Superbird WAS a mosquito fogger - only a couple of years later....It's fixed!!!

[hemi68charger]

Very good Scott.. Hopefully the Spring of 2013 will be an enjoyable one for you........   

[billssuperbird]

 

[tan top]

 

[mauve66]

goodluck 

[70Sbird]

Well......the saga STILL continues.....I'm driving this car to the meet in Detroit next week so I though I would drive it for a few days to get any remaining bugs worked out
Since this is now the wettest spring on record (really!) here in Central IL, I haven't had the car out hardly at all. I got it out last week and after a few drives I started noticing oil running off the back of the engine, and specifically from under the intake! I couldn't believe that this was possible since the valley plate and rework this winter, but nothing surprises me with this car anymore. So after looking at it for a while I shut the hood and went inside in frustration. Well curiosity got the best of me after a few hours so I went back out and pulled the intake, then almost was sick....not only was the oil pooling in the intake well, but also it was being sucked into the intake ports like before  
So here I go again, apparently Permatex ultra copper sealant (that I had used last time around) is NOT recommended for intake seals! So this time I went with Ultra Black and cut some .010 Aluminum sheet metal "covers" for the 4 rectangular "windows" on each head. I cut them about 0.10' to 0.15" wider than the sides of the window, then bent a flap in the botton to tuck in between the valley plate and head. I ground away all the paint and old sealer, then glued them in place with the black RTV, then sealed over the top with the RTV, added new gaskets, sealed some more around the base of the gasket and put the intake back on...fingers toes and everything else crossed that this problem is now fixed, I also discovered that my distributor is junk, my battery is bad and I also have one exhaust tip/tailpipe hanging by a hoseclamp!
Here are some pics of the latest go-round: the first two are the with the intake pulled and oil everywhere, the next two are the little aluminum plates I cut to try and block the oil and help support the gasket.

[70Sbird]

OK, now for the final assembly (and a few prayers!)
My wife ventured out into the garage (probably to investigate the source of the constant cursing) and got a few pictures of me in action - since I had too much black RTV all over my hands to use the camera.
So here are my little shields being sealed in place, the new gaskets on and then torquing up the intake. The last picture is the whole mess all reassembled. I'm letting everything cure for about 24 hours bedore I try it again. the weather is supposed to be decent so I'll probably drive the car to work tomorrow and see how it holds up

[Dave Kanofsky]

Good luck Scott, man this has been a character building adventure.

Prayers sent 

[mauve66]

 

[WINGIN IT]

Yeah man best of luck , finger's crossed. You've dealt with a lot on this car, I know how frustrating that can be.

Keep us posted.

[TheAutoArchaeologist]

You need to take a test drive up here.  Do some barn find hunting with me.  Get some miles on the car.

[62 Max]

Don't take this the wrong way but after reading all the above posts,if the block surface would have been decked and the head intake surface milled the correct amount in relation to the block,you would not have had this problem,if neither one was untouched,same thing.I've been taking these things apart for forty + years + and never had a leak problem with the factory pan,I have actually reused them more than once.As for the paper gaskets,they were originally designed for the aluminum intake.Sometimes we are our own worst enemy,good luck with your endeavor.

[70Sbird]

62 Max, I agree completely!
My first two attempts were with the stock pan, this is now the 4th time for a sealing attempt. Unfortunately, this is a block and heads that did not begin life together and have had almost 40 - 45 years of likely repairs, modification and use. The block is newer than the heads and was only decked a minimal amount to "true up" the faces, less than .005" per side, the heads were also milled just enough to give a good sealing surface. However these were the machining operations I had done. Who knows what has transpired in the last 40 years!
I did drive the car to work today and there does not seem to be any significant leaking so far...
I'll take a closer look tonight around the intake and from underneath

[Arnie Cunningham]

Hey Scott,
I just wanted to pull this thread back up to see if you had any updates on how the engine is working.  I am looking at some very similar problems with my rebuild - smoking out of one bank, significant oil leak in the bellhousing area, valvetrain noise when warmed up, etc.
Can you list the problems/solutions you ran through?
Brennan

[70Sbird]

Hey Scott,
I just wanted to pull this thread back up to see if you had any updates on how the engine is working.  I am looking at some very similar problems with my rebuild - smoking out of one bank, significant oil leak in the bellhousing area, valvetrain noise when warmed up, etc.
Can you list the problems/solutions you ran through?
Brennan

Brennan,
Thanks for the wake up call! I havent been online much lately but I was just thinking about this 3 year old post a month or so ago and thought I could update it. The 'Bird is fixed and has used NO measurable amount of oil in the last 600 miles or so. 
I'll come back on here tomorrow with all the gory details and some pictures!
Scott

[moparstuart]

Hey Scott,
I just wanted to pull this thread back up to see if you had any updates on how the engine is working.  I am looking at some very similar problems with my rebuild - smoking out of one bank, significant oil leak in the bellhousing area, valvetrain noise when warmed up, etc.
Can you list the problems/solutions you ran through?
Brennan

Brennan,
Thanks for the wake up call! I havent been online much lately but I was just thinking about this 3 year old post a month or so ago and thought I could update it. The 'Bird is fixed and has used NO measurable amount of oil in the last 600 miles or so. 
I'll come back on here tomorrow with all the gory details and some pictures!
Scott

