4-Speed Manual Transmission A833;18 spline

[efruiz21]

Hi Everyone... I'm a new member to the Mopar Family.  I just purchased a 1968 Charger R/T(project car).  My car, originally came with a 4-speed manual transmission(A833;18 spline), but unfortunately when I purchased the car, it didn't have a transmission.  I would like to restore the car close to the original specification. 

Before I purchase a transmission, I would like to do my homework.  Can someone please suggest some good reading material or some mopars books.  I want to know what casting numbers, serial numbers or codes on the transmission to look for. 

1.) Are A833;18 spline: 4-Speed manual transmissions hard to find?
2.) Does each cars' transmission matches its' serial number or not?
3.) Are the(A833) casting numbers, serial numbers or codes different from year to year? 

Any advise, suggestions, or information will be greatly appreciated... -efruiz21

[Dans 68]

Welcome to the board. And a '68 R/T is a nice introduction to have.

First, post pics if you can. We are visual creatures. And to answer your questions:

1.  No, they are not hard to find, but trying to find your original will be near impossible, but easier to find one that is close to your build date. Is your engine stamped with the vin? Go to this thread http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,38316.0.html to understand where to find it. Not all were stamped, especially the early builds in '67.

2.  See answer 1. If there was a stamp on the raised pad on the transmission it will match if it is original. Again, some of the early '68's did not get stamped.

3.  I believe that the casting numbers were the same, the serial numbers different (of course) and the codes I don't know. Read this http://www.slantsix.org/articles/4-speeds/ODA833fourspeed1.htm to get a history of the A833's.

Read all the pertinent threads here you can. You have reached the best place on the net for 2nd Gen Chargers (and probably 1st, 3rd, and on and on...).  

Dan

[six-tee-nine]

Not to beat your knowledge, but are you sure it cale withe the 18 spline unit?

IIRC the 18 spline was a Hemi thing only and everthing else came with a 23 spline box. Its just what you want....... Because 23 spine units are slightly more available and mostly alot cheaper to purchase

[Troy]

Not to beat your knowledge, but are you sure it cale withe the 18 spline unit?

IIRC the 18 spline was a Hemi thing only and everthing else came with a 23 spline box. Its just what you want....... Because 23 spine units are slightly more available and mostly alot cheaper to purchase

Common misconception. The 18-spline 4-speed is generally referred to as a "Hemi" box but it came behind every 440 and 426. Any original R/T with a 4-speed would have had one. The 23-spline would have been found behind 383s and any small blocks. The primary difference is in the amount of torque the input shaft can handle so the jump from a 383 to a 440 was enough to justify the beefier transmission.

Troy

[pipeliner]

Troy is right but you are about to embark in an adventure you will not like.People want a small fortune for these 18 spline transmissions.Do you have a bell housing,fly wheel,clutch kit,hurst shifter,shift rods,does it need rebuilt,etc,etc..?Im no trans. expert but I myself will be doing alot of driving and im going to buy a new 5-speed,food for thought.

[six-tee-nine]

Whoops   

Thanks for the input, I really did'nt knew that.........

@ pipeliner  :

Damn right, I paid $800 for my 18 spline unit with the correct single shifter mount tailshaft for '69 2 years ago and another $ 300 for a matching 11" bellhousing.
No shifter rods and no shifter unit included.

[Cooter]

There's no need for the 18 spline unit, as I have been beating on a 23 spline unit with about a 600 HP 440 for years...Never had a problem..

[Troy]

Troy is right but you are about to embark in an adventure you will not like.People want a small fortune for these 18 spline transmissions.Do you have a bell housing,fly wheel,clutch kit,hurst shifter,shift rods,does it need rebuilt,etc,etc..?Im no trans. expert but I myself will be doing alot of driving and im going to buy a new 5-speed,food for thought.

I would almost agree BUT... it's a real R/T 4-speed which makes it fairly rare. I tend to not chop holes in rare cars. Last I checked there were around 2,500 68 Charger R/Ts produced with a 4-speed.

Honestly, if a car is missing absolutely everything (and nothing in the original post makes me believe that's the case) it costs almost as much to install a 23-spline. You can buy a completely rebuilt 18-spline trans from Passon or Brewer's for $2,000 (used to be $1,750) or a 23-spline for about $1,100. Of course, I paid just over $1,000 for the last rebuilt 18-spline that I bought so patience and a sharp eye can result in some good deals. You can find core 18-spline boxes for $700-800 and core 23-splines for $200-300. Brewer's (for example) will rebuild either for $350 plus parts. So that makes a net difference of $500-900 in the trans - which isn't a huge percentage when a complete conversion runs $4,500+.

