Big Willie died today

[dudedart]

dick landy since you mentioned him probably has more surviving race cars than any racer. this is due to the fact he always gave them a baking soda bath after an acid dip. he took such good care that they lasted longer than him. his a990, 68 ss dart, 1970 ss challenger, 1970 hemi charger, his personal challenger & stealth to name a few have survived. willie bought all three of those daytonas new, would you abuse your new car at any time like that ? everyone knows a hemi daytona is the most sought after car of all time, thats why he bought 3 daytonas new. kinda like the dukes of hazzard, that show destroyed over 350 chargers, hence killing the very thing that made you famous. id rather have the chargers back than that lame show. a real chrysler man knows the mopars are special without being told or brainwashed. let these people and types alike destroy camaro's and mudstain's and leave the mopars to be enjoyed.

[Robert96]

 I remember when people who owned Birds & Daytonas here in Cincy back then were made fun of more than anything. They really weren't that popular at the time because they were seen to be over the top! Heck if I bought everyone that I saw on a " buy it here pay it here lot" back in the seventies I'd be freaking rich beyond my wildest dreams. Not everyone disliked them either, but they have aged well, VERY WELL!!!!!

[Ghoste]

I'm not really sure if I'm a true Mopar man or not.  I think I am but it's really best left to someone else to decide.  I do know a couple of things, one that Willie's first Daytona was quietly slipped his way by Dodge and it was largely for the promotional value of having him associated with the brand.  Willie was more about getting racing off of the street and ending racial tension.  His vision was by uniting the two passions both dreams could be realized.  Only guessing but I think the brand of car wasn't as crucial to his needs as the impact.  The Daytona certainly was an attention grabber and with the need to go fast, the acid dipping was logical.  Right or wrong with the benefit of hindsight becomes irrelevant really because he didn't obtain the cars as an investment and he sure didn't have a crystal ball to predict future value.
And make no mistake, at one time these were just old used cars.  Want to know what I did with my 69 Super Bee because the trunk floor was rusty?  I pushed it into a pond at the back of our farm.  Clearly that act would stand on the side of "not a true Mopar man" but with the 250 dollars I had into the car, there was no way I was putting more money into the rusty used up beast back in the late 70's.  It was just an old used car, the same as Willie's.
Willie didn't dip the car last year, he did it over 30 years ago.  I'd bet the bank Landy had no care about preserving the car for today either, you can be sure he neutralized after to try and keep enough structural integrity in case he needed to get more than one season out of a car.  The fact that SOME of his cars survive is coincidence.  Nothing more nothing less.

[Aero426]

Willie didn't dip the car last year, he did it over 30 years ago.  I'd bet the bank Landy had no care about preserving the car for today either, you can be sure he neutralized after to try and keep enough structural integrity in case he needed to get more than one season out of a car.  The fact that SOME of his cars survive is coincidence.  Nothing more nothing less.

This is the truth. 

[wingcar]

My original Hemi 4-speed Superbird was a daily driver back in the day.  It was considered by most to be just an old funny looking RoadRunner.  I remember being laughed at more than once....by the same group of people that would sell their right arm to own one today.  While I will never be able to afford another with today's prices, at least I had my fun with the car back then.  That's also why I decided to build a Daytona clone/custom....I now have a wingcar that I can have fun with....without worrying about its value.  
I remember that street racing was a huge problem back in the day, and my hats off to Big Willie and his memory as he did what he could to take it off the street.   Sad that officials wouldn't work with him as they should have.......................he was a real stand up guy.

[richRTSE]

its a good thing he didnt have a chance to ruin any more daytona's back then, there wouldnt be any left.

...wow...all I can say is that was...

...stupid and brought nothing positive to anyone.

Nothing like bashing a guy after he dies, let alone a deceased veteran on Memorial Day weekend.... 

[BigBlockSam]

Nothing like bashing a guy after he dies, let alone a deceased veteran on Memorial Day weekend....  rotz

    may
he rest in peace

[Robert96]

 Right On richRTSE!  See ya later Willie.

