Were any of the Charger 500 440HP engines originally "blue"?

[xs29j8Bullitt]

Were any of the early 1969 production engines the turquoise blue color like used on 1968 and early engines?  I had always thought the HP engines in 1969 were always orange, and only non-HP engines like the 350hp 440 were the turquoise blue.

Over the weekend I came very close to buying a 440 for my C500, but noticed some items like the t/blue color peeking through and a the "HP" stamping being too large and having other issues.  The seller insists that the HP engines were t/blue for the first half or so of production (say though December 1968), then changed over to orange.  The engine assembly date is 11/26/68, which would be ideal for my C500... but with the apparent bogus "HP" stamp, I guess that I will pass on it.

At first I thought that there was no way he was right about the turquoise blue 1969 HP engines, but have found something that casts a little different light on it.  Check out the pictures in my second post in this thread from XX29L9B238099, just 28 units after My C500 XX29L9B238071.

First the engine that I was considering buying...

[xs29j8Bullitt]

From Rick E's XX29L9B238099 block...

[tan top]

seen  turquise paint underneath the factory orange , where its flaking off !  on a numbers matching  E series 440  in a late 68 SPD 69 charger R/T !  think i mentioned it  on here sometime ago ! or i might be getting mixed up !
 was a silver &  unrestored car  
 perhaps they still had 68 turquise  R/T motors ! stock piled & the ones that were not allocated for !! the factory  painted them up  orange for the E series  model year  
****** EDIT********************
ok  been looking  for said info on charger  , thought i had it saved  ,  think it might of been on  mountainmopars site a couple of years back !!  ,  this might jogg some memory  of what i'm on a bout   it showed the driver side of the charger  from the back looking forward ,  original A4 paint  worn through to  factory  reddybrown  primer  on the flat  surfaces ! had  full wheel covers ,  standard SE type ! black top  &  stripe  !! two  or three pictures in the write up , had picture of matching  #s motor !!   just been pulled ,
     

[BigBlockSam]

 i don't like that hp stamp 

[moparstuart]

i don't like that hp stamp 

yeah it just looked a little to hinky for me too !!!!

[maxwellwedge]

I agree on the position of the HP as well - The rest looks ok. I have never seen anything but orange in 69.......even the magazine, PR and pilot cars had orange motors. The TNT motors in 70 were orange - wonder about the 69 TNT's.

[dreamcatcher]

I don t know if they were different but I parted a 69 383 car and it was blue.I do know it was the numbers engine to the car.

[maxwellwedge]

I don t know if they were different but I parted a 69 383 car and it was blue.I do know it was the numbers engine to the car.

Just HP's were orange.

[UFO]

Is there a vin on the questionable block?
At least it will give you the application.

[xs29j8Bullitt]

Is there a vin on the questionable block?
At least it will give you the application.

The seller says it is blank, but when I enlarged part of an engine shot there appeared to a partial VIN... see pad pic in first post.  Promised additional pictures have not arrived, so I am quickly losing interest.  I suspect that it is a 350hp 440 out of a C-Body... still a great motor to build, but not at the price he is asking.

[maxwellwedge]

Is there a vin on the questionable block?
At least it will give you the application.

The seller says it is blank, but when I enlarged part of an engine shot there appeared to a partial VIN... see pad pic in first post.  Promised additional pictures have not arrived, so I am quickly losing interest.  I suspect that it is a 350hp 440 out of a C-Body... still a great motor to build, but not at the price he is asking.

I thought it looked like a VIN in that pic as well.

[xs29j8Bullitt]

Anyone have any thoughts why turquoise blue is showing on this legit C500 block?...  Was the engine repainted early in its life?  If t/blue is over orange, why is not a speck of orange visible anywhere?  Maybe the block was vatted soon after new?!?  Just    

[UFO]

New guy on the line? Ran out of orange?
Leftover motor from the previous run of hp build ups?

