HEY GUN GUYS!!!! OLD .36cal black powder pistol. authentic or cheap replica??

[HITMAN 149]

Hey guys!! 
I was wondering if anyone could help me out? I have a .36 Black Powder Pistol that belonged to my stepfather, who passed away several years ago. I was curious if anyone could help me determine if it's authentic, or just a cheap replica, and it's value? I have attached several pictures for refrence.It is in fantastic condition from what i have been told. It's engraved all over & has a scene engraved from a naval engagement 16 MAY 1843.
THANKS!!!
-JOHN

[HITMAN 149]

MORE PICS...

[chargerboy69]

Cool looking old gun John, and I have absolutely no idea.

But Rick from Pawn Stars could tell you right away. 

[learical1]

Is there lettering above the naval scene? or is that where the 16 May 1843 is?

[moparstuart]

Cool looking old gun John, and I have absolutely no idea.

But Rick from Pawn Stars could tell you right away. 

or call in his expert 

[HITMAN 149]

Is there lettering above the naval scene? or is that where the 16 May 1843 is?

yea above the scene on the cyl it says "engaged 16 may 1843" 

hahaha yea i told the misses i might just have to go to vegas to verify the pistol!!! 
i can't even explain the look i got!!!  lmao

[John_Kunkel]

Doesn't the "MADE IN ITALY" stamped on the right side of the barrel give a clue?

The real thing would be stamped "Colts Patent"

[HITMAN 149]

ummm YEA... IT TELLS ME THE THING WAS MADE IT ITALY!!!!!!!!

[learical1]

I googled "naval battle 16 may 1843" and learned all about the Republic of Texas' Navy, and how they jackstomped the Mexican navy on that date.  Unfortunately, I also saw that the original 1851 Colt Naval Revolver was reproduced in Italy starting in the early 1950's.   

[HITMAN 149]

yea my friend did that and printed off @ 3 ink cartidges worth of googled stuff!!! lol but i haven't found anything saying whether or not it's a worthless cheap copy or an authentic "old" pistol...
hmmmm thanks!!!

[John_Kunkel]

Clue:

Authentic old Colt pistols aren't stamped MADE IN ITALY.

[moparguy01]

Definately a replica. But a fun toy none the less.

[HITMAN 149]

Clue:

Authentic old Colt pistols aren't stamped MADE IN ITALY.

I'm not really sure what your problem is and I wasn't looking for smart ass responses. I KNOW COLT was made in Hartford, Ct. and was simply trying to find out from someone who actually knows about firearms, if this is  possibly an authentic firearm rather than a cheap replica as a friend who has an intrest in guns informed me that this might be more than a "cheap" toy.
while I appreciate you stating the obvious, why don't you take the rest of the night off, so you don't overexert yourself.

[parkerswede]

Its a replica made in Italy more than likely by a company called Uberti (there are a couple of other ones). They are generally well made and probably cost 600-800 dollars new.

[HITMAN 149]

thanks!!
yea that's what im finding out today... oh well!! lol damnnn... thought id be able to replace my charger!!! lol
a gun forum member is saying it's a modern reproduction prob @$150!?!?
ehhh no biggie...  i'll just give it to my friend to hang on his wall. it'll go with his western cabin decor in his house!!
thanks guys!!!

[John_Kunkel]

I'm not really sure what your problem is and I wasn't looking for smart ass responses.

When a simple statement of facts becomes a "smartass response" it seems that you are the one with a problem.

I KNOW COLT was made in Hartford, Ct. and was simply trying to find out from someone who actually knows about firearms, if this is  possibly an authentic firearm rather than a cheap replica

How can a "replica" be an "authentic firearm"? Your original question was non-sequitur. Sorry for being blunt.

[Drache]

Just for fun... here's a real 1851 Colt Navy! Purchased new back by an ancestor of mine who was in the Militia during the Civil War. Sadly the gun had seen better days. My dad remembers being allowed to play with it when playing cowboys and indians as a kid. Same with my grandfather. The frame has a hairline fracture in it which was the reason the kids were allowed to play with it, can't do much with a useless gun. 

[Drache]

Its a replica made in Italy more than likely by a company called Uberti (there are a couple of other ones). They are generally well made and probably cost 600-800 dollars new.

I would say a company called Pietta did the one above. Too much scroll work and fanciness for an Uberti. New that gun would cost (here in Canada) $300-$400 max brand new.

[mauve66]

i didn't see anything on it that said it was a colt, other companies made handguns way back then, not just colt.  why couldn't it be an authentic handgun FROM the ITALIAN NAVY???

[69CoronetRT]

I'm not really sure what your problem is and I wasn't looking for smart ass responses.

When a simple statement of facts becomes a "smartass response" it seems that you are the one with a problem.

I KNOW COLT was made in Hartford, Ct. and was simply trying to find out from someone who actually knows about firearms, if this is  possibly an authentic firearm rather than a cheap replica

How can a "replica" be an "authentic firearm"? Your original question was non-sequitur. Sorry for being blunt.

Gotta agree with John....
.
Yes...it's an authentic fire arm.
No it's not an original Colt.
Yes it has some value but not the same as an original Colt.

[69CoronetRT]

Just for fun... here's a real 1851 Colt Navy! Purchased new back by an ancestor of mine who was in the Militia during the Civil War. Sadly the gun had seen better days. My dad remembers being allowed to play with it when playing cowboys and indians as a kid. Same with my grandfather. The frame has a hairline fracture in it which was the reason the kids were allowed to play with it, can't do much with a useless gun.  

FWIW...the SN dates to 1863. Blue book shows an 1851 fourth model, of which this is a 4th model,  in 10% condition is still valued at $1,000.