[wingcar]

It's just amazing to me how many people just don't get it.  Do our schools do that bad a job at not only teaching kids' history, but also how to think (let's not go there).  History does not change with time,   because history is what it is for all time.  What does change is the way we look at the past when we use hindsight.  (Remember what they always say...hindsight is 20/20) It's always easy to judge what others have done before us when viewing the past through contemporary eyes.  Let's face it if any of us "really" knew and understood how valuable these cars would be in the future....we would all have kept several in our garages....but apparently none of us had a working crystal ball.  No one knew...and back in the day these were just used cars that were never expected to last more than 10 years or so.  So before anyone starts to put down others who in the past may not have "babied" these "collector cars"...remember they were using them for what they were intended....DRIVING and many drove them hard.....why do you think they called them hi-performance cars back then.  Today, these same cars are now "cruising" or worst yet "trailer" cars....they are not used for purpose they were originally intended.  (Not pointing fingers, just stating a fact).  So next time a person starts bad mouthing an individual from the past about how they treated their car, just remember they used them as they were intended, and enjoyed them!
(I know I did!)

(I am now stepping off my soap box)  

[dudedart]

I'm not really sure if I'm a true Mopar man or not.  I think I am but it's really best left to someone else to decide.  I do know a couple of things, one that Willie's first Daytona was quietly slipped his way by Dodge and it was largely for the promotional value of having him associated with the brand.  Willie was more about getting racing off of the street and ending racial tension.  His vision was by uniting the two passions both dreams could be realized.  Only guessing but I think the brand of car wasn't as crucial to his needs as the impact.  The Daytona certainly was an attention grabber and with the need to go fast, the acid dipping was logical.  Right or wrong with the benefit of hindsight becomes irrelevant really because he didn't obtain the cars as an investment and he sure didn't have a crystal ball to predict future value.
And make no mistake, at one time these were just old used cars.  Want to know what I did with my 69 Super Bee because the trunk floor was rusty?  I pushed it into a pond at the back of our farm.  Clearly that act would stand on the side of "not a true Mopar man" but with the 250 dollars I had into the car, there was no way I was putting more money into the rusty used up beast back in the late 70's.  It was just an old used car, the same as Willie's.
Willie didn't dip the car last year, he did it over 30 years ago.  I'd bet the bank Landy had no care about preserving the car for today either, you can be sure he neutralized after to try and keep enough structural integrity in case he needed to get more than one season out of a car.  The fact that SOME of his cars survive is coincidence.  Nothing more nothing less.

dick landy wasnt driving old cars in 1965 68 70, they were new cars, neither was willie,
the first car he destroyed was in 1971, hardly a used old car, considering 3 year payment plans on new cars.
dick landy stated himself he did it for preserving the car. it was an investment in all means of the word.
they both were earning money, right ? the fact MOST of landy's cars survived IS NOT a coincidence, he was is forsite.
know any other racer who has that many vintage ss race cars with his name on the side still around ?
how long did landy keep his challenger before he sold it? anyone who would push a superbee into a pond inst and
never will be a mopar man.

[Ghoste]

Well like I said, someone else would be a better judge of who I am than I could ever be of myself.  You should feel very fortunate to have such profound insight into people you have never met.

[moparstuart]

I'm not really sure if I'm a true Mopar man or not.  I think I am but it's really best left to someone else to decide.  I do know a couple of things, one that Willie's first Daytona was quietly slipped his way by Dodge and it was largely for the promotional value of having him associated with the brand.  Willie was more about getting racing off of the street and ending racial tension.  His vision was by uniting the two passions both dreams could be realized.  Only guessing but I think the brand of car wasn't as crucial to his needs as the impact.  The Daytona certainly was an attention grabber and with the need to go fast, the acid dipping was logical.  Right or wrong with the benefit of hindsight becomes irrelevant really because he didn't obtain the cars as an investment and he sure didn't have a crystal ball to predict future value.
And make no mistake, at one time these were just old used cars.  Want to know what I did with my 69 Super Bee because the trunk floor was rusty?  I pushed it into a pond at the back of our farm.  Clearly that act would stand on the side of "not a true Mopar man" but with the 250 dollars I had into the car, there was no way I was putting more money into the rusty used up beast back in the late 70's.  It was just an old used car, the same as Willie's.
Willie didn't dip the car last year, he did it over 30 years ago.  I'd bet the bank Landy had no care about preserving the car for today either, you can be sure he neutralized after to try and keep enough structural integrity in case he needed to get more than one season out of a car.  The fact that SOME of his cars survive is coincidence.  Nothing more nothing less.

