It's fixed, finally.

[BananaDan]

First off, if anyone is a mechanic here I don't mean to offend, but I imagine that the fact that you are on this site you are already more talented than the mechanics I've been dealing with for the past year.  So, the story...

One of my cars is a 2005 Mercedes E500, and it has the bi-xenon motorized/cornering headlights setup.  A little over a year ago we started getting alerts on the heads-up screen that there was an active headlight system failure, bring the car to the dealer.  I bought her CPO in 2008 and negotiated a 3-year full warranty in the purchase, so all of this nonsense hasn't cost me a dime thankfully.  I bring the car in and they tell me that the computer doesn't have any errors logged and the warning isn't coming up then and there for them so there's nothing they can do.  We deal with it intermittently for about 10 months and I get fed up and bring it back.  At this point it was alerting consistently every time you drove the car.  Previously it was doing it only occasionally.

This time they find an error code in the computer and replace the entire driver's side headlight and motor assembly (which required removing the front bumper which surprised me).  They didn't tell me how much this would have cost w/out a warranty, but I can only imagine.  Hell, I had a foglight replaced two years ago that a rock on the highway shattered and it was almost $300.  No more than 10 days after the visit to the shop (about a month ago), the warning starts popping up again only occasionally.  Awesome.  So my wife has today off and sees it this morning and asks me if she should take it to the dealer, I tell her yes.  Screw the appointment, I'm fed up, drive it in there and tell them to fix this finally.  So I talk to them this afternoon after having it all day and they tell me there's nothing in the computer, so they don't know what to do or replace.  I flip on them, basically asking them unless a computer tells you what's wrong with a car are you incapable of fixing anything?  The service advisor didn't like that too much and he assured me he had a tech on the car and they'd keep looking at it and they sent out a tech support call to the MB tech network.  How about doing some basic troubleshooting?

At the end of the day I get the call, it's fixed.  The connector from the harness that plugs into headlight/motor assembly they replaced last month had two loose connections in it.  They had to pull the wires out of the connector, recrimp the terminals on the wires, put them back into the connector and plug it back in.  Now I'm not a mechanic, but I have replaced just about all of the wiring on my Charger and this sounds like some simple crap a highly trained and certified Mercedes tech should be able to figure out.  I mean, this is one of the first things they should have checked.  They found the issue by doing continuity tests.  So basically they'll spend 1.5 days to replace a part that probably costs over $1,000 because a computer told them to when the issue was really .50 cents worth of connectors and maybe 30 minutes of time with a continuity tester and crimpers.  

Don't get me wrong, I love the car.  It's a blast to drive (and I drive her hard), great sportiness, comfort and technology etc...  But these kids that work on them don't hold a candle to the people on this site or my regular mechanic that works on my Jeep and Charger for things that are out of my skill capacity.

Sorry for the rant and novel.  I'm a bottle of wine into the night after a crap week and this incident today with MB service pushed me over the edge.

[FLG]

I think it comes down to the fact cars have gotten so complex its near impossible to troubleshoot without a computer. We have a no start issue on our dinosaurs and its a simple check for spark and fuel...now adays it could be any of dozens of sensors or wires. Transmission issues are no longer easily identifiable, even suspension issues now can be hard to figure out (for example mercedes abc system is a disaster).

it could also be somewhat inability or lazyness...but if I gave u a new car and said "it dosnt start figure it ut without a computer" id imagine even the most skilled mechanics would be scratching there head for the simple fact that they know what *might be wrong but without that tool its very hard to figure out.

Ill take my carburetor, thank you very much.

[xpbprox]

Had a similar problem on my mothers R350. Told us to replace the lights, turned out (well this is what Mercedes said) bad wiring harness, so they replaced the whole damn thing! I'm sure it was expensive but warranty had it covered.

[Tilar]

I don't want to hurt anyones feelings because I've been a mechanic since the early 70's, but I think the term "mechanic" is getting out of date in todays time, Many of them are nothing more than "parts changers".

