Re-body or not.....opinions?

[69bronzeT5]

Apparentley a LEGIT before and after. I can't help but think rebody though....





BEFORE:
http://mapleleafmopars.homestead.com/MofMnov2006.html

AFTER:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1970-Hemi-GTX-4-speed-RS23R0A172870-/190544732757?pt=US_Cars_Trucks&hash=item2c5d59e255

[Finn]

Wow...even I wouldn't tell someone that's fixable.

I'm thinking re-body.

[moparstuart]

 sure looks like a rebody if not they did a fantastic job

[daveco]

ahhh, that sort of body damage will usually just buff right out...

[Tilar]

I can't help but think rebody though....

Cody, I can't help but think you are right. 

[tan top]

I can't help but think rebody though....

Cody, I can't help but think you are right. 

yeah  , me too !!  or prolly more like another body with a few bits welded on from the original rotted wreck 

[miller]

How much of the original car needs to be there before you would consider it a re-body? For instance, my front end if off a 68 but my car is still considered a 69. Similarly, if someone switched the rear valance to a 68 the car would still be a 69. If someone swapped the front and the rear and the interior to make it a 68 clone, it would still be a 69. So If we went as far to say, they swapped everything but the original firewall with the original vin.... would it still be the original car?

[charge69]

I don't know how much of the car is there but I would not be surprised if the car is my definition of a rebody, that is switching  the fender tag, original numbers on various body panels and dash (with original matching vin) to a different donor car. YMMV

[miller]

Kind of on the same lines, would you consider this Production Subaru STI the same car as the race car that came out of the shop?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8irtop-4dbo

Same this the Audi A5 Dragster.

http://jalopnik.com/5809868/watch-an-audi-a5-transformed-into-a-drag-car/gallery/

[Cooter]

It all hinges on what someone considers a "Re-body"...

If an original car has Everything but the VIN tag and a cluster replaced with Brand new replacement panels, is it still the original car? Or Re-body?


Just because someone repaired the original with brand new metal, and someone else just found a complete car and swapped in all the drivetrain parts, is one a rebody and the other not?

[Ghoste]

So some of you think the car in the first pic only had a few panels replaced to get it to the condition in the 2nd?

[The70RT]

Rear section looks gone, If this was how it looked when they stared the new car is missing the rear vin #

[gtx6970]

different people define re-body differently.

I wouldn't pass judgement based on pictures found on the net in most cases.




BUT, based on what I know and see, it's rebody, they just did it the hard way

[69 OUR/TEA]

I gotta say it like this,I still don't like this car,no matter how nice it is right now,it still was "THAT" before.To me,I just feel alittle better inside knowing my car might have just had a few patches or panel replacement,not a structure  basketcase like that.

[vancamp]

i would say it is a definite re body even the firewall on the passenger side is gone someone swapped numbers to a different body.

[Rolling_Thunder]

honestly - it is so hard to say now-a-days with all the reproduction parts...       look at houses...    tear down and build an entire house leaving only one single load bearing wall...   you simple "remodeled"  = you didn't build a new house...           

I agree if they simply moved the VIN and fender tag over that's wrong...    but I've seen cars get new floors, exterior panels, firewall, inner fenders, frame rails, and every other thing...     so where does one draw the line ?

[Mike DC]

  
I literally don't see anything usable on that red GTX's unibody except maybe the right side doorjamb.  

The roof structure, the front cowl, the firewall, the A-pillars, the entire undercarriage from the firewall back . . . it's ALL unusable.  There's not enough inner structure left to hang the AMD sheetmetal onto.  
 


Bottom line, the original car is gone.  Even if it's not technically a rebody then I still wouldn't wanna buy it just for structural reasons. 

[The70RT]

Notice on the resto pics that they have the structural part mostly done and you don't see the beginning. Obviously there was nothing to start with.

[bill440rt]

Fender tag pic sure looks like a repop to me...  just sayin'. 

[Magnumcharger]

As this car was restored by Alan Gallant, who employs an awesome metal worker at Watertown Collision (also responsible for the "Barrell-Cuda" of note), I'm really not surprised to see that this car was resurrected.

http://www.alangallantautomotiverestoration.com/DES-S-GTX.html

For anybody who has done restorative surgery on an old Mopar, I'm sure you're well aware that these cars were never designed or built to last for any length of time.
Other than a very few well sheltered examples, most of our beloved Mopar muscle machines are rebuilt to varying degrees.
The simple fact is - they all will eventually succumb to time and the environments.

If you've followed the thread on the XP Hemi Charger, I'm sure the drill looks very similar.
Also, this month's Mopar action has a great article on the purple 1971 Hemi Cuda convertible restoration (Harold Sullivan) that follows a very similar story line.

As far as restoration goes, we could all stand on our soapboxes and shout "FOUL". But you must realize these are massed produced items, made by the thousands, and there is very little that actually differentiates one from another.

So, what's better?
Destroying the heritage of the vehicle so that others will increase in value? Or preserving the heritage by restoring even those cars that appear beyond hope?

If you hadn't seen any of the history of this car, I highly doubt that most of you on this site could tell that the end product was anything other than what it is now.
My 

[Old Moparz]

If a tree falls in the forest & there is nobody there to hear it, does it still make a sound?  

If a rotbox hemi & a nice 318 car are in a garage together & the hemi emerges a show car while the 318 disappears & nobody was there to see the restoration, were the VIN tags swapped?  

That car looks great, but I would never consider restoring something that far gone. I'm almost glad I don't have the money for a nice Hemi car, & have to worry about whether it's legit.  

[tan top]

http://www.alangallantautomotiverestoration.com/DES-S-GTX.html

they do some awesome work  by the looks of it  

wonder if all 70 B-Body floors are the same  as charger !!  i'm saying this because i thought read somewhere ! might of even been on here !!  the 70s  had an extra hole in the floor each side ! that would of been under the seat front seat / buckets , although if changed whole floor with a repoped part ??   but looks like an OEM floor to me 

[moparstuart]

Notice on the resto pics that they have the structural part mostly done and you don't see the beginning. Obviously there was nothing to start with.

  thats the key none of the important early restoration photos are there so you have to conclude its a re-body .   

[Chris G.]

When you cut out VIN #'s from a trunk rail support and rad rail support, and add them to whatever, you are doing it for a reason. 

[Drache]

http://www.alangallantautomotiverestoration.com/DES-S-GTX.html

Looking at that page though THIS stands out to me:

"It came to me with the metal work complete"

So it sounds like when Alan got the GTX to restore it, all the metal work was already done.