[nascarxx29]

Just a guess it be blue if the 69 motor had come with air conditioning.I got a 70 N 383 4 barrel coronet 500 and its H.P motor is original blue

[BigBlockSam]

i have 6 440 hp motors from late 68 and 69 all orange . although the 68 440 matching # motor on my r/t was not orange.

[nascarxx29]

Maybe a mid year motor as the 69 motors I had didnt have full vin

[tan top]

seen  turquise paint underneath the factory orange , where its flaking off !  on a numbers matching  E series 440  in a late 68 SPD 69 charger R/T !  think i mentioned it  on here sometime ago ! or i might be getting mixed up !
 was a silver &  unrestored car  
 perhaps they still had 68 turquise  R/T motors ! stock piled & the ones that were not allocated for !! the factory  painted them up  orange for the E series  model year  
****** EDIT********************
ok  been looking  for said info on charger  , thought i had it saved  ,  think it might of been on  mountainmopars site a couple of years back !!  ,  this might jogg some memory  of what i'm on a bout   it showed the driver side of the charger  from the back looking forward ,  original A4 paint  worn through to  factory  reddybrown  primer  on the flat  surfaces ! had  full wheel covers ,  standard SE type ! black top  &  stripe  !! two  or three pictures in the write up , had picture of matching  #s motor !!   just been pulled ,

found picture of  charger i mentioned above !! thought sure i saved one of the motor also   as it clearly showed terquise under the orange

you can see by this picture alone its a 68 SPD!! no headrests & black door handle buttons

[hemi68charger]

Anyone have any thoughts why turquoise blue is showing on this legit C500 block?...  Was the engine repainted early in its life?  If t/blue is over orange, why is not a speck of orange visible anywhere?  Maybe the block was vatted soon after new?!?  Just    

I would think there was a bunch of 440 HPs laying around from the '68 model year. When the '69 model year begun, the then-painted-turquoise motors were painted orange in accordance with new criteria. So, were they actually placed into the cars with turquoise paint on the assembly line? Did a few slip out, maybe.. Was it within the Quality Control parameters for the '69 model run? Naaaaa..

This is just my hypothesis.  

[66FBCharger]

Anyone have any thoughts why turquoise blue is showing on this legit C500 block?...  Was the engine repainted early in its life?  If t/blue is over orange, why is not a speck of orange visible anywhere?  Maybe the block was vatted soon after new?!?  Just    

I would think there was a bunch of 440 HPs laying around from the '68 model year. When the '69 model year begun, the then-painted-turquoise motors were painted orange in accordance with new criteria. So, were they actually placed into the cars with turquoise paint on the assembly line? Did a few slip out, maybe.. Was it within the Quality Control parameters for the '69 model run? Naaaaa..

This is just my hypothesis.  

If the engines were leftover 68s, we should be able to confirm that, since the casting dates would be early 1968 (probably prior to June).

[Charger-Bodie]

i have 6 440 hp motors from late 68 and 69 all orange . although the 68 440 matching # motor on my r/t was not orange.

440 hp engines were infact Turquiose.

I could see a few of them to have slipped through in 69.

[hemigeno]

OK, I'll be the fly in the ointment of the leftover '68 argument...

Engine paint was applied after machining and engine assembly work was done, correct?  If so, then the engine ID pad would have been stamped prior to the engine ever having been painted either turquoise or orange.  A leftover '68 model year engine would have had a D440 stamp, not E440 - plus the engine assembly date would have been July or earlier in 1968, not Nov 26th of 1968.

[Charger-Bodie]

Im not so much saying the engines could be leftover . more like the technique possibly. Like wow we have a ton of this turquoise paint left. Might as well use it.

[moparchris]

Just a thought on this thread.  If the date/assy codes match what you are looking for and the block in question meets your particular parameters, what difference does it really make whether it was painted blue or orange 41 years ago?  You're going to tank it, machine it, assemble it and finally paint it.  At that point how could it really matter?  I get how everyone wants to be correct, and yes I am anal on my cars too, but at what point is enough enough? 