From my perspective it all boils down to where "mechanics" today have never had to actually diagnose a problem on their own. They've all had a computer or on board system tell them what was wrong with the car (or truck or any piece of equipment nowdays) and if it's a problem the original computer programmer has never encountered, that computer is clueless which in turn leaves a blank stare on many mechanics today because they don't know how to troubleshoot on their own.  No that doesnt apply to all mechanics, but it does to the "parts changers".

Remember, A computer is only as smart as the programmer with the least experience.

[tan top]

I don't want to hurt anyones feelings because I've been a mechanic since the early 70's, but I think the term "mechanic" is getting out of date in todays time, Many of them are nothing more than "parts changers".

From my perspective it all boils down to where "mechanics" today have never had to actually diagnose a problem on their own. They've all had a computer or on board system tell them what was wrong with the car (or truck or any piece of equipment nowdays) and if it's a problem the original computer programmer has never encountered, that computer is clueless which in turn leaves a blank stare on many mechanics today because they don't know how to troubleshoot on their own.  No that doesnt apply to all mechanics, but it does to the "parts changers".

Remember, A computer is only as smart as the programmer with the least experience.

that it true !! was a bout to type something along them lines 

[1969chargerrtse]

We deal with this type of issues on elevators.  If the CPU doesn't tell you what's wrong and it's a simple connection and intermittent, we have spent 10's of thousands in time and parts.  I kid you not.  It always falls in the hands of our adjuster.  He's the real smart guy.  He WILL find the problem.  We had one elevator that we must of spent over 20,000.00 on in time and parts.  We kept doing what the boss or tech support advised.  One day he said, I still think it's this part, and on his own, he ordered the part and the problem is gone.  He is priceless to the company.
I do understand both sides of this story.

[rooks]

From my perspective it all boils down to where "mechanics" today have never had to actually diagnose a problem on their own.

Spot on. That's where the problem lies. With reliance so heavily put on computers, it has come at a cost of hands-on diagnostics.

Mechanics 101 has been replaced by Computers 101.

[Cooter]

First off, Being a "Mechanic" as you guys call it, You guys have any idea how much at a DEALER you get paid on Commission to diag. an electrical problem???
If that electrical problem was found so easy, WTF didn't YOU repair it?? I mean afterall, your evidently smarter than the tech working on your car right?


Obviously, none of you know..otherwise, you'd be thanking your lucky stars you got that overpriced, German, POS car repaired at all...People today simply have gotten used to the idea of "Instant gratification" and being "Ignorant" of the time it actually takes to repair vehicles today.. They simply don't understand why some repairs SEEM as if they weren't "Checked in the first place" and "Repaired correctly the first time"..Yet, these same people will go to a doctor and let him "Guess" at what's wrong with them and "Try" some new fangled pills at $100/pill??

Why is it that when it comes to Medical problems and diagnosing them correctly, the doctor is allowed to guess bout every damn time and "Try" everything, and you NEVER hear anybody say sh*t like "Well, I got a guy down the street that can take out my speen for $200.00, why are you charging me $200K??"

You guys refer to "Hands on" diagnosis?? How many times have I seen a thread/post opened here talking bout how you can't repair your newer car? Can't even SEE the engine let alone work on it?? Why do they make new cars so hard to work on??? And on and on and on.....You guys KNOW how hard these cars are to repair, and you still bi*h about stupid sh*t when you have NO CLUE what you're talking bout...Typical public...I think EVERYBODY who's had a gripe should have to work on these damn things for a year..Then, you wouldn't have the posts like above.....You'd actually understand....

Yet, when it comes to the vehicle you put your family in, you will inevidably go for the cheapest brake pads, cheapest parts/labor you can find, then come back to the shop bit**in about how you got screwed....It's your family for goodness sake...One would think you wouldn't want some reject from the 60's working on your brakes for cheaper, but this isn't the case...

