TERRIBLE OIL FAILURE ( WE GOT A WINNER!!! ) becomed on pushrod lenght discussion

[Nacho-RT74]

I was riding today to a car meeting, and on half of the way, I began to heard a multiple tappet noise increassing, oil gauge PEGGED to low SIDE, and iddle increassed. Fortunatelly I was far a way from home, maybe a mile and a half, and got to arrive back to home with traffic lights in my favor and riding with low RPMs.

Initially thought on oil pump driveshaft broken tip. Removed distributor and removed shaft. NO, oil pump driveshaft is in perfect conditions.

Then used the oil primer shaft and drill to check for oil pump conditions ( new Melling 63 HP ). Was spinning allmost free of resistance ( hence the iddle increassed ), then thought: BINGO! oil pump damaged ?  ( thanks God is a Big Block easy to replace ). Well before, decide to remove oil pump, decided to remove oil filter to check if REALLY the oil pump wasn't working with the primer hex shaft. The result was... I GOT OIL COMING OUT FROM PUMP OUTER HOLE.

now... what to think about this ?

OIL FILTER DAMAGED ?

SOMEKIND OF BYPASS VALVE ON OIL PUMP ?

[BigBlockSam]

 

[billschroeder5842]

Hmmmm.... I'm not quite following but I'm trying...

No pump damage; pressure into the filter
No engine pressure

Is your filter clogged in some way? that would explain pressure in, but nothing out??

[Nacho-RT74]

is it posible to get the oil filter holding the HP oil pump pressure without explode, leak around or something ?

beside that, the oil pump was spinning allmost free with the primer shaft and oil filter still on car, true oil was hot ( hot enough from a 15 minutes ride ), so less viscosity. But still shouldn't a clogged oil filter dragg more the oil pump ?

Dunno how much oil I must see coming out from pump without filter and a drill, instead the engine moving it.

of course both are new, pump and filter ( Millard ML16 ). Just 2 weeks riding.

thats why I'm thinking on somekind of bypass at oil pump a valve or bypass sytem at oil filter ? or anything like that

[Nacho-RT74]

needles to say, all my oil readings were untill now UP TO LAST GOOD READING I NOTICED ON MY OIL GAUGE, right at the FULL top of gauge, High pressure.

[John_Kunkel]

Does the engine run OK? A bent pushrod will allow a lifter to pop out of its bore and dump the oil pressure.

[BSB67]

Be sure you are turning the pump counter clockwise.

Although unlikely, the oil pump pressure relief bypass valve could be stuck open.

Oil passage plug may have been loose and just fell out, again, unlikely.

[Chryco Psycho]

or sucking air somewhere in the oil pick up tube ??
I hope you are not using FRAM filters ?

[Nacho-RT74]

I used the drill in both directions... yes of course counterclockwise. Both got me about same traction.

so the oil pump has a bypass valve! something to check! where to check?

an oil passage plug loosen could cause an oil leak which I never got. Is the one what keeps the pressure spring, right ? or is there another one around ?

Filter is Millard ML16. I'm aware of the FRAM filters low quality.

I thought on the air being sucked by the pickup tube... buuut... if 2 minutes before I was full pressure and suddenly no pressure, do you think the pick up tube can get that kind of instant failure instead being progressive ? The pick up tube can not spin inside the engine... broken tube ? how ? I added teflon to the tube threads

[tan top]

sorry to hear about this Nacho  ,   i've got nothing to add , thats not all ready been said  , oil pump drive shaft  , or  pushrod  bent / fell out , but sure  you would of felt / heard all about that if that happened 
, 
    sounds silly but what about the actual hex socket  on the pump , that the oil pump drive shaft goes into ! has not rounded , so the shaft is  no londer turning the pump 

[Nacho-RT74]

I can feel the hex drive when fits squared inside the pump, but... who knows. will check that.

Does the engine run OK? A bent pushrod will allow a lifter to pop out of its bore and dump the oil pressure.

pushrods bent ? I have got couple of pushrods bents in the past, but never a lifter coming out the location .

its running like a shit since valves are not really opening like it should. I can heard all the tappets.

BUT sounds logical... I'm not sure in fact If I heard some louder noise before all this, will take off one valve cover to check that. I had to fix a valve cover oil leak on passenger side anyway.

will be a nice new if that since, will mean the crank mostly sure never stop to get oil, at least some, on the ride back to home

[nvrbdn]

have you taken the pan off and inspected the pump? if your spinning the pump and oil is not flowing and your not building pressure, id look at the pick up tube. my step kid did this with a rebuild in his cuda because he left a small blue paper towel in a port while painting. sucked up in the pick up tube.

