440 initial start up issues

[CharcoalCharger]

My buddy has a '69 Charger that he just put a 440 into.  The engine he bought had been rebuilt by a reputable shop.  Yesterday was going to be the first day we were going to fire it up.  Things didn't go as planned.  He has a see thru fuel filter and we are not seeing any fuel.  We were told however that the engine has to be seeing some serious rpms for the fuel pump to work (not the amount of rpms from the engine cranking over).  Our timing and firing order are all right, we checked and rechecked it.  We swapped the fuel pump with one we knew worked (We didn't know the history of the one that came with the engine).  We made sure the fuel pump rod was in and properly installed.  We checked that all fuel lines are cleared.  We are thinking of swapping carbs next.  Is there anything else we should be looking for?  The one thing I noticed, the engine seems to backfire and fire shoots out of the carb that is currently on there.  Any help with this issue would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks. 

[bobs66440]

Sounds like a timing issue to me...or maybe the plug wires are mixed up. If it's backfiring, it must be getting fuel.

If the fuel pump is not working how did you get it to backfire? Did you dump some fuel in the carb?

[b5blue]

  Mine is pulling the same problem right now after sitting a long time. The difference is I dump some fuel in the carb. and it instantly starts with no issues and will run as long as I feed it fuel. It should not be backfiring at all. Check dist. timing and plug wires, get fuel up to the pump before expecting it to feed itself. It's been pointed out to me the pump push rod could be worn down shorting the pumps stroke.    

[CharcoalCharger]

Sounds like a timing issue to me...or maybe the plug wires are mixed up. If it's backfiring, it must be getting fuel.

If the fuel pump is not working how did you get it to backfire? Did you dump some fuel in the carb?

Sorry, forgot to mention that.  We did put some fuel in the carb.  That fuel is what fires off.  We checked the timing and firing order.  The rotor spins clockwise, right?  We will check the timing and firing order again.  Those were the things I was suspecting because of the backfiring.  How would we go about getting fuel to the pump before expecting it to feed itself?  I will keep you guys posted as to what we find.  Thanks for the help.

[bobs66440]

  How would we go about getting fuel to the pump before expecting it to feed itself?  

Unless there's something I've been missing, I've never heard of having to prime a mechanical (or electric) fuel pump before. As far as I know, you just bolt it on, crank it and it pumps. I have heard on the Chryslers though, that the push rod length is critical and if it's worn a little it won't pump correctly.

[CharcoalCharger]

I've never heard about doing anything to the pump either. This is my first experience with big blocks and I see the fuel pumps are operated differently than small blocks.  The pump rod was installed when my buddy bought the engine, so it is another component we don't know the history of.  It may pay to install a new one.  Thanks for the info thus far, we'll have a few things to check tonight.

[b5blue]

  If you drop the line off the pumps input (The rubber hose off the fuel line.) and point it down fuel should siphon out of there readily as it's lower then the tank. No fuel rolling out means big air pocket, so apply suction till it runs out on its own.
  I JUST did this today and it worked. That meant bad pump. I put the new M4845 Carter fuel pump on and WAM! Lots of fuel flowing with the feed to carb open and running into a can. (I poured some gas in the carb then cranked it.)
  I let 2 gallons of gas flow out that line before attaching it to the new pump just to be sure the line was clear of any crap. (My car was sitting for 9-10 months.)  Add a hose to your carb feed and run it into a steel coffee can and you should see plenty of fuel flow if it's OK.   

[GPULLER]

Big block distributors rotate counter clockwise, small blocks turn clockwise.  Your dist cap might have an arrow showing rotation, that's fine if its on a small block.  Double check your firing order and it will start.

[Musicman]

Big block distributors rotate counter clockwise, double check your firing order.

Yeah.. what he said.

[CharcoalCharger]

Thanks GPuller.  I just got home and checked in one of my books.  I saw BB have a counterclockwise rotation  .  I jumped on here to let you guys know what I found and I see you guys probably found our mistake.  My buddy asked me yesterday if his wiring was right.  It was for a clockwise rotation.  He usually reads up on this stuff and I just figured he had it right .  I only ever worked on small blocks and clockwise is right for them.  Now I know.  I sent my buddy a text and he says he'll be home at 6, so I'll have to head down and see what's up.   

[CharcoalCharger]

Thank you everyone for your help on here.  We got the 440 running and it sounds SWEET  .  Turns out my buddy has one of those colored wiring diagrams.  One there is shows a dist and the small block rotation.  Below that in text it states big block counter clockwise.  When I sent my buddy a text about what I found in one of my books he initially said, 'that's not it'.  He showed me what he looked at (diagram) and did, and I showed him the way it is supposed to be.  It made sense to him then.  After a few dumps of fuel in the carb, she fired right up.  She sounds sweet and is about done being broken in.  This weekend we repaint the underside of the hood, bleed the brakes and she should be about ready for the road. Thanks again everyone!   

[bobs66440]

  Glad it worked out.

[b5blue]

Welcome to the road! 

[XS29L8]

Don't be too tough on him, I've done the same thing... 

[GPULLER]

Don't be too tough on him, I've done the same thing... 

Not being tough on him...that's how I found out that the rotation is counter clockwise. 

Glad it was simple and the car is running.