[Aero426]

Hey Scott,
I just wanted to pull this thread back up to see if you had any updates on how the engine is working.  I am looking at some very similar problems with my rebuild - smoking out of one bank, significant oil leak in the bellhousing area, valvetrain noise when warmed up, etc.
Can you list the problems/solutions you ran through?
Brennan

Brennan,
Thanks for the wake up call! I havent been online much lately but I was just thinking about this 3 year old post a month or so ago and thought I could update it. The 'Bird is fixed and has used NO measurable amount of oil in the last 600 miles or so. 
I'll come back on here tomorrow with all the gory details and some pictures!
Scott

You should drive it to Milwaukee Sunday morning. 

[70Sbird]

Well the title says it....It's fixed!
If you have read the previous posts (and the previous thread on all my engine issues too) this is a welcome announcement!
and the root cause of the issue was.........The heads!
I had my original "906" heads ported and rebuilt when I did the engine back in 2011, apparently there have been so many continuing issues that I never got a chance to eliminate them as the problem as I was to busy chasing "other" issues and what I thought was the more likely culprit. The heads were magnafluxed before the porting and rebuild, I can only assume now that maybe due to some porosity, new cracks were uncovered in areas that got "thin". A leak path developed between the pressurized oil passages to the rockers and an intake port. unfortunately by the time I would take it back apart (to reseal the intake for the 10th time) the oil had traveled all over the inside of the intake and heads so I never could tell where exactly it was coming from.
So, In desperation after yet again trying to fix the problem by sealing the intake I ordered a set of 440 Source Stealth Aluminum heads. I had a local shop do a thorough inspection and update the valve spring retainer hardware. Bolted my rockers on them and put it all back together.
Everything seemed fine and after a few hundred miles the oil level on the didstick had not moved!
I was happy! ....for a while.....

[70Sbird]

OK, so all was well for a few hundred miles but I was noticing a progressively worsening oil leak that appeared to be coming from under the intake and running down the back of the engine.......
I was dreading taking the intake off again (although by now I could do it in my sleep) but there was a significant enough oil puddle that formed shortly after any "spirited" driving that I had no choice...see the first picture of my 'Bird marking it's territory in the parking lot at work after a 20 minute 60 MPH+ commute.
So Once again I pulled the intake off and was greeted with the "depression" in the center of my valley plate filled with oil, How the hell could that have happened again??
Now I have new heads that seal to the valley plate, good gaskets, plenty of sealer??
the visual was identical to the pooling oil seen in the post above from 2013 reposted below for reference

[70Sbird]

Once again I'm fussing and cussing and ready to just sell this turd! It looked like all the sealer was still intact between the heads and valley plate and I couldn't see any clear leakpath. So, I got a little smarter (big step for me) and bought a plastic hose connection for an irrigation system that was pretty close to the size of my PCV valve. Using a short section of vinyl hose I adapted my leakdown tester to the sprinkler connection and stuck it into my PCV valve grommet and pressurized the crankcase to about 15 PSI.
I then mixed up some dishsoap and water and with a brush coated the entire length of both head to valley plate joints and looked for bubbles.....nothing.
I did by accident kind of feel some air moving on the back of my hand though as I was brushing the soapy water on the joint. so I started painting the whole valley with the mixture and suddenly Mr. Bubble and his whole family suddenly appeared right at a bend in the middle of the valley plate!
I stripped off what was now at least a couple layers of paint and found a crack.
With the one piece valley plates at least one of the heads has to come off to remove it and I wasn't going for that again....
So, I cleaned up the area, migged a couple of ugly welds across the crack to keep it from growing or opening up again and covered the whole seam with my new best friend JB Weld. Then I bolted the intake back on for hopefully now the last time!

[70Sbird]

It's been a couple hundred more miles and so far so good!
I have not added any oil (even with the leak) since the last oil change, now about 800 miles ago and the dipstick still shows full
The car runs great and I even took it to a local shop's Dyno Day for a bit of a power check and shakedown!
The 'Bird made 324HP and 389 ft/lbs of torque on a known "conservative" Dyno.
Doing the math based on a few other cars that made pulls with previous dyno sheets and more data, I believe that the crank HP is somewhere in the neighborhood of 400 HP and torque is near 500 ft./lbs.
AND IT'S NOT USING OIL ANYMORE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Talladega here I come!

[70Sbird]

You should drive it to Milwaukee Sunday morning. 
[/quote]

Doug,
If I didnt have a prior committment Sunday at noon, I would make the trip!

[Mytur Binsdirti]

Old cars; even when you use all new parts, it's always something.  We are all gluttons for punishment.

[Dave Kanofsky]

Congrat's Scott!
Sorry to hear the trials it has put you through.

Glad it's all good now.

[Arnie Cunningham]

 

[hemi68charger]

Old cars; even when you use all new parts, it's always something.  We are all gluttons for punishment.

I couldn't agree with Mark more...... We are all gluttons...... But, it puts a smile on our faces when we "solve' the problem or make something look better.

Scott, very glad things are better now for you....