Bin Laden Wont be down for breakfast

[freddyd02]

BREAKING NEWS!!:: Chuck Norris just returned from Pakistan  

[oldgold69]

 im not

[TK73]

im not

That's cool... 46% of American voters agreed with ya last time.   

[Drache]

The guy was 54 years old and was on dialysis... couple more years and he might have just croaked on his own... better late than never eh? 

[bull]

congrat to the us military  job well done             this should get obama reelected

Counting on it...

I wouldn't. A lot can happen in a year and a half.

Anyway, will this help Wafah's career? http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4555430.stm

[bull]

 
   
Maybe they told the ship's crew and press that they threw his body overboard but I would be surprised if they really did.  

Even if there's no intention of ever publicly desecrating the body, I can still think of some scientific and practical reasons for them not to get rid of it just yet.  

Well, they could have met up with a US submarine out there somewhere. I was kind of hoping they'd take him to a taxidermist and have him stuffed.

[Arthu®]

I'm glad we handled it the way we did.  respecting the muslim religion is an act that shows we are not savages like them.

Everyone is entitled in full equality to a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal, in the determination of his rights and obligations and of any criminal charge against him.

A U.S. national security official told Reuters that the mission was to kill Osama Bin Laden, thereby violating, among other, the right to a fair trial. If 'we' really are not savages why not try to take him alive and try him.

Arthur

PS it is not that I think it is a bad thing that he is gone, because no doubt he was an evil person. Just pointing out we are not as civilized as we say we are.

[Tilar]

im not

That's cool... 46% of American voters agreed with ya last time.   

Yeah but a poll said that 50% of the ones that voted for him agree with us now, that came right off CNN. 

[Tilar]

I'm glad we handled it the way we did.  respecting the muslim religion is an act that shows we are not savages like them.

Everyone is entitled in full equality to a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal, in the determination of his rights and obligations and of any criminal charge against him.

A U.S. national security official told Reuters that the mission was to kill Osama Bin Laden, thereby violating, among other, the right to a fair trial. If 'we' really are not savages why not try to take him alive and try him.

Arthur

PS it is not that I think it is a bad thing that he is gone, because no doubt he was an evil person. Just pointing out we are not as civilized as we say we are.

Oh he was found guilty as charged by the families of 2,752 people that died on 9/11. He only had to wait 10 years for the punishment phase to be carried out. 

[Arthu®]

Oh he was found guilty as charged by the families of 2,752 people that died on 9/11. He only had to wait 10 years for the punishment phase to be carried out. 

Exactly my point, very independent and impartial indeed...

[Ghoste]

He didn't mug someone in Central Park, he declared war on an entire nation and attacked accordingly.  Unfortunately that nation didn't surrender.

[Landonsrt]

Oh he was found guilty as charged by the families of 2,752 people that died on 9/11. He only had to wait 10 years for the punishment phase to be carried out. 

Exactly my point, very independent and impartial indeed...

Compared to most time convicted felons spend on death row here in the us, thats not bad... Sooner wouldve been better though.

[elacruze]

I'm glad we handled it the way we did.  respecting the muslim religion is an act that shows we are not savages like them.

Everyone is entitled in full equality to a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal, in the determination of his rights and obligations and of any criminal charge against him.

A U.S. national security official told Reuters that the mission was to kill Osama Bin Laden, thereby violating, among other, the right to a fair trial. If 'we' really are not savages why not try to take him alive and try him.

Arthur

PS it is not that I think it is a bad thing that he is gone, because no doubt he was an evil person. Just pointing out we are not as civilized as we say we are.

Enemy Combatants are not entitled to any trial at all.

[Patronus]

"double-tap" - its the only way to clear an objective - "legally"

[Mike DC]

A U.S. national security official told Reuters that the mission was to kill Osama Bin Laden, thereby violating, among other, the right to a fair trial. If 'we' really are not savages why not try to take him alive and try him.

Maybe he'd be suitable for a trial for war crimes through NATO or something in theory.  But realistically, we're talking about someone who wouldn't even see his own actions as criminal according to his culture's logic.  IMHO Geneva Convention thinking is more suitable for people from similar cultural backgrounds to our own, where one culture's idea of a crime against humanity is not another culture's idea of civic virtue.  (Would his own people have respected our gesture of trying him in court as anything more respectful than just killing him in battle?  I'm not so sure.)  

I'm not saying we SHOULDN'T have been willing to try him in court in theory. I'm just pointing out that it wouldn't be quite the same situation as something like the Nuremburg Trials.  



As a practical matter I don't know if we could have taken the guy alive very easily.  They say his crew had orders to kill him rather than see him taken alive, and at that stage in his health I don't doubt that they would have followed through on it.  Saddam Hussein didn't follow through on that idea but he was a much different animal than UBL in a lot of ways.  

