Clacking lifters

[Paul G]

Ordered the Topline Johnson lifters today. Thanks all for your help.

BTW, I still have the old Magnum cam and lifters I pulled out of the 73 440 a few years ago. Those lifters had a little clatter to them as well. Got the old lifters out of the box and checked them. Found four out of the 16 that would collapse when the cup is pressed in. The rest would not collapse. Curious?

[404NOTFOUND]

One of my lifters just went. The lifter was worn concave and had a hole in it. Has anyone ever seen this before?

[c00nhunterjoe]

Rockers too tight, wrong oil, or faulty lifter

[firefighter3931]

One of my lifters just went. The lifter was worn concave and had a hole in it. Has anyone ever seen this before?

Seen lots of those unfortunately 

What were you using for oil ?



Ron

[404NOTFOUND]

I have used a couple different synthetic oils. The latest one was Amsoil Signature Series 10w30.  I thinking of giving Royal Purple a try. Any thoughts on that? That oil has zinc in it right?

[471_Magnum]

One of my lifters just went. The lifter was worn concave and had a hole in it. Has anyone ever seen this before?

Unfortunately, I'm all to familiar with the failure mode...
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,89312.msg1011668.html#msg1011668

[Highbanked Hauler]

One of my lifters just went. The lifter was worn concave and had a hole in it. Has anyone ever seen this before?

Unfortunately, I'm all to familiar with the failure mode...
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,89312.msg1011668.html#msg1011668

     and all those metal fileings are being pushed all through the motor I'd guess

[firefighter3931]

I have used a couple different synthetic oils. The latest one was Amsoil Signature Series 10w30.  I thinking of giving Royal Purple a try. Any thoughts on that? That oil has zinc in it right?

I know RP Racing oil has lots of Zinc/Phos but the standard Royal Purple does not. The bad news is that your engine has sustained some damage to the oilpump/bearings/crank journals/cylinder walls and should be torn down for an inspection at the very least. Those metal filings have worked their way through the engine. Sorry 


Ron

[471_Magnum]

     and all those metal fileings are being pushed all through the motor I'd guess

Yep. Had to hone the block, grind the crank, replace all the bearings and rings. Piston skirts are scuffed, but salvageable. Still trying to find the time to reassemble it all.

[Paul G]

Put the new lifters in today. Doing the pre load adjustment on #6 cylinder the adjuster bolt snapped right off on me. Crane gold rockers. I am so glad it flew away from the engine and not down a hole. Got to try and find another adjuster bolt now.   

All of the old lifters coming out looked really good actually. Nothing like the horror in the pics in this thread.

[firefighter3931]

Put the new lifters in today. Doing the pre load adjustment on #6 cylinder the adjuster bolt snapped right off on me. Crane gold rockers. I am so glad it flew away from the engine and not down a hole. Got to try and find another adjuster bolt now.   

All of the old lifters coming out looked really good actually. Nothing like the horror in the pics in this thread.

Paul, a number of years ago there was a run of bad adjusters on the crane rocker arms. Snapping off an adjuster means yours are suspect. 

Call Smith Brothers and order 16 replacements....don't chance it. 


Ron

[471_Magnum]

I had a bolt break on my Crane ductiles last year with the motor running. Discovered it while checking he pre-load after noticing an increase in lifter noise.  Luckily, both halves of the adjuster stayed on the rocker.

Replaced them all will a set from Smith Bros.

[Paul G]

http://www.pushrods.net/

Is this them? Up in Bend Oregon.

[471_Magnum]

http://www.pushrods.net/

Is this them? Up in Bend Oregon.

Yep. Just give them a call. It's about [edit] $75 delivered for a set IIRC.

[404NOTFOUND]

I'm now convinced the problem was the oil. This week I'm gonna pull all the lifters and check them. I'll post my findings. I'm also gonna switch to the new Royal Purple HPS which is loaded with Zinc and more. It was not until now that I realized how serious this oil situation really is. Thanks for all the help.

