Finally weighed my bare gen II shell

[motorcitydak]

Hey guys, I have been thinking about this figure for literally years. I finally have an answer. Last night I completely stripped my car to a bare shell before I put everything back on and brought it back to the ground. The shell is nearly stock but the trunk floor, trans tunnel and part of the firewall is removed. A 25 pound crossmember was welded onto the front end but I do not know if that equally cancels out the missing pieces.

Anyway, using 4 analog 300# bathroom scales I zero'ed them out with my jack stand on them then set the chassis on them. I then recorded the weights and checked them 3 times by lifting the weight off one stand, watching it show 0 then release the jack again. The results from those 3 times were within 5 pounds. The heaviest of those 3 readings was an astonishing 635 pounds. These things are feather weights! I cannot believe that they are pushing 4000 fully loaded!

[AKcharger]

So just the shell is 635lbs??  Wow I would have thought twice that!
cool!

[Mytur Binsdirti]

Sounds about right. My bare shell was on a 4 post lift & I could almost lift the front end up by myself.

On a separate note, you have way too much time on your hands.

[resq302]

probably the majority of the weight would be the engine, glass, and axles and rims.

[Troy]

probably the majority of the weight would be the engine, glass, and axles and rims.

My car has about 200 pounds of undercoating...

Troy

[cdr]

thank you,thats some good info

[Indygenerallee]

yep they are not heavy, on my 2 post lift when I was cutting the trunk and ass end out of my 69 I bumped it and I thought the damn thing was going to fall off the lift. easily picked it up and moved it back over!!!

[UH60L]

When my car was in the body shop, they commented on how easy it was to roll the car around the shop, and that they had figured it would be a lot heavier.

[Dino]

Hence why it crumbles like a cookie in a crash. 

[myk]

Hence why it crumbles like a cookie in a crash. 

Yeah not the strongest design in the world...

[Mike DC]

     
I'm having a pretty hard time swallowing the number.

(BTW - did you keep track of how much was on each corner?  That might be interesting to know too.)

Some of your car is obviously chopped out from looking at the pics.  But even so, it suggests roughly a 700-lb stock unibody which is pretty hard to believe.

-------

Somewhere I got the figure that a Dyancorn reproduction '69 Camaro shell weighed about 900 lbs.  I think it was for a shell with doors and a trunklid, but no subframe nor anything else forward of the firewall.  It may have even been a roofless shell.    

If the Charger figure is right, then maybe the Camaro figure I got was with the shipping container included?  I dunno.  

[Mike DC]

This is a list of 68/69 Charger weight figures I've been amassing for years.  I've posted it a couple times in the past. 

These figures are mostly based on weighing the parts by holding it in my hands while standing on a bathroom scale.  Some of them aren't perfectly accurate but I don't think anything is too wildly off the mark.


=======================================

front bumper/brackets assy – 50
(just the A-shaped brackets – 10 each)

front fenders – 30 each
(bare, solid metal)

hood - 65

front grille frame  - 18
(bare)

complete grille assy - 30ish

K-frame - 45
(bare)

LCAs – 10 each
(with mounting shafts)

factory swaybar - 12
(with all brackets)

front valance  – 10
(with lights installed)


****  total of 292 lbs up to here ****



doors  – 75 each
(almost complete, all glass/trim/vent windows/outer handles, but no upholstery or paint)

trunklid – 30



dashboard frame  – 17
(bare)

instrument cluster – 6
(complete)

front bucket seats – 47 each
(complete, intact, w/tracks, but not headrests)

back seats – 25 upper, 25 lower
(complete/intact)

door/side panels:
upper 4 – 13
lower 4 - 12

center console – 16
(complete, automatic top plate, no shifter)
(just the top plates – 6)


**** total of 680 lbs up to here ****



A/C evap box – 50
(the whole lump assy under the dash)

A/C compressor - 40
(big factory one)

starter - 15
(big stocker)

alternator – 12
 
power steering box – 37

radiators:
4-core brass – 35
2-core brass – 22
(calling it 30 when adding up totals)

gas tank – 18
(bare, no sending unit)


taillights – 7 each
(complete, lenses & potmetal inner shell)


rear leaf springs – 40 each
(6-leaf staggered ones)

driveshaft – 16


**** total of 993 lbs up to here ****



aluminum dual plane intake – 17
(eddy perf RPM for 440)

B/RB oil pan – 5 
B/RB timing chain cover – 5 (?)

tube headers – 18 each side
(B/RB wedge, full size)

[Fred]

Hence why it crumbles like a cookie in a crash. 

Don't they all? The only difference now is they come with airbags.