Gents, I'll say this much, you get paid NOTHING, NADA, ZIP, ZERO to diag. electrical problems at a DEALER nowadays with the Manufacturers giving out these f**kin' 100K mile warranties. So, the next time you think you were Done wrong cause you didn't see that extra overtime at your cushy hourly job, just remember, there's a poor "Tech" that got shafted on your Mercedes electrical problem...Do you know HOW to get paid for this and not upset the Manufacturer to where they kick it back and refuse to pay the dealer for electrical problems?
You guessed it, "Handwriting 101"...You punch the damn ticket, then you have to write all this BS you checked by looking up all these connectors and sh*t till you have a "Plausible Scenario" so if checked up on, the manufac. Can actually look it up. All this takes time and when you on commission, you don't have it to waste.

The real kicker here is you guys will be dealing with this more and more as the economy is sh*t and getting paid for 25 Hours and being there for over 40/week isn't cool anymore so all the dealers have left are "Kids" that can surely install a fart cannon on a Honda, but cannot diag. your Mercedes.

Another thing to remember, it isn't like it was 60 years ago..Most "Techs" you see working for Mercedes? Ask them where they were BEFORE coming there and you'll most likely get a response like "Walmart changin' oil".....Just because they wear the label on their shirt, doesn't mean they have been a tech at that dealer for 25 years and know every nook a cranny when cars change by the month being that the average public just has to have all this BULLSH*T ON THE NEWER CARS...From intertaining their little Badass kids with a movie, to pluggin' in to the internet, to a realtime roadmap sitting in the center of the damn dashboard...


Wake up fellas, it's gonna get worse when there just ain't no more guys willing to even TRY and please the unpleasible American Public working on their cars.
You guys think it's bad now, give it 10 years..........NOBODYwants to work on cars any longer because of the responses above. I refer to people bit*hin like above as the "Three B's".... "I didn't BUY it, BUILD it, OR BREAK it.."

[xpbprox]

NOBODYwants to work on cars any longer because of the responses above. I refer to people bit*hin like above as the "Three B's".... "I didn't BUY it, BUILD it, OR BREAK it.."

As far as mechanics not wanting to work on peoples cars, I'd say it depends on where you work at. I would think working at the dealership doing warranty work is probably more of a pain in the ass then just working at a non-dealership mechanic shop.
I still want to work on cars and I didn't get offended by his response to his situation. The work force of this world has had a serious attitude change from beck then. They feel like just because they showed up to work today and gave a half ass performance, that they are entitled to a pay check. No more accountability just laziness. no doubt the attitude of the consumer has changed too, they have become ignorant and reliant on services. Just my tangent thoughts.

[Mike DC]

I think it comes down to the fact cars have gotten so complex its near impossible to troubleshoot without a computer. We have a no start issue on our dinosaurs and its a simple check for spark and fuel...now adays it could be any of dozens of sensors or wires. Transmission issues are no longer easily identifiable, even suspension issues now can be hard to figure out (for example mercedes abc system is a disaster).

it could also be somewhat inability or lazyness...but if I gave u a new car and said "it dosnt start figure it ut without a computer" id imagine even the most skilled mechanics would be scratching there head for the simple fact that they know what *might be wrong but without that tool its very hard to figure out.

Ill take my carburetor, thank you very much.

I agree with this sentiment.  I don't blame the mechanics so much as the unnecessarily-complicated vehicles.  

Look at the computer industry - who "repairs" a laptop?  That's not how it works.  If something mechanical is broken, then they will find out about it at least partially (if not entirely) through computer diagnostics.  Then the tech himself will change out a subassembly or major component.  He won't be in there with a soldering iron fixing something manually.  Time/money/parts/design have moved that industry away from that way of operating.  

Cars are headed the same way, where the repair guys are changing out larger & larger parts of the car rather than trying to manually "repair" anything.  It still takes skills & brains to do this kind of work.  But the emphasis will fall more & more on the brains part and less on the manual repairing skills.

