Don't touch my junk.

[Ghoste]

They're supposed to keep the bad guys off the planes.  So everyone who is so opposed to this horrible inconvenience, how about suggesting some alternatives?

[bull]

They're supposed to keep the bad guys off the planes.  So everyone who is so opposed to this horrible inconvenience, how about suggesting some alternatives?

Hassle the people who look and act like bad guys and leave the law abiding citizens alone. It's kind of the same mentality they now use with gun purchases here in Oregon. I, for example, have a proven history of being responsible with a firearm so if/when I go to the store to buy a gun they run my ID through the state with a phone call and decide then if I can own one. If my ID comes up clean I get a gun. If it comes up dirty the cops are at the store before the clerk hangs up the phone.

I thought passports and all this ID theft BS were supposed to solve this problem? We jumped through a bunch of hoops and paid all this money to prove who we are and that we're not a threat to national security and yet some jackwagon still wants to stick his hand down our pants? No thanks.

BTW, all TSA employees should be attractive women. I don't know anyone that has a problem being handled by an attractive woman. Women even prefer it.

[Ghoste]

That would mean profiling and we all know how the pc left feel about that.

[bull]

That would mean profiling and we all know how the pc left feel about that.

Yes, profiling. Either way someone's going to cry but fewer people would be crying if they profiled. You either have to mess with a few people or you have to mess with everyone. I say the fewer the better.

[TK73]

That would mean profiling and we all know how the pc left feel about that.

Yes, profiling. Either way someone's going to cry but fewer people would be crying if they profiled. You either have to mess with a few people or you have to mess with everyone. I say the fewer the better.

Bull can probably attest to the fact that I might be considered "Liberal".

PROFILE, PROFILE, PROFILE.   F the pc crap.

[TK73]

You're right, letting me choose between strangers examining my naked body and strangers groping me makes it all OK.  Especially since it's all in the name of safety!  And of course recording is an arrestable offense - No way should any authority figure have to worry about accountability to the citizenry!  I mean, questioning authority is the gateway drug to terrorism, right?  Don't forget the hallmark of our beloved government: If we have nothing to hide, then we shouldn't be upset!

DEAD ON!!

Defiance for TSA boss!!

[bull]

That would mean profiling and we all know how the pc left feel about that.

Yes, profiling. Either way someone's going to cry but fewer people would be crying if they profiled. You either have to mess with a few people or you have to mess with everyone. I say the fewer the better.

Bull can probably attest to the fact that I might be considered "Liberal".

PROFILE, PROFILE, PROFILE.   F the pc crap.

Well now. TK and I agree on a social issue. Somebody write this down in stone please.

[TeeWJay426]

They're supposed to keep the bad guys off the planes.  So everyone who is so opposed to this horrible inconvenience, how about suggesting some alternatives?

Here's an alternative.... make sure that everyone who refuses the pat down has to fly on the same plane as everyone else who refused the pat down, with the knowledge that everyone on that plane refused it as well, and let them all know that the plane will be flown remotely, since there won't be a pilot who would be willing to fly it for them...

[TK73]

That would mean profiling and we all know how the pc left feel about that.

Yes, profiling. Either way someone's going to cry but fewer people would be crying if they profiled. You either have to mess with a few people or you have to mess with everyone. I say the fewer the better.

Bull can probably attest to the fact that I might be considered "Liberal".

PROFILE, PROFILE, PROFILE.   F the pc crap.

Well now. TK and I agree on a social issue. Somebody write this down in stone please.

We seem to have agreed on the immigration issue too.  Somebody send more barbed wire to Texas.

[flyinlow]

BTW, all TSA employees should be attractive women. I don't know anyone that has a problem being handled by an attractive woman. Women even prefer it.

Best idea yet 

[bull]

That would mean profiling and we all know how the pc left feel about that.

Yes, profiling. Either way someone's going to cry but fewer people would be crying if they profiled. You either have to mess with a few people or you have to mess with everyone. I say the fewer the better.

Bull can probably attest to the fact that I might be considered "Liberal".

PROFILE, PROFILE, PROFILE.   F the pc crap.

Well now. TK and I agree on a social issue. Somebody write this down in stone please.

We seem to have agreed on the immigration issue too.  Somebody send more barbed wire to Texas.

I was thinking concrete walls and giant machine guns but I think we're on the same page.