[motorcitydak]

Mike, I did keep track of each corner as I weighed it. With the scales and stands placed as you see them under the shell this is what I got. FR-283 FL-205 RR-60 RL-87. I was able to pick the back end up by myself just to confirm that the back end was that light. The only metal missing from my shell was the trunk floor between the frame rails, from the tail panel to the rear axle and the trans tunnel and part of the fire wall. Add in the weight of the front crossmember that i built, it should be roughly equal to the weight lost

I thought I remember reading somewhere that dynacorn builds with thicker metals. Is that right? I have no idea

I agree that this weight seems very low. I did not believe the numbers myself when I got them. I checked them all over a few times, same result. Left me with nothing else but to believe it

[Mike DC]

Dynacorn uses thicker metal but I don't think the difference is significant.  I think they just try to build stuff to stock thickness, and they err on the side of too thick rather than thin with the modern metric sheetmetal supplies.  But virtually all the steel alloys that show up in repro metal (even the best stuff) seem to be worse than the 45yo Detroit stuff, which lightens the parts back up again somewhat.  I wouldn't be surprised if the use of slightly thicker sheetmetal than stock is just an attempt to counteract that factor.  


The 635-lb figure is surprising to say the least.  A basic 318/904 drivetrain probably weighs more than that.  

 

[Dino]

Hence why it crumbles like a cookie in a crash. 

Don't they all? The only difference now is they come with airbags.

Not really no, the newer cars have crumple zones so in the event of a crash the brunt of the impact is absorbed by the frame while directing the drivetrain away from the cabin.  In many cars the engine and trans will tilt and go under the body.  In the case of a Charger you pretty much have a rigid steel cage up front and the crumple zone is your face!

At very high speeds much of this is academic by the way and in slow speed crashes you might be better off in the Charger than in a Fiat 500 with crumple zones!  It all depends on what you hit.

[HPP]

Mike, taking your totals nets us 1965. Add the uni-body brings us to 2600. Add a fully dressed RB,trans, and engine bay parts, call it 3400. Wheels, tires, undercoat, fluids, I'd say we are at 3800# easily.

[motorcitydak]

Really cool HPP! I also weighed the 5.7 hemi I am using, it almost weighs the same, 512 pounds w/o accessories. My viper t-56 is 120

[Mike DC]

    

Mike, taking your totals nets us 1965.

My list doesn't add up to 1965 lbs.  Those totals were one single growing figure for the whole list.  The grand total would have been 993 lbs before that last clump of engine stuff.


Round my list up to 1000 lbs + 635-lb unibody = 1635.  
Maybe 700 lbs for a BB motor (wet) + around 150 lbs for a 727 (wet) = 850-lb drivetrain.  
I remember the figure that an 8.75" rear was 210 lbs from somewhere, not sure what all that number included.  

All this makes 1930 lbs.  Throw in a big 12v battery and let's call it an even 2000.  
The list has been for a BB/auto car with AC and power steering/brakes.  So we are still missing a good 1600+ lbs.


Parts still not on the list:  
- electrical system (except alternator)
- most of the glass/regulators/hardware
- steering column/assy
- the whole brake system, from pedal assy to MC to wheels  
- wheels/tires
- some of the fluids
- spare tire/jack
- paint/primer/bondo

The missing stuff could easily be 600-800 lbs.  But . . . 1600+ lbs?

------------------------------------


I'm not calling you wrong.  Your 635-lb unibody figure may very well be correct.  But I am honestly stumped for where the missing weight is between your list and mine.  "Miscellaneous" and "hardware" accounts for a lot on a car, but we may be missing as much as 1000 lbs here.    

[HPP]

Okay, so it was cumulative instead of seperate. Call it 1000#.

So we add your power train figures to get to 2695#.

Group 27 battery 50#
All the wires and electical #10
Glass and hardware, maybe 15# per window, 20 each front and rear glass
steering column 15#
4 wheels brakes 45# per corner, mstr cyl 5#, pedal assy 5#, all other lines and fluids 2#
Wheels and tires 45# per corner
spare tire and jack 50#
paint-primer-filler 50#
undercoating, sealer, plugs 100#
insulation and carpet 15#

That puts me at 3457# so we are in the ball park.  My '67 Plymouth was 3250. I've seen fully dressed b bodies around 3600-3800 so we're only short a 2-3 hundred pounds.

[Mike DC]

  
Yeah, you're right.  I just added up my own figures wrong in my last post.  That's what I get for switching around the sentence order while editing it.


Your unibody figure + my list of individual parts figures + guessing 850 for the engine/tranny + guessing 210 for the rear axle = 2695# total.    


---------------

Group 27 battery 50#
All the wires and electical #10
Glass and hardware, maybe 15# per window, 20 each front and rear glass
steering column 15#
4 wheels brakes 45# per corner, mstr cyl 5#, pedal assy 5#, all other lines and fluids 2#
Wheels and tires 45# per corner
spare tire and jack 50#
paint-primer-filler 50#
undercoating, sealer, plugs 100#
insulation and carpet 15#

So that's . . . 772 lbs here?
Yeah, I could see that.

772+ 2695 = 3467 for the whole car?

Whatever.  We're in the ballpark now.  
It sounds like your unibody figure is probably right, surprising as it is.  

[Ghoste]

It is surprising, this has been an intersting thread.

[resq302]

Don't forget to add the weight of air in the tires.