The Origins of the Daytona Charger Thread

[nascarxx29]

I havent found anything else of Les Bowmans old 287 daytona as of yet .But I did find  some documentationfrom when it was new paperwork .For a 69 charger RT.That happens to be XS29L[287]758.As the daytonas were first 69 charger RT's.Maybe this first was a pilot car.Like the 68 side marker 69 hemi charger 500

[69_500]

That could be a possiblity, but then again to me I always considered Cotton Owens HEMI 500 to be the test mule for the Daytona's like the 68 500 was. I mean it was the first car to get the nose cone test fitted on it and all.

Wasn't the 287 car listed as being a Chrysler Ex car? Always wondered why it was built in February but one of the last ones shipped. Was it because the Ex. got the car, drove it for 6 months then let them sell it later? Isn't that what alot of EX did back then, drive a new car for 6 months or so and then sell it?

[hemigeno]

It was almost certainly built in February, but it couldn't have been sent over for conversion for quite a while.  They didn't have anything but a conceptual drawing in early Feb '69.  It wasn't until the plane trip home from the 1969 Daytona500 that Dale Reeker (the exec who was listed as getting the 287 car) sold Bob McCurry on the concept of the Daytona, and as a '69 model year entry as well.  The 287 car was already built by then - that's what I was alluding to earlier.

Mr. Reeker was probably driving that car (as an R/T) while the Daytona's design work was ongoing.  He may have sent it over later on in the summer to Creative, but I am fairly confident the conversion of 287970 was an afterthought. I don't think it could have been built at Hamtramck as a planned Daytona like the others were.  You should definitely see an R/T badge on its tailpanel, & things like that.

I hope you can find pictures of that car, and especially the fender tag/VIN. 

[nascarxx29]

Jim Radke been around along time in the wingcars .We should shot him a email

[nascarxx29]

I wonder if it possible the green daytona used in sept 69 playboy recharging the charger article .Was the early 287970 daytona .For one it has MI manafacture plates it appears. 2 lack of fender scoops .3 black handle door buttons.That or not usually on a daytona.I see alot of the chrome door push buttons on daytona.Not the black ones

[69_500]

I've often wondered about the Daytona in the playboy add. That car is missing the fener scoops completely.
Is Jim still a member of either of the aero clubs? I know he is the one who told my dad about the HEMI 500 he bought. My dad was staying with Jim while out in California looking at a Daytona and then they went and looked at the 500.

So if the 287 car was an R/T to begin with like all of the others, what is to say that it wasn't in the first batch that was sent to Creative. If Mr.Reeker wanted a Daytona badly enough he probably could have pulled some strings and got his current R/T turned into a Daytona as well right?

[nascarxx29]

I met and knew Les Bowman that owned 287970 from buying parts from him over the years at various shows .He must have had some in side chrysler connection.As he also owned the wild painted mystery factory kept superbird .I was told he painted that daytona red

[hemigeno]

I don't think that it was in the first batch, as it should then have had a much earlier ship date.  That's an educated guess, but his was the last car listed as being shipped from C.I.  Either his car would have taken the longest of any of them to convert, or the ship date would have had to be reported wrong.  The target date to begin conversions at Creative was June 1st, long before 9/8.

Makes you wonder if Chrysler realized on their ACCUS/NASCAR reporting list they would be a car or two short (I still count only 499 VIN's even with 287970) and they added Mr. Reeker's car to the tail end of the list.  Of course he would have consented to having his car converted to keep the racing program on track for its Talladega debut.  He also would have vouched that the car was shipped then, whether it was actually converted by that time or not.  That's just a guess too.

I wouldn't begin to say that 287970 was never converted - I just flat don't know.  But the car doesn't fit the pattern of the rest of these cars, and something unusual happened - that's for sure.

[nascarxx29]

I had asked about this car before on other boards.And was brought up in the vintage wingcar posts that run for some time.I did get this reply in dug up from 10-21-03
Daytona L287970. Was owned many years by Leslie Bowman he would never let me see the fender tag or broadcast .He changed the car to R4 red with black interior and drilled holes into the C pillars for the charger nameplate.Car was originally F6 black leather interior SE V6W.He knew it was the first one .But tried to hide his modifications.That was how Leslie done it ,Jim Radke saw the tag and the sheet and said they were real.But I not sure if Jim actually saw the car

It was brought up in this post aswell I recall .
http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=585449&an=0&page=0#585449

[69_500]

Here is a thought. If it was an Executives car, and he wanted a Daytona, and was willing to let them convert his current on loan car which would have been the 287 car. Then who is to say they didn't convert it early on in the production run with the first batch, and that he just continued to drive it after the conversion. Then allowed it to be shipped to a dealership for sale. I mean if he had the car from the date it was built, to when it could have been convereted in say June. That would mean rought 3 months of driving. Then you figure they would have taken what 4-6 weeks probably converting it. So that leaves him another month and a half to drive the car. Figuring that after 6 months which would put it right around the Shipment date listed, he let it be shipped off to a dealership for sale.
What do you guys think of that? Its a long stretch, but just a thought. I know a lot of dealerships that allow workers to drive cars for a few months then they sell them on their lots later. At a reduced price of course, but not much of a reduction. That is typically the car they want you to test drive if you want to drive one of that model too.

