Elacruze 505" engine build

[elacruze]

I hate to sound like a moron, but willing to learn, I'm asking anyway : What's the scraper on the crank for. Sure I understand what it might be for, but what should the benefit be of scraping the oil from the crank counters?

Two things mostly;
1. Moving oil uses energy. A scraper gets it off the moving parts and back in the pan where it belongs instead of whipping around up there. The power then goes out the crank to the wheels instead of making heat in the oil, the energy which then leaves the engine through the cooling system. Less heat=more power.

2. Foaming. Oil that splashes up into the crank/rods gets whipped, and 'foams' or aerates. Even microscopic air bubbles in the oil reduces lubrication and cooling capacity of the oil. Again, the scraper puts it where it belongs and prevents the crank from knocking the oil around.

After those main points;
The oil will be in better condition towards the end of the change cycle, or you can go longer between changes.
The lubricated parts will last longer due to the reduced aeration and heat.
Front and rear seal leaks are less likely because the oil can't get to them as easily.
More oil in the pan reduces the possibility of uncovering the pickup at extreme braking or cornering. (or acceleration)

I had a friend long ago who ran a dyno in a durability testing lab. He told me that one dyno was used to discover the value of scrapers and windage trays. On a V8, they build a glass oil pan and used a strobe light to watch the crank. With no device to strip oil, they found that the vortex of the crankshaft held as much as 7 quarts at 8000 RPM. He said it looked like the taffy pulling machine at the fair and sucked the source dry. Our engines won't see anything like 8000 RPM, but the effect is there at all speeds to some extent. Think of the crank as a tornado generator. Ever seen the videos where a pickup truck or cow does two laps of a tornado before being spit out?

[elacruze]

I finally got the engine off the stand and onto the K-member. I doofed the clutch, ordered an 11" clutch on my 10.5" flywheel...so no install but I did get the bellhousing centered. We had to play WWE Smackdown on the stock alignment dowel-the best part of 2 hours to get it out. We were pretty close to backdrilling the block and punching it out but it finally gave in.
Win of the day; Bell center with stock pins was .042" off center. I hit it perfectly on the first try, max diff is .007" so I'm within .004" of crank center. Yay. Yes, Margaret, I cleaned the pin holes and used plenty of Anti-Seize. New Piccys-

[elacruze]

Since I have the original R/T 440 that came out of the car at hand, I installed the carb/air cleaner on it to measure hood clearance. This M1/850DP Holley/Moroso drop base was *very* close to the hood, but never left a mark on the bottom...too close for underhood insulation for sure. I measured from the valley pan hold down to the top of the wingnut-best I can check it's 10-3/4". We have a set of 6pack carbs in, so I sat them on my Weiand manifold and measured...lots of room! I couldn't run it with carbs and air cleaners without a scoop, but there's plenty of room for a custom plenum and throttle bodies without modifying the manifold body.

[Challenger340]

Geez it's nice to see somebody doing it RIGHT for a change !
GREAT JOB ! 

[elacruze]

Naturally there has to be some self-flagellation before things get buttoned up. After a lot of careful fitting to the scraper, I looked through the windage tray and there was about 1/2" of clearance to the crank weights. Unfortunately, I didn't turn the motor...so I go to adjust the valves and hear a slight scraping noise...not much, but dangit I can't let that go. Turns out the rod nuts were just touching the screen on the windage tray. Nothing an hour of hoisting, standing, RTV scraping and spacer-washer removing can't fix. Good to go now, back on the K and hopefully in the car tomorrow!

[elacruze]

It's in!

Wondering why Gear Vendors doesn't have two sets of tranny mount holes. I need either a spool mount or an offset crossmember.

[elacruze]

I had a new alternator bracket made to bring it closer to the block, to get better belt wrap on the A/C compressor.
Hemi pan and Firefighter torque strap.  

[greenpigs]

I see you shot some bolts in the motor mounts..per Ron, but do you also use an actual torque strap?

Lots of silver.

[elacruze]

I see you shot some bolts in the motor mounts..per Ron, but do you also use an actual torque strap?

Lots of silver.

No, the bolts *are* the Firefighter torque strap.  

And personally I'd have chosen different valve covers, black MP probably. But, everybody else seems to love these so I'm acquiescing to popular fashion.

[charger2fast4u]

looking great your putting alot of time and thought into this build. what kind of HP and TQ numbers are you looking at with the 505 build? i'll be doing a 505 when the time comes i got alot to do before i get to that part. got any pics of the whole car?

[oldschool]

looks awesome!!

[1Bad70Charger]

looks awesome!!

I agree, what headers are those, TTI, Dougs, Hooker, or ?

[firefighter3931]

Looking good Eric 

Those 30 yr old hookers cleaned up nicely 

I see you went with the Edelbrock 6-pack manifold as opposed to the Wiend piece....hood clearance issues ?



Ron

[elacruze]

looking great your putting alot of time and thought into this build. what kind of HP and TQ numbers are you looking at with the 505 build? i'll be doing a 505 when the time comes i got alot to do before i get to that part. got any pics of the whole car?