Back to the original post...
I don't think the 18-spline is incredibly hard to find. I would definitely spend the time, effort, and money to get one for your particular car. Finding one with the car's VIN will be nearly impossible. Finding one with a "correct" date code might not even be that easy. Remember, the 727 automatic was such a strong performer that the number of 4-speeds produced was pretty small in comparison. Plus, everything but a performance model (440 or 426 Hemi) got the 23-spline so the 18-spline was produced in smaller numbers simply due to the demand (although, there were more Charger R/T 4-speeds in 1968 than all the others combined - but the Road Runner and Super Bee certainly padded the stats for the 23-spline). There's a flat pad on the side of the transmission with several stamped numbers which will give the application and assembly dates.

There aren't any physical differences between the different years that would make one worse than another. The big exception would be 1970 and later tail housings which will have two shifter mounting pads and are noticeably different than the 68-69 versions. They'll still fit and work the same and can be swapped out for the correct version fairly easily.

In 1968 the car would have had an 11" iron bell housing with a 143 tooth flywheel (and clutch/pressure plate/throw out bearing assembly to match). The casting number on the bell should be 2892262 but the 1969 version - 2892626 - is identical and works fine. There's a specific z-bar and clutch fork for this size bell housing so make sure all the components match.

Troy

[Rolling_Thunder]

A buddy of mine wants me to buy an 18 spline off of him for $200.00...     but it chunked teeth off the countershaft gear and the input - its about $550 in parts right there...    but I can rebuild it myself and have all the other parts already to rebuild it...     any opinions ?

[Dans 68]

A buddy of mine wants me to buy an 18 spline off of him for $200.00...     but it chunked teeth off the countershaft gear and the input - its about $550 in parts right there...    but I can rebuild it myself and have all the other parts already to rebuild it...     any opinions ?

I'd buy it. 

Dan

[pipeliner]

No cutting holes in a rare car for this baby!
http://www.passonperformance.com/images/stories/passon_documents/Passon_5-Speed_Flyer_2010-11-18.pdf

[Cooter]

No cutting holes in a rare car for this baby!
http://www.passonperformance.com/images/stories/passon_documents/Passon_5-Speed_Flyer_2010-11-18.pdf

You got the $4300.00 they want for that thing? I can buy at least 3 18 spline A833's for what they want for ONE of those things..

[pipeliner]

You want play you got to pay.I cant understand why some people will throw anywhere from $5k-$10k into a motor but gripe about throwing $4300 into a tranny..This tranny is the best thing since bologna was first introduced.No I cant afford it either but Im throwing $35k in my car so what the hell is another $5k.

[Troy]

Passon also makes an 18-spline overdrive gear set that will fit in any case (including a 23-spline) for about half that. If you have to replace a bunch of gears and/or synchronizers in the original then it isn't much more expensive. It looks like mine is going to run around $700 for the rebuild so if I had a few more broken parts it would be tempting. My 4-speed R/T has a Dana with 3.54 gears so it shouldn't be terrible on the highway. If I had 4.10s though I'd definitely be looking into an overdrive trans (one that looks stock of course!).

Troy

[oldschool]

You want play you got to pay.I cant understand why some people will throw anywhere from $5k-$10k into a motor but gripe about throwing $4300 into a tranny..This tranny is the best thing since bologna was first introduced.No I cant afford it either but Im throwing $35k in my car so what the hell is another $5k.

i'l be buying 4 of them. the OD troy is talking about, is really a 3 speed w/ OD. also the gear spread is very wide....

[Troy]

You want play you got to pay.I cant understand why some people will throw anywhere from $5k-$10k into a motor but gripe about throwing $4300 into a tranny..This tranny is the best thing since bologna was first introduced.No I cant afford it either but Im throwing $35k in my car so what the hell is another $5k.

i'l be buying 4 of them. the OD troy is talking about, is really a 3 speed w/ OD. also the gear spread is very wide....

But everyone is building torque motors these days (especially strokers) so who cares about gear spread? Heck, it seems like half the guys out there are above 500 ft/lbs from 2,000-5,500 rpm.