[RallyeMike]

Jeez Coot, I don't think you'll find too many people here looking you up in the yellow pages for work    

Some techs are good, some are not. Some shops are good, some are not. It's been that way since the beginning of time. You throw in the fact that cars now are extremely complicated, and that people expect all that complicated crap to work, even the best shops are going to be challenged in dealing with technical issues and hiring people who want/are able to deal with them. Probably most of the people on this board, as smart as they are don't have what it takes to be a good tech with the challenges of these new cars.

How many of the gadgets that manufacturers are piling on these cars are really necessary? Guess what gang, when the warranty expires it will be your problem, and you can expect to be frustrated and clean out your wallet because that is what the car-buying public demanded, and that is what the car companies have sold us. 

[TK73]

Hey Coot, try some decaf...   

[TK73]

First off, Being a "Mechanic" ...

What I'm hearing is there is no real motivation to find a problem that is "off the books" on a warranty.  Just bill what you can within the limits of what the dealer says will get paid?  That is until the customer yells loud enough after 3-4 trips.

Damn shame the manufactures have screwed the little guy with the badge.  They figured out what really counts to their "bottom line".

[BananaDan]

I don't want to hurt anyones feelings because I've been a mechanic since the early 70's, but I think the term "mechanic" is getting out of date in todays time, Many of them are nothing more than "parts changers".

From my perspective it all boils down to where "mechanics" today have never had to actually diagnose a problem on their own. They've all had a computer or on board system tell them what was wrong with the car (or truck or any piece of equipment nowdays) and if it's a problem the original computer programmer has never encountered, that computer is clueless which in turn leaves a blank stare on many mechanics today because they don't know how to troubleshoot on their own.  No that doesnt apply to all mechanics, but it does to the "parts changers".

Remember, A computer is only as smart as the programmer with the least experience.

This is what I'm talking about.  My local mechanic is awesome.  Yes it costs good money to use him, but he knows his shit, always fixes the problem and is trustworthy.  My Benz would be with him if it weren't still under warranty.  It's the dealer techs, the dealer's service program and the manufacturer all combined together that leads to it taking a year and who knows how much wasted time and money on their end to fix two bad connections.  In the end they really lost on it due to the way they handle warranty repair policies.

Coot,
If I understood your rant correctly and those techs don't get paid overtime for stuff like this, I have a bigger issue with dealers than I had thought.  A man should always get paid for work he does, and if he isn't he has legal options or options with his union if he's in one.  I never said I was smarter than them, and if I were capable of fixing it I would have done it myself.  Relax.  My issue is with the scenario that has lasted over a year, not with all dealer mechanics/techs in the known universe.  I work in computers and like this industry there are good techs and bad techs, people that can diagnose an issue with troubleshooting and those that can't and just always call/ask for help.  My issue primarily was on visit #1 they flat out wouldn't touch the car because according to the computer, the car was fine.  Screw me, I must be imagining it.  Second visit they spent 1.5 days to replace a very expensive part that had to be flown in from Germany, taking half of the front end of the car apart to do it.  Problem not fixed.  Third visit they don't want to touch it again because again, according to the computer, nothing is wrong.  I tell them BS and get in there and troubleshoot the problem.  Less than an hour later, it's fixed.  I don't agree with they way it was handled and how I was jerked around.  If you think I'm a whiny bitch for that, then so be it.  I have little to no tolerance for wasted time or money.

[bill440rt]

The customer nowadays doesn't give a rats ass how you're getting paid and for what. They just want their car fixed correctly, and the first time. Like it or not, it is the customer who's supplying your paycheck.

I went thru a similar scenario with my last Ram. The dealer couldn't really diagnose the problem (all was under warranty, so why should I be the one to chase it??), so they just threw whatever parts at it the "computer" told them was wrong with it. Same problem, over & over & over again repeatedly. They never did fix it, & it went back as a lemon. My hunch is that they weren't competent enough to REALLY find out what the problem was.

Dan, you have a legit gripe. All the tech had to do was look at the connector and/or test it.
And, I can attest for Dan that he has higher mechanical skills than the "typical public".

