TOP 10 MISTAKES WHEN RESTORING A 68-70 CHARGER!!!

[dodgedarren]

I'm thinking top 10 "restoration" no no's, not "modifications". I like to hear more about this painted rocker panel pinch weld and undercoating application to the wheel wells. I did put my tail stripe on myself and it is not exactly
centered with the side marker. Was their and deviation on this from the factory???

[Troy]

If we could filter out all the extra questions and comments and keep it to individual issues with the corresponding "correct" way this would make an awesome sticky thread! 

Hood recesses not blacked out
Pinch weld under rocker panels not blacked out
No OR improper applied undercoating in the wheel wells
Tail panel black out incorrect

I would also like to know about these.

"Pinch weld under rocker panels not blacked out"
Troy, it is my understanding this was a '71-up thing? On a 2nd gen undercoat car, there might have been some sloppy overspray on the pinch welds, but I've never seen a separate black out paint applied there.
You have any confirmation of this?? 

The area of the hood where the turn signals reside has a few indentations towards the front. These should be blacked out (I believe these are decals) - including the area around the signal. I want to say that the sides of the lenses may have been black as well. No idea where that reference is at the moment.

Other people here are much more knowledgeable than me so I get most of my information from them. For example, Jim (maxwellwedge) has - or has owned - a ton of original cars so I pay close attention to whatever he writes and any pictures of his cars that show up. My bronze 68 Charger definitely had pinch weld blackout. Naturally, I took pictures of the shiny original paint after some of it peeled off without actually taking pictures of the blackout. I didn't take detailed shots of those areas on either my blue 68 Charger R/T or Sublime 70 Challenger which are both original paint. I guess that will be a project for this weekend! Daytona examples:
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,64805.msg727016.html#msg727016
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,48725.msg745274.html#msg745274

I do have some wheel well pictures of the Charger that I need to upload. I did a quick search but didn't come across anything good. This may help though:
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,48725.msg865426.html#msg865426
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,22608.0.html
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,48725.msg925282.html#msg925282
http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,48725.msg925118.html#msg925118

On the tail panels, in 68 the black basically covered the entire inside of the line created by the trim with the edge of the paint usually splitting the trim holes. I have seen cars where the entire back end was black but it shouldn't go below the lower trim piece. Since 69 and 70 don't have the lower trim, that one is harder to figure out. We wandered around Carlisle one year looking specifically at that area and I probably still have all the pictures. If I remember right, the most common appeared to be a straight line down from the quarter extensions down to - and including - the top of the lip behind the rear bumper where the tail panel and valance meet.

Troy

[dodgedarren]

WOW!! Im amazed at the amount of over spray on the pinch weld. I don't think I could do that and feel OK with it.
It make me wonder why is it that important to have the correct overspray. Does it really add value to the restoration
or is it just to say that it is "factory correct"?

[maxwellwedge]

#1 mistake? Calling anything but exactly the way the factory did it a "restoration".

One tiny deviation makes it a "restification" not a restoration.

Well said.
Anything other than a 100% stock resto would/could fall into the "modified" category. Then, it all boils down to details & workmanship.
Painted stripes that should have been decals on a stock resto is a big no-no.  

"Pinch weld under rocker panels not blacked out"
Troy, it is my understanding this was a '71-up thing? On a 2nd gen undercoat car, there might have been some sloppy overspray on the pinch welds, but I've never seen a separate black out paint applied there.
You have any confirmation of this??  

My Daytona's all have it and pretty well all of my 70 stuff.

[maxwellwedge]

Restoration? There is no such thing. Although I have seen some very nice rebuilds.

Huh?

[Troy]

Going to use Gene's car as an example again...

you can see both the wheel well and pinch weld blackout treatment. On a bright color these are very obvious but shadows and lighting will keep most people from noticing on a darker color. Visually, the color stops at the bottom of the rockers where the designers planned. However, since his car is "correctly crappy", you can see where they overshot the outside color on the suspension and also didn't replace the pinch weld blackout when the front fenders were swapped during the Daytona conversion. Other manufacturers (like Ford) painted the whole bottom of the car black.


The undercoating inside the wheel well also kept rocks from putting an "outie" on the top of the fender.

Troy

[bull]

Bull - Overall are you happy with it or   

It's only the undercoating isn't it ?

What I meant was that I should have done most of the restoration before having it painted. By underside I mean get the undercoating done and rebuild/install the engine, front suspension, trans and rear end/suspension prior to paint. The reason it made sense to me at the time is because I had saved up a big amount of money and didn't want to piss it away on little stuff. What I should have done in retrospect is put that money away in a time deposit or something and then nickel and dimed my way through the other parts of the project. As it is now I have to be more careful around the paint as I'm working on all the other stuff.

[dodgedarren]

Bull - Overall are you happy with it or   

It's only the undercoating isn't it ?

What I meant was that I should have done most of the restoration before having it painted. By underside I mean get the undercoating done and rebuild/install the engine, front suspension, trans and rear end/suspension prior to paint. The reason it made sense to me at the time is because I had saved up a big amount of money and didn't want to piss it away on little stuff. What I should have done in retrospect is put that money away in a time deposit or something and then nickel and dimed my way through the other parts of the project. As it is now I have to be more careful around the paint as I'm working on all the other stuff.