[69CoronetRT]

Its a replica made in Italy more than likely by a company called Uberti (there are a couple of other ones). They are generally well made and probably cost 600-800 dollars new.

I would say a company called Pietta did the one above. Too much scroll work and fanciness for an Uberti.

It does not appear to be a Uberti.

[69CoronetRT]

i didn't see anything on it that said it was a colt, other companies made handguns way back then, not just colt.  why couldn't it be an authentic handgun FROM the ITALIAN NAVY???

Possible but why would it have the dates of a US naval action on it?
Why wouldn't it have the makers name on it?
Italy had many fine gunmakers. Are you saying this would have been made by one of them under license from Colt instead of using an Italian design?
If it was made in Italy for the Italian navy, why would it be stamped in English?
European made guns usually had proofmarks of some kind. Are there any proof marks on this gun?

[mauve66]

that's the info i was wondering about, wasn't saying it was something it wasn't but seemed to be alot more than a fake display model
the italian words for the italian navy make sense
i figured other countries copied the colt design but i guess they could of had their own too
as far as the date of a us naval battle i just figured that the date could of meant something to the italian navy also, we aren't the only ones to have battles in the past

[HITMAN 149]

thanks for all the info guys!!!
im going to give it to my friend to hang on his wall, as his house is all old western decor. he got these cool bullet wall mounts to hang it on.

-john

[Drache]

Uberti and Pietta make EXACT COPIES of the 1851 Colt Navies Pistols used in the Civil War. Their serial numbers are their own and thus cannot be dated the same as the Colt Navies. These two companies are CHEAP. You can pick up one of these copies for about $300.

The reason it is stamped with the US Naval action is because it's a copy of the real 1851 Colt Navies which are stamped with that date (and thus why they are called Colt Navies).

The reason it doesn't have a makers name is because it's a cheap copy. The only reason it has Made in Italy on it is they have to by law for export.

It wasn't made for the Italian Navy. Italy didn't have a navy until 1861.

Any other questions?  

I currently own an original Colt Navy and I've owned both copies from Uberti and Pietta. I used to shoot them all the time until black powder around here became harder to find than hens teeth...  

[HITMAN 149]

wow!! thanks for the info bro...
yea my friend got all excited when he looked up stuff online & saw what he thought was the same gun for @ $100K!!! lol meanwhile the gun was hanging on my stepfathers wall for as long as i can remember!!! hahaha
damnnn i got a lil excited thinking cool!!! i'll be able to replace my 68 r/t i just sold!!! hahahaha
it's all good though!!!

[68blue]

Probably a Pietta but they will shoot fine with powder, cap, and ball. They need a lot of cleaning after use, I use hot water and Simple Green cleaner, dry, then finish with WD-40.

[John_Kunkel]

Notice the difference in barrel length between the pic in the OP and the 1851 in Drache's post, the one in the OP appears to be the "pocket" configuration or a 1862 police version such as shown on the page below near the bottom but neither is consistent with the engraving on the one in the OP.

http://www.armchairgunshow.com/otsAC_percussion_colts.htm

[surmanajaja]

Just for fun... here's a real 1851 Colt Navy! Purchased new back by an ancestor of mine who was in the Militia during the Civil War. Sadly the gun had seen better days. My dad remembers being allowed to play with it when playing cowboys and indians as a kid. Same with my grandfather. The frame has a hairline fracture in it which was the reason the kids were allowed to play with it, can't do much with a useless gun. 

I wouldn´t try to fire a 150-160 years old gun even if it looked "brand new", the metal fatigues anyway and theres a good chance it would blow up on ur face. because of that, in Finland you dont need a permit for such an old gun, since its not usable anyway.

uberti makes nice replicas, theyre the ones that Clint Eastwood used in all those great spaghetti westerns. you can get them in all kinds of calibers, .38 for example. check the website:http://www.uberti.com/firearms/walker.php

[Drache]

Just for fun... here's a real 1851 Colt Navy! Purchased new back by an ancestor of mine who was in the Militia during the Civil War. Sadly the gun had seen better days. My dad remembers being allowed to play with it when playing cowboys and indians as a kid. Same with my grandfather. The frame has a hairline fracture in it which was the reason the kids were allowed to play with it, can't do much with a useless gun.  

I wouldn´t try to fire a 150-160 years old gun even if it looked "brand new", the metal fatigues anyway and theres a good chance it would blow up on ur face. because of that, in Finland you dont need a permit for such an old gun, since its not usable anyway.

uberti makes nice replicas, theyre the ones that Clint Eastwood used in all those great spaghetti westerns. you can get them in all kinds of calibers, .38 for example. check the website:http://www.uberti.com/firearms/walker.php

In canada antique guns sell for quite a bit since you dont need a permit for them and they are one of the favorites at the range. Ive owned three antique firearms and the only reason Ive sold them is the cost of the rare ammo for them (one of the requirements in Canada for being an antique is rare ammo).

If they are checked by a gunsmith before use then it's fine.

Notice the difference in barrel length between the pic in the OP and the 1851 in Drache's post, the one in the OP appears to be the "pocket" configuration or a 1862 police version such as shown on the page below near the bottom but neither is consistent with the engraving on the one in the OP.

http://www.armchairgunshow.com/otsAC_percussion_colts.htm

Actually it's still an 1851 Colt. Pietta calls it the Sheriff model and there were real 1851 Colt models made with even shorter barrels. The 1862 has a way different barrel profile.

1851 had octagon barrels whereas the 1862 models were round barrels.

1862 Colt:


1851 Colt:


OP's Gun: