Last chance to buy a "DODGE" Charger?

[Ghoste]

Old news I guess but I'm just learning about it now.  Apparently in a move as mindful of heritage as Daimler making the Charger a four door, the new Italian overlords have decided that Dodge cars will no longer be able to showcase the sporty side of the business?  As I understand (and I could be misinterpreting this all in a huge way) SRT is now a separate division and the Charger will be sold under that banner as will the 300, the Viper and the Challenger?
Am I misinformed or is this how it will be now?

[bakerhillpins]

Stupid seems like a woefully underpowered statement to attach to this if it's true but I will go with it anyhow.   

[Ghoste]

Yeah, if I understand correctly their intent is for Dodge to be the cheap small car division.

[stripedelete]

Yeah, if I understand correctly their intent is for Dodge to be the cheap small car division.

Wouldn't that make it redundant with FIAT?

[Ghoste]

Hence unnecessary?  Sure would, they've already been divested of the trucks.

[1974dodgecharger]

Yeah, if I understand correctly their intent is for Dodge to be the cheap small car division.

YEAH DID YOU SEE THE DART 210....yeah dodge is moving to econo boxes of the honda civics!!!!  I guess they said they wanted to be more 'japan' like 

[Ghoste]

I guess when the new CAFE standards come out it will be easier to kill the SRT brand?

[stripedelete]

You must have some inside skinny.   The only thing  I can find is about unwinding the truck (2010).

Oh ya, and this:

http://cs.uns.edu.ar/~jechaiz/arquitectura/division/SRT.html

[1974dodgecharger]

I guess when the new CAFE standards come out it will be easier to kill the SRT brand?

The CAFE is just making it harder for the big block to survice unless they can cut off 4 cylinders in a car to make it run like a 4 banger and get 40mpg or something.

[Ghoste]

You must have some inside skinny.  

Not hardly.  Just connecting some dots as it were, which is why I say I may be misinterpreting in a big way.  It could also be that just the SRT models are spun off into their own division.  (which seems equally poor planning to some idiot without education in the field)

[stripedelete]

What if the Dodge Division went away and you sold the Charger, Challenger, Cuda, ("extinct nameplate here") as Dodge Charger by Chrysler, The Plymouth Barracudda by Chrysler......? 

Eliminate a division and still leverage heritage.   

Why?  FIAT sounds better than Dodge? 

   

[Ghoste]

I don't know, if they are going to keep sullying nameplates that only mean something to the enthusiast anyway, why not just let rip?  The Challenger is fine right now of course but what happens when the big CAFE kicks in?  You'll need to sell a lot of little cars to offset the cool one.

[Mikesmoparperformance]

Say what This sucks Bad!!!!! Are they goning crazy ad dodge?

[stripedelete]

I like to think Detroit won WWII - they can handle the new CAFE standards.   IMO we wouldn't be in half as bad shape as we are now if they weren't let off the hook so many times over the last 25 years.

Don't forget, electric and hybrid vehicles are part of the CAFE "fleet average".

[1974dodgecharger]

You must have some inside skinny.  

Not hardly.  Just connecting some dots as it were, which is why I say I may be misinterpreting in a big way.  It could also be that just the SRT models are spun off into their own division.  (which seems equally poor planning to some idiot without education in the field)

the person will have a education, but not the experience big DIF!!!

[Ghoste]

I was referring to myself.
(although I do have some education but not marketing or business)

[Darkman]

Just think...all the folks out there who own 4 door SRT Chargers. Their values have just skyrocketed......instant classic overnight!

[F8-4life]

No real loss, I believe Dodge died sometime in the 1980's anyway.

[1974dodgecharger]

No real loss, I believe Dodge died sometime in the 1980's anyway.

I beg to differ based on opinion.....

[Ghoste]

Some might say Dodge died in 1928. 

[stripedelete]

For what-it's-worth:

After WWII the auto manufacturers retooled fairly quick, except Chrysler.  They chose to milk the prewar stuff for all it was worth.  It was profitable in the short run, but, it is argued that strategy put them in the back seat for the next 50 years.

[Ghoste]

I would argue in Chryslers case they were still stung from the Airflow incident.  They were fearful of leading for a long time preferring instead to follow trends set by GM. 

[stripedelete]

preferring instead to follow trends set by GM. 

Nevertheless,  the "back seat".

[Akron_Charger]

well Penske just switched from Dodge to Ford after developing the new NASCAR Charger for next year. Does not make much sense that they would kill the Dodge version of the Charger after all of that but it does make you wonder what is up.

[Fred]

For me Dodge died after the last 3rd gen Charger was built. 

[bull]

What if the Dodge Division went away and you sold the Charger, Challenger, Cuda, ("extinct nameplate here") as Dodge Charger by Chrysler, The Plymouth Barracudda by Chrysler......? 