[404NOTFOUND]

Ok. Another update. This time I pulled out all the lifters to check them. All were as perfect as new except for the one that I had replaced earlier. That one was already partially ground down. I just bought another replacement, box says Clevite Made in USA and I just changed the oil to Royal Purple HPS. I'm gonna try again with the new oil but, because it is always the same single lifter only, I'm thinking there is a different problem. Any ideas? Thanks.

[resq302]

Dumb question, but when you put the new lifters in, did you put assembly oil on the cam and also on the sides of the lifter?  If you say that the lifter is starting to grind down, it seems like there is either too much pressure on that lifter or the lifter is not rotating in the bore.

[404NOTFOUND]

Dumb question, but when you put the new lifters in, did you put assembly oil on the cam and also on the sides of the lifter?  If you say that the lifter is starting to grind down, it seems like there is either too much pressure on that lifter or the lifter is not rotating in the bore.

Yup, I used assembly lube and ran the engine at around 2000 rpm for 15 minutes but, I was still on the wrong and somewhat dirty oil. Lets assume for a minute that the same lobe on the cam is partially worn down. Would there be something about that lobe that would destroy a new lifter in mere minutes? I'm hoping to find a cause before I ruin another lifter or should I just try again with the new oil?

[Paul G]

Did you swap out the cam along with the new lifter? The lobe that ground up that old lifter will grind up any new lifter it mates to now. 

[404NOTFOUND]

Did you swap out the cam along with the new lifter? The lobe that ground up that old lifter will grind up any new lifter it mates to now. 

No. That is the reality I'm hoping to avoid. A new cam is not an expensive problem but is a lot of work at the wrong time of year. I'm gonna try once more and see what happens.

[440]

I've run standard Royal Purple for years without any problems but after all these stories of cams going flat I'm definatley going to add a zinc additive.

[404NOTFOUND]

Ok, it's a whole new ball game now. It appears that the cause of the problem is that my stock, stamped rocker arms are beat to rat s**t.  If you look at the pics below, you will see that the shaft hole in the rocker is egg shaped. I know that stamped stock rockers are pretty sloppy but, this can't be right.  Also, you can see that the face of the lifter is not ground down.  Instead, it is beaten into a concave shape. All my rockers are a bit egg shaped but, especially this one and I know why. I'll spare you the long story about how I once needed one replacement rocker. A friend of a friend once gave me a handful of rockers to get my car up and running.  I installed one of them and I think it is the one in the photo as the others he gave me are almost as bad.  Those stock rockers are terribly loose on the shaft and it makes sense to me that this would result in battering of the lifter and a big loss of valve lift.  I'm guessing the stiffer springs on my new Eddy heads finally did them in.  Tommorrow, I'm getting some Harland Sharps roller rockers and better push rods.  I wanted to get your opinions as well as warn everyone of a possible problem. Has anyone else seen this?  This is not a good time for me to blow more money on the valvetrain but, it sure beats changing my cam which I now believe is ok.

[Challenger340]

IMO,
Whatever cam Lobe was running the above Lifter in the photo, will NOT survive by just installing another Lifter, waste of time trying, it is POOCHED....and time for a new Cam.

[471_Magnum]

IMO,
Whatever cam Lobe was running the above Lifter in the photo, will NOT survive by just installing another Lifter, waste of time trying, it is POOCHED....and time for a new Cam.

I agree. Bite the bullet. Replace the cam.

The reality is you've probably got bigger troubles. Drop the pan and remove a main cap for inspection. Chances are the bearings are toast from the cam/lifter metal. It's a bitch.

[firefighter3931]

IMO,
Whatever cam Lobe was running the above Lifter in the photo, will NOT survive by just installing another Lifter, waste of time trying, it is POOCHED....and time for a new Cam.

I agree. Bite the bullet. Replace the cam.

The reality is you've probably got bigger troubles. Drop the pan and remove a main cap for inspection. Chances are the bearings are toast from the cam/lifter metal. It's a bitch.

Said the same thing earlier in this thread. The engine needs to come apart and inspected/repaired. Continually throwing new parts at it will only be wasting more money. I wouldn't wait until the engine seizes or kicks a rod out the side of the block. 



Ron