[Charger-Bodie]

Just a thought on this thread.  If the date/assy codes match what you are looking for and the block in question meets your particular parameters, what difference does it really make whether it was painted blue or orange 41 years ago?  You're going to tank it, machine it, assemble it and finally paint it.  At that point how could it really matter?  I get how everyone wants to be correct, and yes I am anal on my cars too, but at what point is enough enough? 

I think his concern is the possiblity of it being tampered with or restamped. Just trying not to get burned Im thinking.

[moparstuart]

Just a thought on this thread.  If the date/assy codes match what you are looking for and the block in question meets your particular parameters, what difference does it really make whether it was painted blue or orange 41 years ago?  You're going to tank it, machine it, assemble it and finally paint it.  At that point how could it really matter?  I get how everyone wants to be correct, and yes I am anal on my cars too, but at what point is enough enough? 

I think his concern is the possiblity of it being tampered with or restamped. Just trying not to get burned Im thinking.

yes i 'm sure if the HP stamping was correct he would have already bought it , the paint issue was a by product of the HP question   

[xs29j8Bullitt]

Just a thought on this thread.  If the date/assy codes match what you are looking for and the block in question meets your particular parameters, what difference does it really make whether it was painted blue or orange 41 years ago?  You're going to tank it, machine it, assemble it and finally paint it.  At that point how could it really matter?  I get how everyone wants to be correct, and yes I am anal on my cars too, but at what point is enough enough? 

Actually I am not that anal about it, and certainly do not care what color the engine was painted 41 years ago.  This post was more of a curiosity after a long held belief that ALL 1969 440 HP engines were orange was challenged by the seller.  When I then came across the picture showing t/blue on the 238099 engine block, I was more than a bit surprised... and wanted to know whether it was possible.  Still doubt it though...

The two biggest problems with the engine with a good date code is the sloppy way the "HP" was added with too large font & struck unevenly, plus the high asking price of $1500 combined with a long distance requiring a road trip or shipping.  In fact, if the "HP" had been properly done, the engine would be on its way to my C500 now.

My original plan was to go with a 1969 440HP engine without regard to assembly date, but I have received "advice" from several people to get the correct date code.  Since the assembly date stamping is easily seen by anyone walking up to the car, I am making the effort to get the date code close to the example of 238099...

This search is getting old... I just started a Craigslist "WTB" Ad:

http://dallas.craigslist.org/ftw/wan/2027124144.html

We will see if it gets results...

[Cooter]

I have a 1974 "HP" Block and it's stamped unevenly as well as a 1970 "HP" engine that is stamped the same way....I've seen even and uneven stampings....

[learical1]

FYI
November 26, 1968 was the Tuesday before Thanksgiving.  Knowing the UAW and their contracts back then, what will you bet that the engine plant was closed 11/28-12/1, reopening on 12/2?

[xs29j8Bullitt]

FYI
November 26, 1968 was the Tuesday before Thanksgiving.  Knowing the UAW and their contracts back then, what will you bet that the engine plant was closed 11/28-12/1, reopening on 12/2?

Good point Bruce... Of course the C500 was not necessarily made on the SPD, I have heard of cars made as much as two weeks after the SPD.  But with the 11/26 build date for 238099, my C500 238071 engine assy date was probably on or before 11/26...

[pettybird]

There's an original owner, original paint, original drivetrain '70 Challenger R/T in town here, and the motor was definitely painted blue under the orange paint.  Jim Angelucci, father of Joe (the guy whose house burnt with the parts in it)

I don't like the HP stamp either, but weird things do happen..."all" is a word you can't used much with Ma. 

[nascarxx29]

Double engine paint a random worker mistake???

[maxwellwedge]

From Barry's site - Just for fun