Troy

[oldschool]

You want play you got to pay.I cant understand why some people will throw anywhere from $5k-$10k into a motor but gripe about throwing $4300 into a tranny..This tranny is the best thing since bologna was first introduced.No I cant afford it either but Im throwing $35k in my car so what the hell is another $5k.

i'l be buying 4 of them. the OD troy is talking about, is really a 3 speed w/ OD. also the gear spread is very wide....

But everyone is building torque motors these days (especially strokers) so who cares about gear spread? Heck, it seems like half the guys out there are above 500 ft/lbs from 2,000-5,500 rpm.

Troy

my 580" motor in my charger , made 756 ftlbs of torque. it has a 4.10 in it also. i would still rather have a close ratio trans. it,s all about minimizing the rpm drop......

[Dans 68]

...The 23-spline would have been found behind 383s and any small blocks....

Troy

I thought that, in 2nd Gen Charger cases, only the 383 4-bbl (and 2-bbl in '68) was allowed the 23 spline 4-speed option. The 318's did not get a manual option, while the 225's could get a 3-speed manual transmission (interestingly, and as an aside, the '70 383 4-bbl was given the 3-speed manual floor shift option).  What am I missing?

Dan

[ITSA426]

I've got a Passon overdrive four speed behind my 440 and I think it's a good fit.  With the 3.54 Dana I was getting 10.8 mpg.  I haven't checked the mileage on the new tranny but the RPMs are definitely lower and it cruises nicer.  Jamie's five speed wasn't available when I got the four speed. 

On the other hand you can buy a lot of gas for what it costs, but I do like the easy swap installation, among other things.

[Troy]

...The 23-spline would have been found behind 383s and any small blocks....

Troy

I thought that, in 2nd Gen Charger cases, only the 383 4-bbl (and 2-bbl in '68) was allowed the 23 spline 4-speed option. The 318's did not get a manual option, while the 225's could get a 3-speed manual transmission (interestingly, and as an aside, the '70 383 4-bbl was given the 3-speed manual floor shift option).  What am I missing?

Dan

I was being purposely generic in that post (and was answering an equally generic post) about the availability of the 23-spline. The (non-OD) 23 spline was available for what, 11 years behind all sorts of engines (including small blocks in A-bodies and E-bodies). To be specific to this particular thread (and your question), the Charger in 1968 (and 69-70?) wasn't available with a small block (or slant six) 4-speed combination.

Troy

[Cooter]

You want play you got to pay. I cant understand why some people will throw anywhere from $5k-$10k into a motor but gripe about throwing $4300 into a tranny..This tranny is the best thing since bologna was first introduced.No I cant afford it either but Im throwing $35k in my car so what the hell is another $5k.

First of all, I don't "Throw" anywhere NEAR $10K in ANY of my engines...Trans', OR rear diffs...Subsequently, there's no way I could sleep at night knowing I can now cruise at 500-800 RPM lower for $4300.00...........I don't have THAT much "Thrown" at my 505 C.I. stroker I built 15 years ago....I just simply drive slower...(60 MPH, instead of say 80 MPH)...Sure, there are some here that can afford to spend money like it's rain water and that's fine for them, but for the rest of the under $50K/year croud, this thing is way out of sight....I don't have $35K in all three of my cars added together....

[Troy]

I absolutely cannot drive at 60 or below. It doesn't matter if it's a new car or old to me - it's just not enjoyable to be a road block. I generally cringe when I see someone in an old car in the right lane doing 50-55 with the engine screaming (or not). When I had the 3.91s in the Challenger last year I got passed by a Smart Car on the way to the Mopar Nationals and that was the absolute last straw for me. Those gears were out and gone ASAP! Of course, since I just did a gear swap I didn't spend a boat load of money on a trans - but it sure would have been nice to have the best of both worlds (stoplight performance of the 3.91s with the highway performance of OD). No aftermarket transmission is meant for everyone and, luckily, none are a requirement. People are free to spend whatever they like on their cars.

Troy

[oldschool]

passed by a smart car, ouch . i feel your pain too troy. my 4.10 on the highway  . i will be getting OD for all of my cars. it's alot cheeper in the long run than $ 10.00 gal race gas, and $$$$$$ engine rebuilds....

[oldcarnut]

I just let my 23 spline needing taking apart and cleaning go for $28.  Was on its way to the scrap metal yard cause nobody acted interested in it so keep your eye for them out there.

[Dans 68]

The 18-spline A833's are out there. Here is one local to me, as an example. http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/pts/2263022713.html

Dan