Firm feel steering box-stage 2 or 3?

[WHITE AND RED 69]

I am about to order a new steering box from firm-feel but not sure which one to go with. Stage 2 or 3? I have been leaning towards stage 2 but I dont want to have regrets about it later wishing I got the stage 3. Is the stage 3 overkill? Any owners who bought the stage 2 and wish they got the stage 3 or the other way around? I heard somewhere that the stage 3 feels more like manual steering. any truth to that?

Thanks for the help.   

[bakerhillpins]

Gah... MrAngry just posted in another thread his recommendation which I believe was Stage 3...



[edit]

Ah... here it is
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,87573.msg988745.html#msg988745

Here's a quick and simple recipe to enhance any 68-70 Charger - do this and you've got a car that rides and handles night and day compared to anything stock. Yes these parts cost money, as does EVERYTHING we do with these cars, so don't bitch and moan about price. Also, regardless of how well you think your stock car handles let me just say you are completely wrong... it's awful.

1. A nice set of sway-bars front and rear - Hotchkis, Addco, Helwig... any will do, just make sure you don't go too big in the rear.
2. Shocks - for a nice daily driver shock the Edelbrock IAS performers are the best out there for money and KYB's suck butt. For a performance shock go with RideTech single or triple adjustables.
3. Bigger Torsion bars - I'd go .96 for a street car
4. Stiffen that sucker up - at a minimum do subframe connectors, for better handling use XV's full chassis stiffening kit
5. Install a Firm Feel stage III steering box, as well as the fast ratio idler and pitman arms - this makes a world of difference.
6. Tubular upper control arms to adjust castor and camber. Firm Feel, Hotchkis, Magnum Force... etc.
7. Brakes - use a GOOD 4-wheel disc brake - this is big, so DO YOUR RESEARCH
8. Wheels and Tires - if you like 14 or 15-inch wheels then have fun staying in the stone age. Your tire selection sucks and you won't be able to fit any kind of real brake caliper behind those wheels. Upgrade to 17-inch or bigger. Do this and your contact footprint as well as your tire selection improves greatly.
9. OVERDRIVE - cruising at 70 mph at 4000 rpms with 4.10 gears is ridiculous especially when you consider an $8 Hyundai will crush you in a top speed run - just do this and be happy.

Otherwise that's it - hope this helps.

[bill440rt]

Clayton, I have a Stage 2 from Steer-n-Gear in my '69 & really like the feel of it. Not too stiff, & not loose at all. Firm, but not overkill.

[HeavyFuel]

Ok...what does the Firm Feel box do?  Just what the name says, firm up the "too easy" feeling of the old school power steering?

[bill440rt]

Companies such as Firm Feel & Steer-n-Gear sell rebuilt steering boxes or will rebuild your own. They offer them in 3 different "flavors":

Stock: Original, easy steering feel. Easy steering does not mean loosey-goosey, which is just a worn out box.
Stage 2: Firm. It will feel similar to a new car. Stiffer, with good road feel & response.
Stage 3: Firmest. Probably something you'd want if you are racing the car on a road course.

I chose Steer-n-Gear because they are a vendor at Carlisle, so there were no shipping charges & I got a better price for the core.
I've heard good about both companies.

http://www.firmfeel.com/
http://www.steerandgear.com/

[elacruze]

I have the FF Stage III and I love it. Don't worry about it being too stiff, it still has less effort than my 2000 Cavalier.

And way less than my '68 D200 with manual steering.

[mpdlawdog]

 

[ChargerST]

I would get a stage III and if that's still too soft you could always lower the pump pressure -> steering gets harder. Very easy mod, there was an article in MA about it.

[68 RT]

I got stage2 wish I would have gone for the stage 3. Really like the stage 2 though. Huge improvement over stock.

[gtx6970]

I put a stage 2 box in the Hemi Cuda last year( to soft for his liking ) . owner hates it and is going with stage 3 T/A box in it over the winter

[WHITE AND RED 69]

Thanks guys! This is just the info I have been looking for. Stage 2 sounds good but I think stage 3 will be the one I get.

[dangina]

guys who get stage 2 usually wish they got the 3. I say 3.

[Dino]

guys who get stage 2 usually wish they got the 3. I say 3.

Sure seems that way.  So does the stage 3 feel more like a race car or more like a modern car with power assist steering?  I'm looking for the latter.  My only beef with the current lack of feel is at speeds over 50 mph.  Cruising at 35 it's no big deal.

[elacruze]

3 box just makes the wheel stay steady...the weight of your hands doesn't move it so much. The actual effort it takes to turn is still pretty light-parking lot maneuvers are still a one-palm event. My 2000 Cavalier has a stiffer wheel, and my '96 sunfire is still a little bit higher effort. Trust me, it's not anything remotely akin to manual steering, nor does it slow down quick inputs. Probably most importantly it doesn't have any oversteer-that is when you make a fast move, the wheel stops when you stop input, rather than the mass of your hand and the wheel turning more than you wanted.