We also could have just bombed the whole house off the map instead of going in there for a hand-to-hand firefight.  This way we risked spilling our own blood in the shootout (and risked getting shot down on our way in & out of Pakistan) to do this face-to-face.   And this way his death has been confirmed.

[Tilar]

I'm still trying to figure out how he would even get as was mentioned, "the right to a fair trial." That is a right granted through our constitution to our citizens, and since he is not a citizen of the USA he should not be extended that right.

[Lennard]

I'm glad we handled it the way we did.  respecting the muslim religion is an act that shows we are not savages like them.

Everyone is entitled in full equality to a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal, in the determination of his rights and obligations and of any criminal charge against him.

A U.S. national security official told Reuters that the mission was to kill Osama Bin Laden, thereby violating, among other, the right to a fair trial. If 'we' really are not savages why not try to take him alive and try him.

Arthur

I wonder that if one of your loved ones would have been killed by one of his attacks, if you would still feel this way.
I doubt it...

My personal opinion: an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth!

[Mike DC]

  
The "right to a fair trial" might be a phrase technically lifted from the US Constitution but the principle is much bigger than the USA.  The principle is generally agreed upon in most of the first-world nations, even for criminals that are blatantly guilty of awful things.  

UBL didn't deserve that chance, we certainly didn't owe him that chance .  .  .  but our nation's moral principles would favor giving him a fair trial anyway.  When it's feasible.    

[Arthu®]

@Tilar: Look at the phrase I quoted it's article 10 from the Universal Declaration of Human Rights also signed by the United States of America. There is a law amongst nations. EDIT: Mike DC already explained it much better than I did.

@elacruze: I doubt you are right about that, there is an International Criminal Court who among others have tried former generals from Yugoslavia (although the signature of the U.S. still needs to be ratified). Even if it were so that enemy combatants do not have this right, I doubt that military law is applicable here. Terrorists are not an army (although they have the same characteristics) and as far as I know all the terrorists (i.e. Timothy McVeigh) so far have been tried in civil courts.

@lennard: no doubt I would be far more pissed and might even want him dead, but that is completely irrelevant to the discussion. I doubt all the people on here that expressed their opinion had a family member killed. Also the eye for an eye mentality is something I associate with preschool and not something that is rational and belongs in international politics.

@Mike DC: I agree with you for the most part. It would be very difficult to try him and he might as well not believe he did anything wrong. Which is completely irrelevant because any international court will convict him based on the evidence. The option that was chosen was by far the most practical one and it might even be so that I would have made the same one if given the options. However as a country you should not state that it was the intention to kill him. You have to say he resisted arrest and that you had to shoot him, nobody who is going to contradict it as everybody who would want that is dead as far as I know. The Obama administration has been, up to this point, far better in international politics and I just don't understand the reasoning. It must have been domestic popularity. When you look at international law there are just so many aspects screwed up, while you would think that if you would want to hit someone as important as him you would want it to be done clean. As far as I know the Pakistani were not informed of the mission and it was an action against civilians, it could have been seen as an act of war...

That's all I wanted to say, I have no sympathy for the guy whatsoever.

Arthur

[twodko]

Navy Seals........when it absolutely, positively has to be killed overnight!

I'm pleased Osama is dead, he had it coming. Too bad it cost trillions of dollars and many boots on the ground to do it.
On another note, I was disgusted to see Americans dancing in the streets celebrating the lowlife's death. In doing so we lowered ourselves to the same level when many hardcore Islamic scum celebrated when we were hit on 9/11.

[Richard Cranium]

Here's an animated video of Bin Laden's last moments....

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=173_1304363717

It doesn't take long! 

[nh_mopar_fan]

 

[Drache]

Ok one thing everyone has to agree with me on....

Those SEALs will never EVER have to buy another round of drinks! 

[Mike DC]

When you look at international law there are just so many aspects screwed up, while you would think that if you would want to hit someone as important as him you would want it to be done clean. As far as I know the Pakistani were not informed of the mission and it was an action against civilians, it could have been seen as an act of war...

If the Pakistanis had been warned we were coming then UBL would probably not have been there when we arrived.  

IMHO it's hard to draw any other conclusion from this incident.   Obama is extremely sensitive about how imperialistic he appears on the international stage compared to Bush#43.  That, coupled with the circumstances & location that UBL was living in, Pakistan's history on the matter, etc.   

[Lennard]

@lennard: no doubt I would be far more pissed and might even want him dead, but that is completely irrelevant to the discussion. I doubt all the people on here that expressed their opinion had a family member killed. Also the eye for an eye mentality is something I associate with preschool and not something that is rational and belongs in international politics.
Arthur

They killed 343 of my brothers. Although I didn't knew them personally, I always thought... that could have been me and in the future it can be me. And mentality wise I guess I'm stuck in preschool, I love justice being served.