[hemigeno]

Might be true, but the car is listed as being shipped to Chrysler Corporation - Dale Reeker.  It wasn't shown as being sent to a Dealer at that time.  It probably hung around for a while.  From what Dave B. is saying, Les Bowman had connections with someone, which is how he ended up with the car.  It's strange that the car is being kept under wraps.  Makes me even more curious, although I greatly respect Jim Radke's knowledge and experience with Wing cars.

[69_500]

Okay so just change that last part from being shipped off in September, to being brought back to Mr. Reeker in September. Because it wouldn't have been shipped being that he probably would have just went and picked it up himself.

[Ghoste]

And in regards to the Playboy Daytona, does it appear ANYWHERE else?  I haven't seen it.  What is the earliest press release info we know of and how does it compare to the Playboy car?

[Aero426]

Might be true, but the car is listed as being shipped to Chrysler Corporation - Dale Reeker.  It wasn't shown as being sent to a Dealer at that time.  It probably hung around for a while.  From what Dave B. is saying, Les Bowman had connections with someone, which is how he ended up with the car.  It's strange that the car is being kept under wraps.  Makes me even more curious, although I greatly respect Jim Radke's knowledge and experience with Wing cars.

I wouldn't say the car is being kept under wraps, or deliberately out of the public eye.   It's been in the same family for years and has passed to one of the sons via the estate.   There's absolutely nothing secret about it.  Like a lot of other cars, it just hasn't been out.

[69_500]

There seems to be quite a few of these wing cars that have been in garages for the past 10-15 years. It seems that some people just stopped taking the cars out after say 1988 or so.

[nascarxx29]

Les also ended up owning the mystery superbird AKA Hewitt superbird.That had been kept by Chrylser since 1972

[Ghoste]

There seems to be quite a few of these wing cars that have been in garages for the past 10-15 years. It seems that some people just stopped taking the cars out after say 1988 or so.

Hmmm, around the time of the first "musclecar boom".  I wonder if the owners of these cars just got sick of opportunists trying to buy the cars all the time?  I don't mean the usual offers, but the ones that you just know are coming from flippers.  Or maybe the sudden rising values started making everyone worry about their "investment"?  Or some combination of all of those?

[69_500]

Could be. There are people I know with multiple cars, that have taken the same car to every event since the mid to late 80's. Only due to they only want the majority of people to know that they have that one.

[Ghoste]

I would also think that if you had more than one, you likely get a favorite in there too that becomes the preferred car to show.

[nascarxx29]

Besides Les old 287970 .This other car of his is hidden away somewhere ,Maybe out west

[XS29J8]

While looking up on 434780 .I had this 2 page WW newsletter submitted daytona vin list by GG as of 11-89 .It has 468330 and 500564 as recorded daytonas.Also a friend of mine currently has one of the daytonas owned by a chrysler exec.It is a very well optioned out car.To believe it I had to get a copy of its buildsheet from him.Im also still looking for further info on the 287 daytona

Sorry to bring this old thread up but an engine & 4spd with this VIN (4347xx) has surfaced as a 68 red Charger. Any other info of this car being a  possible 68 Charger 500? Could this be the engine from the press car stolen in LA years ago?



Steve

[nascarxx29]

 There a few stolen car stories that surround these cars Ive read and heard over the years And cars went back to Chrysler and became re purposed.One we know was Cotton Owens 500.That became the model for wearing daytona parts was recovered after being stolen .And retrieved by Cotton Owens .I got a old article around here where a Chrysler supplied the press either a HEMI 500 or a 68 426 Charger.I got to find that article. Which that car was stolen and found stripped in Watts CA found sitting on milk crates.That car became the #88 as it said in the article.  

[Ghoste]

Do you have the VIN from the #88 car to tie it to this engine Dave?

[Aero426]

Sorry to bring this old thread up but an engine & 4spd with this VIN (4347xx) has surfaced as a 68 red Charger. Any other info of this car being a  possible 68 Charger 500? Could this be the engine from the press car stolen in LA years ago?



Steve

434xxx is too high numerically to be from a 1969 Charger 500, and could not be from the press Charger that allegedly became the #88 race car.

[XS29J8]

Sorry to bring this old thread up but an engine & 4spd with this VIN (4347xx) has surfaced as a 68 red Charger. Any other info of this car being a  possible 68 Charger 500? Could this be the engine from the press car stolen in LA years ago?



Steve

434xxx is too high numerically to be from a 1969 Charger 500, and could not be from the press Charger that allegedly became the #88 race car.

Hi Doug, the engine in question is from a 68 Charger per the VIN, and would fit a build for a late 68 in June Or July .............just found it interesting Dave was checking a VIN with the first 4 digits matching it and I thought he was checking the  #88 car built from a 68 Charger?? I know of no HEMI 4spd Chargers built after June 1st for the public, not that there weren't any............Do you know the VIN that was on the Charger used to develop the 88 car and was it a 68 as Has been discussed previously?


Thanks,
Steve