Eliminate a division and still leverage heritage.   

Why?  FIAT sounds better than Dodge? 

I was just thinking of that the other day for some reason. People were talking about bringing back the Cuda but couldn't think of what name it would fall under: Dodge or Chrysler. But then I thought why not just call it Plymouth Cuda by Chrysler. It's not like you need to bring the entire line back just to justify a nameplate. Anyway, I think all this rebadging nonsense is just the marketing people trying to figure out something to do with their time. They dropped the word Dodge off the Ram line for no apparent reason so what's to stop them with screwing with the names even more?

[mauve66]

i see the truck line getting farther from fiat/chrysler, with the trucks under there own name plate fiat/chrysler doesn't have to account for their fuel economy since its s different manufacturer

[404NOTFOUND]

This head of Fiat is the same guy who early on said, "We don't need 5.7 litre engines". This tells me he is a hater. The same kind of foreign f*** who likes to get his foot in the door and destroy everything that America stands for and twist it into the European way as if that is better. He doesn't want to dominate Chrysler like Mercedes did. He wants to destroy it and turn it into Fiat. Look at the new Dodge Dart

[Ghoste]

Agreed.  Wedge the trucks off to the side.  Jeep has always been marketable.  They couldnt sell Viper so attach a few others to it and give it a brand and it gets easier.  Then Dodge becomes an outlet for rebadged Fiats and Chrysler is no longer needed.

[stripedelete]

Agreed.  Wedge the trucks off to the side.  Jeep has always been marketable.  They couldnt sell Viper so attach a few others to it and give it a brand and it gets easier.  Then Dodge becomes an outlet for rebadged Fiats and Chrysler is no longer needed.

The only way they can get away from CAFE on the trucks is to flat out sell it.  CAFE is an average of a manufacuterers US fleet. 

If your intent is to re-introduce FIAT into the US/N.America, in a big way, then maybe you get rid of both Chrysler and Dodge.  If you want to remain FIAT/Chrysler you wack Dodge. If you want to drop the past wack them both.  And so on....

Which, brings us back to "redundant lines".  Somebody is going to go away,,,,eventually.

[RallyeMike]

I would argue in Chryslers case they were still stung from the Airflow incident.  They were fearful of leading for a long time preferring instead to follow trends set by GM. 

Huh?

The reason I am a Mopar fan is because the 50's-70's cars are unique in the industry. How did you come to the "follow GM" conclusion?

[Ghoste]

Look at styling and take note of GM did things and when Chrysler did.  They followed more styling trends than they set in that era.

[stripedelete]

I would argue in Chrysler's case they were still stung from the Airflow incident.  They were fearful of leading for a long time preferring instead to follow trends set by GM. 

Huh?

The reason I am a Mopar fan is because the 50's-70's cars are unique in the industry. How did you come to the "follow GM" conclusion?

Not unique at all, until,,, pick a date,, 1984 with the K-cars and Caravan or 1994 with the truck and "in between strategy" (remember their cars (and the Dakota) were either a little larger or smaller than the class they might be classified in.) This is not to say Ford didn't follow as well.  They just did it quicker

In the 50's the giant fins are an example.   I learned recently the early 60's designs were a reaction to GM's effort to lose weight.  In 70's the "disco charger"  followed the Monte Carlo and Grand Prix about 3 years late.  The Mirada chased the trimmed down Monte, GP and GS about 4 years too late.   The 70's steamships followed GM's.
These are just some that come to mind.

Ghoste and I differ on what circumstances led to this postion/strategy, but all the same, it was very much a reality.
 

[RallyeMike]

You can pick leaders and followers at near any period comparing all kinds of different models. For example, take unibody constuction (pretty much the state of the art for all cars) -> Full size Plymouth like the Fury and Suburban went uni-body in 1960. Fullsize Chevs like Impala clung to frame construction for years after that. Who's the leader here? To make a blanket statement that Chyrsler has been a follower since the Airflow is way, way too broad of a statement to call true.

There are a lot of things unique to Mopars which is why people are so fanatical about them. Hemi, torsion bars, push button shifting, cab forward design, outrageous colors, .... the list is extensive.

Mopar: Not always the leader, but not always the follower either.

[Ghoste]

I'm talking about styling since the initial point as I understood concerned Chrysler lagging behind after the end of WWII.  From the mid 30's to circa 1980 do you have many examples of Chrysler setting the styling tastes for the rest of the industry?  Even the oddly designed early 60's models were a knee jerk reaction to what was perceived to be coming from GM.
The coke bottle lines of our beloved 2nd gen Charger?  Don't tell 66-67 GTO fans that we were first with coke bottles and flying buttress windows.  Dodge may have done it better but it was still after the fact.