I put blankets over everything I could during the reassembly. I did have a broom handle fall and make a small dent that cost me $150 to have fixed.

[maxwellwedge]

Here is what is left of the original black on Disco-Tona. Usually it is the same flatness of the core support black-out (25-33% flattened) but it is gloss black on this car - I noticed the same gloss on the Malcolm Daytona survivor as well.

[jb666]

biggest mistake:  taking it apart in the first place thinking  "it won't cost that much"       

B-I-N-G-O!!!

[lexxman]

My mistake buying the car in the first place.I would never buy a car in boxes again.

[bill440rt]

So is this about mistakes we have made or pointing out those of others?

Good point, Curtis. 

In that case, biggest mistake I made was using 440 hood callout decals instead of stencils the first time around when painting on the V21. I thought I'd be able to use the decals as patterns, then pull them off & complete painting the V21 hood treatment. I sure goofed on that one. The decals left a glue residue that was impossible to get off. It ruined the paint work, & I had to start all over again.    I used stencils the second time.
That, and using SSBC brake kits. 

But, then again, this was on a "restification" NOT a restoration.

There are countless mistakes that can be made when restoring a Charger. But, if a person chooses to build a car in a certain way, then that is not a "mistake", is it? 

[kab69440]

if we list all our mistakes, do we get judged with a point system? if we aquire so many points do we get benched for X amount of days? cause i have mistakes------or mabey mistakes to others, but just doin a charger the way i want to me. #1. i have 68 parts in my interior. #2. i have a 71 steering wheel. #3 i have 69 front seats, #4 i have a 69 block, #5. i have a black interior instead of a charcoal interior, #6. my paint color is a forien semi paint code, #7. i have smoothed out the seams in the rear valance, #8. there is bondo in my car, #9. (and this is a biggie folks) i painted a stripe on a car that didnt come with a stripe, and then i painted a "68" stripe on a "70" charger. im thinkin i could be in the lead for the most NO-NO's.

HAHAHAHAHA! You are NOWHERE NEAR being the forerunner...

[XS29L9Bxxxxxx]

If we could filter out all the extra questions and comments and keep it to individual issues with the corresponding "correct" way this would make an awesome sticky thread!  

Hood recesses not blacked out
Pinch weld under rocker panels not blacked out
No OR improper applied undercoating in the wheel wells
Tail panel black out incorrect

Troy

From this thread:

Decals, for sure 

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,74322.0.html

[nvrbdn]

are those black out stickers specific to 69?  were they on all 69's or just certain packages?

[Patronus]

My biggest mistake was waiting so long. I relish in a good project, except it's usually someones house. (contractor)
Now, I have this other side, making cars. 

[dodgedarren]

biggest mistake:  taking it apart in the first place thinking  "it won't cost that much"       

B-I-N-G-O!!!

Take what you think its gonna cost and double it!!!! I don't regret it. It was allot of work and frustration
but the ends results is well worth it. My friends were blown away. They had no idea to the extent I took it.
I would do it again if the opportunity arose.

[Troy]

are those black out stickers specific to 69?  were they on all 69's or just certain packages?

They were on 68 and 69.

Troy

[tan top]

#1 mistake? Calling anything but exactly the way the factory did it a "restoration".

One tiny deviation makes it a "restification" not a restoration.

yeah i'm guilty of that   

[Rustymuscle]

How about building a General Lee out of anything that's NOT a '69 Charger? (Not to mention mistaking Hemi Orange or Camel Tan interior for General Lee Orange and light tan interior?)

[Finn]

biggest mistake:  taking it apart in the first place thinking  "it won't cost that much"       

Lol too true...When I first started my project I had it all figured out how I could get it running and driving for 2500 bucks and a year's worth of work. 

Now it's been almost 5 years and a whole lot of money later

[Troy]

I took a bunch of pictures in the garage over the weekend but I'll probably start new threads for the details. My bronze 68 Charger has traces of blackout on the rocker pinch weld. The pictures I had earlier only showed the areas where it had peeled off. Since the car is under construction, some of the paint that's left has overspray on it but the back side and edges of the stuff that falls off is black. My January built QQ1 68 Charger R/T doesn't appear to have ever had anything on the pinch weld. My Sublime 70 Challenger (October built, LA plant) definitely has the blackout on the pinch weld and it's in relatively good shape. It looks like there was an attempt at masking it too - where the Charger, Jim's photos, and Gene's car all look like the gun was just aimed in the general direction. These cars are all the evidence that I can count on. My other Challenger has been "restored" at least twice, the turquoise 68 Charger R/T had been painted over, the gold 68 Charger had 10 layers of paint on the parts that weren't rusty, and my black 68 Charger was, well, black.

Troy

[Highbanked Hauler]

 before the wreck my car might have been "restored" in 1990  but now I would say its a little better than a paint job.

[wingcar]

How about painting huge 01 numbers on the doors and a Confederate flag on the roof.............
................JUST KIDDING, put down the rope!

*If you restored YOUR Charger the way YOU want it..............then there's not really an issue with it being a mistake....
as long as you enjoy it (besides the next owner can correct it)   

[ACUDANUT]

Pentastar on both front fenders, 70 tail lights in a 69.

Could you post a picture of the two side by side...I really thought they were the same.