[Mike DC]

 
150 years ago, I'm sure there were older generation blacksmiths griping about how "these kids today can't even make their own tools anymore." 

Time marches on and technology advances.  People used to be able to make their own wagon wheels by cutting down trees right there at the site of the breakdown.  Now we consider a guy a wheel expert if he can straighten an existing bent rim with existing tools.  On the other hand, the new guy also knows how to balance a rim perfectly.  He may also understand how to spray several stages of urethane paint to refinish it.  Etc.  The guy chopping down trees for a wagon wheel in the 1800s couldn't have done any of that other hi-tech stuff. 

Every time period demands its own skill set.  Most people are skilled in some areas but nobody is skilled in all of them.  There has never been any shortage of unskilled incompetent morons in any age either. 

[resq302]

First off, if anyone is a mechanic here I don't mean to offend, but I imagine that the fact that you are on this site you are already more talented than the mechanics I've been dealing with for the past year.  So, the story...

One of my cars is a 2005 Mercedes E500, and it has the bi-xenon motorized/cornering headlights setup.  A little over a year ago we started getting alerts on the heads-up screen that there was an active headlight system failure, bring the car to the dealer.  I bought her CPO in 2008 and negotiated a 3-year full warranty in the purchase, so all of this nonsense hasn't cost me a dime thankfully.  I bring the car in and they tell me that the computer doesn't have any errors logged and the warning isn't coming up then and there for them so there's nothing they can do.  We deal with it intermittently for about 10 months and I get fed up and bring it back.  At this point it was alerting consistently every time you drove the car.  Previously it was doing it only occasionally.

This time they find an error code in the computer and replace the entire driver's side headlight and motor assembly (which required removing the front bumper which surprised me).  They didn't tell me how much this would have cost w/out a warranty, but I can only imagine.  Hell, I had a foglight replaced two years ago that a rock on the highway shattered and it was almost $300.  No more than 10 days after the visit to the shop (about a month ago), the warning starts popping up again only occasionally.  Awesome.  So my wife has today off and sees it this morning and asks me if she should take it to the dealer, I tell her yes.  Screw the appointment, I'm fed up, drive it in there and tell them to fix this finally.  So I talk to them this afternoon after having it all day and they tell me there's nothing in the computer, so they don't know what to do or replace.  I flip on them, basically asking them unless a computer tells you what's wrong with a car are you incapable of fixing anything?  The service advisor didn't like that too much and he assured me he had a tech on the car and they'd keep looking at it and they sent out a tech support call to the MB tech network.  How about doing some basic troubleshooting?

At the end of the day I get the call, it's fixed.  The connector from the harness that plugs into headlight/motor assembly they replaced last month had two loose connections in it.  They had to pull the wires out of the connector, recrimp the terminals on the wires, put them back into the connector and plug it back in.  Now I'm not a mechanic, but I have replaced just about all of the wiring on my Charger and this sounds like some simple crap a highly trained and certified Mercedes tech should be able to figure out.  I mean, this is one of the first things they should have checked.  They found the issue by doing continuity tests.  So basically they'll spend 1.5 days to replace a part that probably costs over $1,000 because a computer told them to when the issue was really .50 cents worth of connectors and maybe 30 minutes of time with a continuity tester and crimpers.  

Don't get me wrong, I love the car.  It's a blast to drive (and I drive her hard), great sportiness, comfort and technology etc...  But these kids that work on them don't hold a candle to the people on this site or my regular mechanic that works on my Jeep and Charger for things that are out of my skill capacity.

Sorry for the rant and novel.  I'm a bottle of wine into the night after a crap week and this incident today with MB service pushed me over the edge.

Dan,

I agree with you.  I have had issues to go back to a dealer because of a knocking in my engine only because the mechanic there did not want to get involved with the lenghty process of ripping apart my engine to replace a cam phaser in my 05 Ford F150 engine.  Well, my 2007 is now knocking with the same noise and it is under the basic power train warranty.  Its going back there again!  I agree with the theory that if they don't get a code "there is nothing wrong".  I had that with my 05 and my  07 is doing the same thing.  No codes but the engine is knocking.  I guess that knock is supposed to be there now when it hasn't been there for the past 30,000 miles.