[RallyeMike]

I'm talking about styling since the initial point as I understood concerned Chrysler lagging behind after the end of WWII.  From the mid 30's to circa 1980 do you have many examples of Chrysler setting the styling tastes for the rest of the industry?  Even the oddly designed early 60's models were a knee jerk reaction to what was perceived to be coming from GM.

One-piece curved windshields and padded dashes are the only styling items examples I can think of, and padded dashes was billed as a safety issue. I agree, probably more Mopar innovations were mechanical.

The coke bottle lines of our beloved 2nd gen Charger?  Don't tell 66-67 GTO fans that we were first with coke bottles and flying buttress windows.  Dodge may have done it better but it was still after the fact. 

Again, you can pick any group of cars to compare to make your point. Try this one on for size:

Someone mentioned fins - Compare a 56 Dodge fin to ANY 56 and earlier Chev and then tell me Mopar followed GM in fin styling. 56 and earlier Chevs were just protruding nubs. The 56 Dodge is a pointed fin, a year ahead of Chev., and a year ahead of everyone going crazy on fins.


Were getting off topic here..... so I'll close with that.

[RallyeMike]

PS - Beware the Ghost of Virgil Exner !

[stripedelete]

And,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,there's no Santa Clause   

[DREDILSKI]

Thanks guys! 

I learned a lot from this thread.

[mauve66]

do you think that if dodge was just for seling trucks they would be limited to the CAFE requirements??  i wonder what the wording is on it?? remember the lil red express??  they used it to get around a some kind of govrnment requirement (i forgot which) so if dodge doesn't have any cars.............. 

[stripedelete]

do you think that if dodge was just for selling trucks they would be limited to the CAFE requirements??  i wonder what the wording is on it?? remember the lil red express??  they used it to get around a some kind of government requirement (i forgot which) so if dodge doesn't have any cars.............. 

Is it possible they just pushed out enough Omni's?

The light truck cut off is at GVWR of 8500lbs. ( Is that 1/2, 3/4 or ton?)  However, the "reformed" standard (2011) includes up to 10,000lb GVWR if the primary use/intent is to carry passangers.

Found this "white paper" while looking for the answer to the truck question.  You might find it interesting or,,,,,, if you're having trouble getting to sleep...

http://fpc.state.gov/documents/organization/82504.pdf


 

[stripedelete]

so if dodge doesn't have any cars.............. 

Ram will look like GMC.

[Fred]

GMC trucks look okay to me. 

[UH60L]

And,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,there's no Santa Clause   

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!   

[1974dodgecharger]

HI GUYS IM FROM THE 'CAFE' AND EVERYBODY AT THIS FORUM IS ARRESTED FOR NOT HAVING OVER 30MPG!!!!

[doctorpimp]

I like to think Detroit won WWII - they can handle the new CAFE standards.   IMO we wouldn't be in half as bad shape as we are now if they weren't let off the hook so many times over the last 25 years.

Don't forget, electric and hybrid vehicles are part of the CAFE "fleet average".

Yeah... On the battlefield yes, but all of them in Detroit
lost WW2 for themselves years later - Japanese imports, German ownership and now Italian.
Dont worry about CAFE, soon we won't be able to afford gas-guzzlers anyway.  Gas price has doubled here in the last 7 years - about $5.25/gal now!

[XS29LA47V21]

Well by the end of the add  I had more visions of a Charger lines or maybe something else less clad, besides a lump of ................  , but I am not going to complain about their adds.  With change in owner(s), Fiat now, change is or maybe inevitable.  I am a life long Dodge guy from the days of Dukes on primetime when i was a kid and several new cars over the yrs, but to much change to happens I have become open middle aged minded to jump ship or just keep my old Dodges running, I guess time will see.   

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpi2IAec9Ho

[UH60L]

I think this change may be true or true to some degree at least.

Last week, there were announcements all over the itnernet that DODGE was going to reveal the 2013 NASCAR charger race car at the upcoming Las Vegas race.

This week, there is an official announcemet on the NASCAR site that says SRT will reveal the new 2013 NASCAR charger race car at the upcoming Las Vegas race.

I don't like the car dodge is currently selling but see promise for a proper charger in the future.  But, I do like the fact that all the cars in NASCAR are starting to look like the actual street cars, even if only on the outside.  The worst thing about NASCAR over the last 10 or 20 years is how generic the cars are.  The challenger looks great in the Nationwide series, and the leaked photos of the sedan actually make the new race body look very much like the real car (including proper sculpting of the front end plus indents in the hood and on the door witht eh side line like the real car).  Apparently all the cars are going for a more 'real" look next year.  Best thing I've heard about NASCAR in a long time.

Oops, didn't mean to make this a NASCAR thread.  Anyway, the SRT thing may be a reallity.  (either that or they are just taking over all the race stuff...)