[flyinlow]

For your consideration,

Airline service : After 26 years with three airlines . We deliver exactly the level of service that our average customer is willing to pay for. My boss , Marketing , will listen to what ever your wallet says.

Airline security:  How much is enough?  When the Airlines and the Government look at safety improvement they always do a cost justification analysis.
For this they have to put a dollar value on human lives saved . Ranges of 1.5-2 million per person are reported to be used. Lets do some math.

On 9-11 just under 3000 people where murdered.  3000 X 2million = 6 billion . Add in 4 used  767/757 for about 200 million.  Total so far 6.2 billion. I don't really know what a used World trade center was worth. For discussion I will bring the total to 10 billion.

The TSA budget for 2010 was 7.8 billion. Going back to 2001 that would be over 60 billion.  Was that money well spent? If we could go back to that days when our Chargers where new and just walk into the airport and board the Jet ,saving 7.8 billion a year, would you be willing to lose say five airliners full of people per year?

[flyinlow]

sorry having laptop problems,

As an Airline Pilot I have many concerns in my job ,safety is at the top of the list. I do think EFFECTIVE security is a modern day necessity.
Good intel, profilling, and resonable screening are all layers of this. These are all defensive measures. I would like to add one more layer, an offensive one.
When I discused dollar values earlier ,those where for safety improvement from accidents. The 2977 victims of 9-11 where murdered, which brings me to the last part of my discussion. Retribution. When you do something like this the payback should be so severe that no one will try it again.

These are my personal opinions and observations.

[Road Dog]

We need to do the screenings/ profiling just as Israel has done for 3 decades or more. An Israeli Airline would be tops on any terrorist list too.I wouldn't have problems with even showing up butt naked on a plane if i thought it would be safer. It's only feel good folks..........TSA Theater.  Here about the 16 year old they found on the street in Boston. They think he is a run away teen that snuck out on the tarmac in Charlotte Airport and got in the wheel well of a Commercial Airliner. When the landing gear was lowered going into Boston the body fell out.
He was able to get there folks...........now thiink what a trained terrorist can do. Just say'n.

[bakerhillpins]

They're supposed to keep the bad guys off the planes.  So everyone who is so opposed to this horrible inconvenience, how about suggesting some alternatives?

Whether or not they can keep bad things off the planes is debatable and it's something more complex than just providing good theater with hyper checking passengers. I am not so much looking for an alternative but there needs to be some sort of way that we the molested can check their power. Right now they are an uncontested authority all in the name of safety.    Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

You're right, letting me choose between strangers examining my naked body and strangers groping me makes it all OK.  Especially since it's all in the name of safety!  And of course recording is an arrestable offense - No way should any authority figure have to worry about accountability to the citizenry!  I mean, questioning authority is the gateway drug to terrorism, right?  Don't forget the hallmark of our beloved government: If we have nothing to hide, then we shouldn't be upset!

DEAD ON!!

Defiance for TSA boss!!

[Domino]

old guy in front of me got scanned, then molested too because he left his paper boarding pass in his back pocket.  The TSA molester was teaching him a lesson like you'd talk to a 5 year old.  "We said take EVERYTHING out of your pockets, if you do that next time you won't get a pat down"

What's that got to do with anything other than stroking their authority boner?

[Ghoste]

Obviously a polarizing issue.  If it's any comfort to those who feel the TSA is a monster unchecked, a recent poll among terrorists finds them in 100% agreement with you.

[tricky lugnuts]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hq8pd0fDNaA

Classic Carlin!



Also, anybody seen the new fig leaf underwear?

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-20023616-1.html

[bakerhillpins]

Obviously a polarizing issue.  If it's any comfort to those who feel the TSA is a monster unchecked, a recent poll among terrorists finds them in 100% agreement with you.

Yes it is.

Wow, excellent debate! Elementary school tactics work so well with terrorists too. 

[bakerhillpins]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hq8pd0fDNaA

Classic Carlin!

Great commentary!       RIP George! 

[Ghoste]

Obviously a polarizing issue.  If it's any comfort to those who feel the TSA is a monster unchecked, a recent poll among terrorists finds them in 100% agreement with you.

Yes it is.

Wow, excellent debate! Elementary school tactics work so well with terrorists too.  