dick landy wasnt driving old cars in 1965 68 70, they were new cars, neither was willie,
the first car he destroyed was in 1971, hardly a used old car, considering 3 year payment plans on new cars.
dick landy stated himself he did it for preserving the car. it was an investment in all means of the word.
they both were earning money, right ? the fact MOST of landy's cars survived IS NOT a coincidence, he was is forsite.
know any other racer who has that many vintage ss race cars with his name on the side still around ?
how long did landy keep his challenger before he sold it? anyone who would push a superbee into a pond inst and
never will be a mopar man.

    where did this clown come from        he has me rolling 

[dudedart]

I'm not really sure if I'm a true Mopar man or not.  I think I am but it's really best left to someone else to decide.  I do know a couple of things, one that Willie's first Daytona was quietly slipped his way by Dodge and it was largely for the promotional value of having him associated with the brand.  Willie was more about getting racing off of the street and ending racial tension.  His vision was by uniting the two passions both dreams could be realized.  Only guessing but I think the brand of car wasn't as crucial to his needs as the impact.  The Daytona certainly was an attention grabber and with the need to go fast, the acid dipping was logical.  Right or wrong with the benefit of hindsight becomes irrelevant really because he didn't obtain the cars as an investment and he sure didn't have a crystal ball to predict future value.
And make no mistake, at one time these were just old used cars.  Want to know what I did with my 69 Super Bee because the trunk floor was rusty?  I pushed it into a pond at the back of our farm.  Clearly that act would stand on the side of "not a true Mopar man" but with the 250 dollars I had into the car, there was no way I was putting more money into the rusty used up beast back in the late 70's.  It was just an old used car, the same as Willie's.
Willie didn't dip the car last year, he did it over 30 years ago.  I'd bet the bank Landy had no care about preserving the car for today either, you can be sure he neutralized after to try and keep enough structural integrity in case he needed to get more than one season out of a car.  The fact that SOME of his cars survive is coincidence.  Nothing more nothing less.

dick landy wasnt driving old cars in 1965 68 70, they were new cars, neither was willie,
the first car he destroyed was in 1971, hardly a used old car, considering 3 year payment plans on new cars.
dick landy stated himself he did it for preserving the car. it was an investment in all means of the word.
they both were earning money, right ? the fact MOST of landy's cars survived IS NOT a coincidence, he was is forsite.
know any other racer who has that many vintage ss race cars with his name on the side still around ?
how long did landy keep his challenger before he sold it? anyone who would push a superbee into a pond inst and
never will be a mopar man.

    where did this clown come from        he has me rolling 

a clown isnt the only thing you probably rolled over for.

[moparstuart]

I'm not really sure if I'm a true Mopar man or not.  I think I am but it's really best left to someone else to decide.  I do know a couple of things, one that Willie's first Daytona was quietly slipped his way by Dodge and it was largely for the promotional value of having him associated with the brand.  Willie was more about getting racing off of the street and ending racial tension.  His vision was by uniting the two passions both dreams could be realized.  Only guessing but I think the brand of car wasn't as crucial to his needs as the impact.  The Daytona certainly was an attention grabber and with the need to go fast, the acid dipping was logical.  Right or wrong with the benefit of hindsight becomes irrelevant really because he didn't obtain the cars as an investment and he sure didn't have a crystal ball to predict future value.
And make no mistake, at one time these were just old used cars.  Want to know what I did with my 69 Super Bee because the trunk floor was rusty?  I pushed it into a pond at the back of our farm.  Clearly that act would stand on the side of "not a true Mopar man" but with the 250 dollars I had into the car, there was no way I was putting more money into the rusty used up beast back in the late 70's.  It was just an old used car, the same as Willie's.
Willie didn't dip the car last year, he did it over 30 years ago.  I'd bet the bank Landy had no care about preserving the car for today either, you can be sure he neutralized after to try and keep enough structural integrity in case he needed to get more than one season out of a car.  The fact that SOME of his cars survive is coincidence.  Nothing more nothing less.