Waaail...dunno about the numbers. I expect torque numbers about as good as anybody's, but the HP is a real guess. The heads are "nearly" stock Eddy RPMs. The cam is a Racer Brown custom, .572" lift with 238* duration. The manifold has been stage 1 ported by Hughes. I really can't even guess, but I gave up the HP chase for drivability and durability. I can change the heads and cam easy enough later after all the summer touring. I expect this motor to purr like a kitten, drive like an electric motor and be a lot faster than it sounds.

Maybe we could start a pool.

[elacruze]

Looking good Eric 

Those 30 yr old hookers cleaned up nicely 

I see you went with the Edelbrock 6-pack manifold as opposed to the Wiend piece....hood clearance issues ?



Ron

That's actually the Eddy dual quad dual plane, which will start with a Holley Commander 950 TBI with driver box for #2 TBI. I expect exemplary drivability and torque.
I did measure the Weiand, and there will be no problem getting it under the hood, but...baby steps. Besides, I'll probably have another $2000 in hardware before it's ready to go and I'd rather spend the dough on driving the car as soon as possible so it's well proven by the Power Tour.

I just got my #1 spark plug in the mail...shorty short short. I'll test fit and take pictures tomorrow.
I'll be needin' a set of Firecores for this dude shortly too.
Have you seen the ceramic plug boots from Accel? I'm hoping they crop up as individually available somewhere.

[firefighter3931]

Wow, that EFI stuff is expensive ! 

Surprised to hear the Wiend will clear the stock hood....guess a throttle body is much shorter than a carb ? 

Firecore has a heat shield for the 90* boots that works fine with supercomps. If you want a mix of boot ends you just have to let me know what leads you need them on and we'll fit them to your specs. 

Here's a pic of the 90* shield


Ron

[elacruze]

Wow, that EFI stuff is expensive ! 

Surprised to hear the Wiend will clear the stock hood....guess a throttle body is much shorter than a carb ? 

Firecore has a heat shield for the 90* boots that works fine with supercomps. If you want a mix of boot ends you just have to let me know what leads you need them on and we'll fit them to your specs. 

Here's a pic of the 90* shield


Ron

In the photos above, you can sorta see that the carb base of the M1 is about 7-1/2" from base, and the bottom section of the Weiand (not the carb base at the top) is only about 6-1/2". I'll have ~5" to work with, and the throttle bodies will most likely come out the driver side. I still have to figure some way to plumb an air cleaner too...I'll likely use the old 440 as a test bed on a run stand to get the running details worked out, and get some learning curve on the Electromotive box. I'll have to go to coil-per-plug as well, and find a way to package the coils that isn't too cumbersome or ugly.

I think the shorty plug and heat shield will work nicely on #1. I don't think any of the other cylinders are a problem, but I'll have to verify all of them with the plugs in.

[elacruze]

My #1 cylinder has no plug clearance with the Eddy RPM angled plugs and 2" Hooker Super Comp headers. So I went searching for short plugs with 14mm threads and 3/4" reach, and found the NipponDenso IWM series. They're .400" shorter than standard plugs, and a little shorter than Accel shorties (I didn't have one to measure how much) Not cheap at about $12 each.

[elacruze]

Here are photos of both plugs installed with an old (burnt) boot, from two angles trying to show the difference. First two Champion, Second two ND.

[firefighter3931]

Nice detective work on the plug 

A 90* boot with the matching heat shield will work fine ! 

How are the other cylinders Eric ?


Ron

[elacruze]

Nice detective work on the plug  

A 90* boot with the matching heat shield will work fine !  

How are the other cylinders Eric ?


Ron

#1 is the only problem spot.
1-3
5-7
2-4
6-8

[elacruze]

I get confused.

Here's a look at the accessory configuration, from the resto thread. I'm going to confine engine build posts to engine function and upgrades only-should have the EFI mounted by next weekend.

[charger2fast4u]

good research and detailed pics of the plugs this may come in handy down the line. i wonder how well the NipponDenso short spark plugs will hold up and last  compaired to NGK's and others with fouling issues?

[Steve P.]

WOW!!!! Love this thread and all your research and work. Also the detail that you are putting into this thread.

The spark plug issue has been one for many of us and I for one am itching to see how the plugs work out. The pics show a nice amount of room, but the working end of the plug still needs to prove itself.

Something I am very interested in is the low set A/C pump. I was working on a set up close to this, only using a standard type water pump and running it backwards using a serpentine set of pulleys for more rubber/pulley grip. It looks like you will have about 1/4 of the pulley being grabbed by the belt. I considered this utilizing a 2-V system thinking it would be twice the grab, but I also figured on much more frictional drag. Are you planning to use 2 belts or do you think this will be enough to turn your compressor without slippage?   

[elacruze]

Steve,

I never liked the idea of running a single belt on the alternator, let alone a single belt alt from a single belt compressor. So I took a member's setup (sorry I don't remember who's that is at the moment) and applied it to my own, to get two belts around everything but the P/S pump. I have the option of running the 'stock' Bouchillon setup, one belt to the compressor and one to the alternator, or two around the compressor and one to the alternator. I looked hard at the Jeep conversion serpentine, but I don't like the idea of reversing the rotation on the WP. I'm going to try to find a reverse rotation marine engine to see if they have reverse rotation housings. The last option is to move the compressor to the high position.

Two steps forward, one back.