[resq302]

I think it comes down to the fact cars have gotten so complex its near impossible to troubleshoot without a computer. We have a no start issue on our dinosaurs and its a simple check for spark and fuel...now adays it could be any of dozens of sensors or wires. Transmission issues are no longer easily identifiable, even suspension issues now can be hard to figure out (for example mercedes abc system is a disaster).

it could also be somewhat inability or lazyness...but if I gave u a new car and said "it dosnt start figure it ut without a computer" id imagine even the most skilled mechanics would be scratching there head for the simple fact that they know what *might be wrong but without that tool its very hard to figure out.

Ill take my carburetor, thank you very much.

Frank,

this is why I like working on my antique cars so much.

[Cooter]

The customer nowadays doesn't give a rats ass how you're getting paid and for what. They just want their car fixed correctly, and the first time. Like it or not, it is the customer who's supplying your paycheck.

:

And this is why OUR shop is set up to tell "Customers" like you to go straight to hell with that kind of attitude. This is the "un-understanding" side of things that makes me wish some of you worked on cars for about a year...You wouldn't have that attitude very long..My Bossman told me not to even try to explain this as NON E would give a sh*t...Damn, I hate when he's right....Contrary to popular belief, the Customer is NOT always right..Most are idiots looking for someone to blame for them buying a German POS car....You bought that POS Dan, now either live with Mechanics that don't want/need/can't work on it, or trade the damn thing off....

[gtx6970]

Having been a dealer tech for well over 25 years. I will say..

MOST of the problem is manufacturers today will make it extremly difficult to get paid for non fault code diagnostics,,IF they pay for it at all. So there for the desire to spend hours on a job to get paid for maybe 20% of the actual time it took  time after time it takes the wind out of your sail. . I will say after the tech gets kicked in the balls over and over and over , his desire to do the right thing gets shoved down farther and farther over the years. And to get the most of  clock time diagnostics paid you have to write a novel in hopes you get most of it back. Sorry, I'm a tech NOT an author. And guess what ,,,,,,'clocked off' time writing said novel is on the tech and is non payable time.

One of my former Serv managers would just let the serv dept eat it should it get charged back instead of charging it back to the tech  involved.

BUT , my most recent serv mgr was a mindless bumbling idiot with no balls what so ever that could barely tell a headlight from a tail light and was more than happy to stick it to the tech every chance he got. HE is the main  reason I now work for myself.

Finding a  problem with NOTHING but the owners word 'something isn't right',,,And yes believe me ,,, it happens,,,, hundreds of times .  If I had a quarter for every car that came in the shop with something wrong that was eventually traced to owner malfunction and I would be rich .


.And Dan thats not what I'm saying is the problem here

[Cooter]

Well, Finally, someone who's been there and done that....TOTALLY understand Bill....


And Dan, don't even get me started on POS BMW, Mercedes, Lexus, Audi, Porche, Some Vw's, and the like that are Stated and have the reputation to go "Forever", but people will buy the WRECKED and put back together cars off the used up lot, then bring it in with all kinds of things like Air Bag modules that were NOT replaced at the time of the wreck and need for the light and bags to work properly...THIS burns me up, because the poor tech gets blamed for NOT diagnosing it for FREE as they can "Go down the street to autoAone/advance auto and get it scanned for free"....the bodyshop/adjutyser for the insurance didn't do his job either, but I see no bitchin' bout that one?

Wonder why if 99% of ALL used cars are wrecks people will put their families in these everyday, but they see one Wreck of a 1968 Charger being sold on the internet for big bucks($20K) and pick it apart like there's no tomorrow?

[bull]

The customer nowadays doesn't give a rats ass how you're getting paid and for what. They just want their car fixed correctly, and the first time. Like it or not, it is the customer who's supplying your paycheck.