It was meant to be elementary.  No points for picking up on it though.
Here's the thing; I read how everyone is so pissed that the TSA would dare invade their privacy by touching them (not to mention the implication through the act that the touchee might be a security threat ) and the only alternative that has been suggested is to take anyone who looks Muslim out of the line and only put them through the wringer.  While I agree with profiling, the chances of it becoming written policy in "The Great Melting Pot" are pretty much nil.  So what else?
Not to mention that in all of this uproar, I can't help but wonder how many of the people who are upset by it have flown since the policy came into effect?  How about in the last month?  Last year?  Ever?  Some yes, perhaps even everyone on this forum who has found it to be such an abominable attack on their rights.  So far the ones who have spoken firsthand about the TSA experience have been a pilot, a TSA officer and two passengers.  Of the two flyers, one witnessed an incident that does indeed sound over the line.  The other (me) hasn't seen anything like that yet.  I fly commercially between two and eight times a month from a variety of airports and the TSA have always been great to deal with.  Yes, there are times I have seen them get high on themselves and there are many more times where I have seen them becoming exasperated with people.  It seems like no matter how far ahead they go in the line to explain to people what they need to do when they reach the inspection point, people still become deer in the headlights when they get to the belt and scanner.  Do they deserve to be treated like crap?  Absolutely not.  But have you ever become impatient with someone after having to explain the same simple routine to them over and over and over and over and over?
You can call it theater if you wish but the US was noted worldwide for having some of the worst airport security measures bar none prior to the mass murder committed against civilians just going into their cublicles to do their little jobs on 9/11.  The airport bs has gotten worse since then but I personally haven't found it to be objectionable in the grans scheme of things.  Obviously I am in the minority on this as far as opinion but I do still wonder if I am in the minority as far as actually experiencing and/or witnessing it?  Maybe I am or maybe I'm not, I really don't know.

I will say this, from what I see in airports, if you really want to get all hot and bothered about something, get excited and angry about this; the US armed forces personnel do a great deal of their moving about the country on commercial flights.  I watch those guys in their uniforms and carrying their gear wait in the same lines as I do and get submitted to the same inspections as me.  As far as I'm concerned they should be getting better VIP treatment than Obama.  At the very least they should get to use the first class lines.

[4cruzin]

 

[Vainglory, Esq.]

For your consideration,

Airline service : After 26 years with three airlines . We deliver exactly the level of service that our average customer is willing to pay for. My boss , Marketing , will listen to what ever your wallet says.

Airline security:  How much is enough?  When the Airlines and the Government look at safety improvement they always do a cost justification analysis.
For this they have to put a dollar value on human lives saved . Ranges of 1.5-2 million per person are reported to be used. Lets do some math.

On 9-11 just under 3000 people where murdered.  3000 X 2million = 6 billion . Add in 4 used  767/757 for about 200 million.  Total so far 6.2 billion. I don't really know what a used World trade center was worth. For discussion I will bring the total to 10 billion.

The TSA budget for 2010 was 7.8 billion. Going back to 2001 that would be over 60 billion.  Was that money well spent? If we could go back to that days when our Chargers where new and just walk into the airport and board the Jet ,saving 7.8 billion a year, would you be willing to lose say five airliners full of people per year?

You're assuming that the TSA would have stopped the 9/11 terrorists.  That's absolutely retarded.  The only thing they're good for is molestation and fighting yesterday's war.

But hey, what else can you expect from high-school dropouts who answered employment ads off the back of pizza boxes?

(Yes, that's real - http://voices.washingtonpost.com/federal-eye/2010/07/tsa_using_pizza_boxes_to_recru.html)

[TK73]

Can't trust that source!!

Washington Post??

PFFFFFFT  HAH!!






(ps: stepfather worked for the post for decades... heh heh)

[flyinlow]

I will say this, from what I see in airports, if you really want to get all hot and bothered about something, get excited and angry about this; the US armed forces personnel do a great deal of their moving about the country on commercial flights.  I watch those guys in their uniforms and carrying their gear wait in the same lines as I do and get submitted to the same inspections as me.  As far as I'm concerned they should be getting better VIP treatment than Obama.  At the very least they should get to use the first class lines.

I agree . Most Gate Agents, Flight Attendants and Pilots  will try to do a little extra for our Servicemen . I know when my Son came home from Iraq on leave it was a 36-48 hour marathon of hurry up and wait each way.