[Dino]

3 box just makes the wheel stay steady...the weight of your hands doesn't move it so much. The actual effort it takes to turn is still pretty light-parking lot maneuvers are still a one-palm event. My 2000 Cavalier has a stiffer wheel, and my '96 sunfire is still a little bit higher effort. Trust me, it's not anything remotely akin to manual steering, nor does it slow down quick inputs. Probably most importantly it doesn't have any oversteer-that is when you make a fast move, the wheel stops when you stop input, rather than the mass of your hand and the wheel turning more than you wanted.

I could not have asked for a better explanation!  Stage 3 it is.

Thanks!   

[JeffYoung]

I have a Firm Feel Stage III. I think it is still too "light" although I like it.

It firmed up effort required to turn the wheel some, but I'd say no more than "normal" mid 90s performance car. It certainly doesn't feel like the manual steering race cars I've driven.

No question I would avoid the Stage II.

[bill440rt]

I'm wondering now if the Steer-n-Gear "Stage 2" is any different than the Firm Feel "Stage 2"?? 

I only ask because my Stage 2 box from Steer-n-Gear is NOTICEABLY firmer than stock. 
Then again, I have a smaller diameter steering wheel so that might help matters also.

[adauto]

I got stage 3 steerngear inmy Chally. Granted shorter WB but but nice/quick/precise. 

[Purple68]

I like my stage 2, don't forget if you have a smaller steering wheel that will increase the effort required to turn as well.

[elanmars]

Stupid question but what all do I need to get if I want to go with a firm feel stage 3? Just wondering.

[Dino]

Stupid question but what all do I need to get if I want to go with a firm feel stage 3? Just wondering.

Nothing more you need to get.  You'll have to send in a core and they send you the stage 3.  There's always more upgraded steering and suspension parts you can buy but nothing you 'have' to get.

[Kern Dog]

When I bought my stage 3 from Firm Feel, they REALLY tried to push a stage 2 unit. I don't know if they had a few sitting on the shelf and wanted to clear them out, or what. I stayed true to my wants and got the stage 3. THAT, along with the fast ratio idler and pitman arms, made the steering feel great. 2 3/4 turns lock to lock compared to 3 1/2 for a standard setup. Fewer turns also meant added resistance at the steerinmg wheel.

[stripe74au]

i just put a stage 2 in the 68 R/T charger and the 70 R/T challenger. Feels great, especially when both have smaller steering wheels now. cant compare to the stage 3 as i havent driven one. but the improvement over stock was staggering, in both examples. the FF guys also "steered" me (no pun intended) away from the 3 and into the 2. maybe for general public consumption they wont have people complaining about the 3 beeing "too" hard. thats just a guess

[Dino]

i just put a stage 2 in the 68 R/T charger and the 70 R/T challenger. Feels great, especially when both have smaller steering wheels now. cant compare to the stage 3 as i havent driven one. but the improvement over stock was staggering, in both examples. the FF guys also "steered" me (no pun intended) away from the 3 and into the 2. maybe for general public consumption they wont have people complaining about the 3 beeing "too" hard. thats just a guess

Nice 68, looks like the twin of my car.

[stripe74au]

i just put a stage 2 in the 68 R/T charger and the 70 R/T challenger. Feels great, especially when both have smaller steering wheels now. cant compare to the stage 3 as i havent driven one. but the improvement over stock was staggering, in both examples. the FF guys also "steered" me (no pun intended) away from the 3 and into the 2. maybe for general public consumption they wont have people complaining about the 3 beeing "too" hard. thats just a guess

Nice 68, looks like the twin of my car.

thanks. likewise.

maybe yours is the twin of mine? who knows? stranger things have happened.

[mpdlawdog]

I  just put my new box from autozone in my car with a smaller steering wheel.....WHAT A DIFFERENCE!!!!!!!!!!!the autozone box is alot cheaper also!! 

[FLG]

I  just put my new box from autozone in my car with a smaller steering wheel.....WHAT A DIFFERENCE!!!!!!!!!!!the autozone box is alot cheaper also!! 

Yes but its still a standard box, so its only as good as it was new. The firmfeel stage 2 and 3 boxes give the car more of a "new" car feel, more precise.

Any new box is better than an old worn box, but most find a stock box too loose and ff offers a much tighter box than stock 

[mpdlawdog]

I  just put my new box from autozone in my car with a smaller steering wheel.....WHAT A DIFFERENCE!!!!!!!!!!!the autozone box is alot cheaper also!! 

Yes but its still a standard box, so its only as good as it was new. The firmfeel stage 2 and 3 boxes give the car more of a "new" car feel, more precise.

Any new box is better than an old worn box, but most find a stock box too loose and ff offers a much tighter box than stock 

anytime you can find a tighter box is a good thing!  for 3x less money Im good with mine..it really did make a huge improvement with the steering wheel and new box.....it will never handle like a new car  ..at least not without spending a ton of money into it....now if I can just get some time to fix the pump!