a good idea as well as long as you have the hood clearance.  Oh and use permatex ultra copper on both sides of the valley pan.  I did not use the paper gaskets on mine as the intake manifold met up with the heads just fine.

There was a vendor tent at Carlisle that was selling phenolic spacers for the Carb/Intake interface that was touting that they had several different thicknesses available to work for OE configurations. looked like two thin aluminum plates with the white goo in between. Sorry, don't recall who it was. Looked like a clean solution.


You will have to forgive the noob questions here but: What exactly was the crossover for in the first place? Seems only to cause trouble. Was it used to heat the carb up in the colder climates/months?  I would have thought that cooler air would be better, but then that must effect fuel vaporization characteristics?  

[bakerhillpins]

You will have to forgive the noob questions here but: What exactly was the crossover for in the first place? Seems only to cause trouble. Was it used to heat the carb up in the colder climates/months?  I would have thought that cooler air would be better, but then that must effect fuel vaporization characteristics?  

Ok, so some net searching answered my own question. Yes, it was to heat up the cab, help prevent carb icing, and generally help out with cold climate performance. Or so it seems.

So next question. Sounds like that blocking off the crossover requires one to move to an electronic choke? There were also several comments indicating that blocking would cause the engine to run rich and obviously reduce economy.

Comments?

[bakerhillpins]

Never mind... Sometimes the search engine on this site digs up some pretty good reads.   

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,33194.msg363925.html#msg363925
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,47000.0.html
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,75605.0.html

Oh and the sticky thread in the engine section:
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,52284.0.html