:

And this is why OUR shop is set up to tell "Customers" like you to go straight to hell with that kind of attitude. This is the "un-understanding" side of things that makes me wish some of you worked on cars for about a year...You wouldn't have that attitude very long..My Bossman told me not to even try to explain this as NON E would give a sh*t...Damn, I hate when he's right....Contrary to popular belief, the Customer is NOT always right..Most are idiots looking for someone to blame for them buying a German POS car....You bought that POS Dan, now either live with Mechanics that don't want/need/can't work on it, or trade the damn thing off....

Speaking of pills...

[Tigger]

Well heres my  . Been with Chrysler for 10 years now, from the techs point of view, i do want to try to diagnose and fix the customers vehicle on the first visit and quickly as possible. Let me explain how flat rate techs for Chrysler get paid under warranty. For example, if your vehicle needs a short block replacement under warranty Chrysler will pay the dealer 7 hours to replace that short block. Now if the tech thinks he is been screwed by the amount Chrysler is paying, Under franchise agreement the dealer can pay the tech more to compensate. A short block is like 10 to 12 hours to replace. No dealership will pay their techs more to fix and vehicle under warranty. Chrysler has a fixed amount of time to repair every part of the vehicle. Electrical is the absolute worst paying under warranty.

A HUGE problem trying to find a intermittent problem is the diagnostic procedure from Chysler (or any car manufacturer). The engineers themselves don't know all the possible problems or conditions that could occur. There are no two vehicles built the same, too many options and drivetrain variations. If the concern is intermittent at the time of the vehicle being serviced and cannot be duplicated, what do you want the tech to do. Fix it? fix what? do you want us to throw parts at it? Take and educated guess?
Believe me, most techs who have a mortgage and a family want to fix the customers vehicle, our families depend on us and you the repeat customer. There are beltway bandits at dealerships and rotate in and out. But that is with any occupation.

I want YOUR business, even if its warranty, because i need a confident customer to keep returning long after the warranty runs out.



I agree 100% with gtx6970, after repeatedly getting beat down from Chrysler, the service managers, and customers who believes everything should be fixed in 20 minutes and not cost anything wears a tech down. The tech gets penalized for trying to care and does not see the financial satisfaction for doing so.

This my opinion of how a dealership should be set up. If the dealership has 10 techs, 3 should be paid a salary to deal with the no starts, intermittent conditions, the i have a squeak at 85 mph while slamming on my brakes. The other seven techs can do the other stuff like maintance and recalls and other warranty issues.

Most dealerships have a shopforeman for this< and he is usually backed up for days.

I know for most, dealerships leave a bad taste in your mouths, but there are techs in each and everydealer ship who care, but system is not set up to care. This is not the techs fault, just caught in the middle of corporate greed and and a instant gratification public.

[Tilar]

Having been a dealer tech for well over 25 years. I will say..

MOST of the problem is manufacturers today will make it extremly difficult to get paid for non fault code diagnostics,,IF they pay for it at all.

This goes hand in hand exactly with what I said above:

and if it's a problem the original computer programmer has never encountered, that computer is clueless which in turn leaves a blank stare on many mechanics today because they don't know how to troubleshoot on their own.  No that doesnt apply to all mechanics, but it does to the "parts changers".

Remember, A computer is only as smart as the programmer with the least experience.

Cooter, I do understand that there are still a FEW real honest to God mechanics out there that know what they are doing, so don't take it so personal. Remember, there are quite a number of us on this site that have been going down that road a long time. It won't be very long that 40 years ago will mark when I took my first mechanic job.

[General_01]

This is why I only go to dealers with warranty issues. Otherwise I find competent mechanics who are not like Cooter. Take your own advise Cooter. If he should "live with his German POS or sell it" maybe you should "do your job or get out". All you ever do is bitch about customers. It's totally a miracle that you get any business at all with your attitude towards the people who pay your income.