[Nacho-RT74]

its a BB so oil pump its outside

oil is coming out from oil pump once filter was removed, so shouldn't be that. But as usuall everything is prone to be checked. I will begin from top to bottom.

I hope won't be that because remove the oil pan is really a headache, and I used LOT of silicone around to seal it good.

[Nacho-RT74]

Does the engine run OK? A bent pushrod will allow a lifter to pop out of its bore and dump the oil pressure.

DING DING DING... we got a winner!...

pushrod is not bent, but maybe out of the right preload adjustment and simply jumped out. Lifter was out of bore. 6º cilinder intake one. Will check driver side to be sure about the rest

[nvrbdn]

cool.

[Nacho-RT74]

the best is.... free and easy

I have not cranked the engine yet, just checked with primer shaft and oil gauge and got reading back beside the drill drag, AND LOT OF OIL COMING OUT FROM ROCKERS LOL... thats why I haven't cranked the engine yet, to clean it cold.

[nvrbdn]

kunkel had the answer to the 24 dollar question. good job whats his prise?

[heyoldguy]

Okay the lifter was out of the bore. Why? Something else is wrong. There are millions of lifters staying in their bores and this one comes out? If the pushrod isn't bent why did the engine release the lifter? Did the valve stick open, the cam lobe rotate down and let the pushrod fall out and the next time the lobe came up did it sling the lifter out? Was the valve open far enough that the piston came up and hit the valve, bending it? Did the rocker arm seize on the shaft and cause the problem? I'm trying to remember, aren't these PRW rockers? They come from the factory with all sorts of metal shavings in the shafts, adjusting screws and rocker bodies. If these systems aren't cleaned completely before using, problems could arise. The lifter didn't just decide to take a vacation, something set it home from work.

[firefighter3931]

  There's a reason that lifter popped out....start searching 



Ron

[Nacho-RT74]

I'm thinking on incorrect rocker adjustment but also thinking on what else could went wrong.

Bent valve but engine running could cause a backfiring throught the carb, being it was an intake valve/lifter, right ?

At this moment I'm fighting to keep the engine running, but it looks the carburetor is really out of adjustment... I'm toward to incorrect or damaged O rings ( TQ ) allong with too much height on floats... look my other thread about pinging. Once I turned off the engine, I can see white vapors coming out from inside the carb

the time I could make the engine spin, I heard still one lifter still making noise.

rockers are free moving into the rockershaft, and no free play I could notice.

Valve of the related lifter looks to be in order. When I removed the rocker shaft all were at same height.

I checked all the rockers assembly before mount and all edges were fine, without any weird sharp edge able to damage anything.

[FLG]

Nacho i hate to keep bothering you, but get rid of that damn TQ i dont care what anyone says there pieces of junk compared to a properly tuned holley or proform. You drive your car a lot...the difference between the holley and tq was night and day, i know you want to keep it (even for originality) but youll be so much happier with a holley or proform carb.

[Nacho-RT74]

[FLG]

Also i PM'ed you back about the paypal thing...let me know.

Found what seems to be a nice one local to me

http://cnj.craigslist.org/pts/2777011431.html

(ill even throw in some spare jets for you just to persuade you)

Get rid of the TQ!


LOL

[BSB67]

I'm thinking on incorrect rocker adjustment but also thinking on what else could went wrong.

Bent valve but engine running could cause a backfiring throught the carb, being it was an intake valve/lifter, right ?

At this moment I'm fighting to keep the engine running, but it looks the carburetor is really out of adjustment... I'm toward to incorrect or damaged O rings ( TQ ) allong with too much height on floats... look my other thread about pinging. Once I turned off the engine, I can see white vapors coming out from inside the carb

the time I could make the engine spin, I heard still one lifter still making noise.

rockers are free moving into the rockershaft, and no free play I could notice.

Valve of the related lifter looks to be in order. When I removed the rocker shaft all were at same height.

I checked all the rockers assembly before mount and all edges were fine, without any weird sharp edge able to damage anything.

If it was miss adjusted, you would be able to figure it out as it is still mis adjusted.  The mis adjustment would need to be a lot for the PR to fall out.

I recomend that you determine with greater certainty the root cause of the PR coming out.  .

[Nacho-RT74]

working on it, but now need first to keep engine running LOL

yes Frank I got the PM... but my head its at this moment in other stuff... I need to send around CAN$120

and no, will keep the TQ as far is posible LOL. It was running nice just lean LOL