dick landy wasnt driving old cars in 1965 68 70, they were new cars, neither was willie,
the first car he destroyed was in 1971, hardly a used old car, considering 3 year payment plans on new cars.
dick landy stated himself he did it for preserving the car. it was an investment in all means of the word.
they both were earning money, right ? the fact MOST of landy's cars survived IS NOT a coincidence, he was is forsite.
know any other racer who has that many vintage ss race cars with his name on the side still around ?
how long did landy keep his challenger before he sold it? anyone who would push a superbee into a pond inst and
never will be a mopar man.

    where did this clown come from        he has me rolling 

a clown isnt the only thing you probably rolled over for.

well there was that one time with pioneer stereo guy Oh and phone guy too   

[wingcar]

Dudedart, you need to learn how to play with others.  Everyone here is entitled to their own opinion, even if it is wrong.  The point is....it was THEIR car, which THEY brought for THEIR use, with THEIR own money.  They didn't buy the cars for future collectors.   Are you upset because they didn't save the car in an air conditioned garage waiting for someone like yourself to come along and buy it....only to put it in another air conditioned garage?  As far as I know we still have the right to buy what we like and within limits do what we like with it once it's ours.   As for Landy's being the only SS cars still out there....sorry but that's just not the case, there are others out there.   Perhaps you need to go back and study auto racing a bit, these cars were just tools of the trade and they were expendable.  Good for Landy for keeping his old race cars, others did the same but many had to move on to newer equipment and usually that would mean selling last year's car to pay for the new one. 

It really isn't for you or any of us to judge what they did with their cars.......afterall it was their's wasn't it?     

[Old Moparz]

    where did this clown come from        he has me rolling 

I was thinking one of three things.....


1)  He/she is an unhappy street racer who got ass whooped by Big Willie back in the day.


or.....


2)  Someone finally tapped into a Time Warner internet cable under the bridge. 


or.....


3)  They're just having a bad day & in need of a hug. 

[BigBlockSam]

well there was that one time with pioneer stereo guy Oh and phone guy too   yesnod yesnod yesnod

[moparstuart]

well there was that one time with pioneer stereo guy Oh and phone guy too   yesnod yesnod yesnod

[dudedart]

car butcher, plain and simple.

[lukedukem]

 

[Mike DC]

Hack up 3 Chargers for a bit more speed, and you're a butcher.


Hack up 503 Chargers for a bit more speed, and you're creating a classic.

   

[Cooter]

I wouldn't say "Big Willy" Destroyed daytonas no more than the DOH destroyed "Over 350" Chargers. Figure was more in line with around 300 in 7 years. When Mopar produced around 300,000 Chargers between 1968-1970. Less than 1% was "Destroyed" by the DOH. Which coincidently, actually made the Charger MORE famous. Gotta break a few eggs if you want an omelette I guess.

Same with Big Willy. He helped those wing cars become the icons they are. I'm amazed no one mentioned the fact that Superbirds and Daytonas were "Destoyed" by the dealers that couldn't sell those "Ugly" cars back in the day by removing those wings/noses and throwing them in the dumpster. More than one old codger has told me that story.

Easy to call Willy a Hack after the fact. Hindsight is always 20/20.

[Ghoste]

Yes, he sure was a plain and simple car butcher.  No denying it, no sense arguing it.  It would have been so much better when Chrysler gave him those cars if he had said" thanks but no thanks Dodge, I don't want to butcher those cars and race them and stuff, they need to be preserved so 40 years from now someone can put them in their museum and that way no one on the internet will throw rocks my way after I die".  Yes, that is what he should have done.

[GOTWING]

 

[Cooter]

I wonder if anybody would have had the balls to call Big Willy a "Butcher of Daytonas" back in 1970?