End of the Viper, PT Cruiser

[tricky lugnuts]

Anybody been reading about the end of the Viper and PT Cruiser? Hadn't heard anything about it until today.

I was reading the Mopar Muscle or Mopar Action or whatever it is and there's an article about several end of production special Vipers that they're building. Look awesome, but awfully expensive for me.

http://www.speedlux.com/last-iconic-chrysler-pt-cruiser-rolls-assembly-line/

[ChgrSteve67]

Yep

I think it was last month they stopped making the PT Cruiser.

I belive they think the Fiat 500 will be the new PT.

[dkn1997]

Anybody been reading about the end of the Viper and PT Cruiser? Hadn't heard anything about it until today.

I was reading the Mopar Muscle or Mopar Action or whatever it is and there's an article about several end of production special Vipers that they're building. Look awesome, but awfully expensive for me.

http://www.speedlux.com/last-iconic-chrysler-pt-cruiser-rolls-assembly-line/

That's why I could care less that they ever even made the first one.  Good riddance.

[bull]

Last I heard the Viper isn't going anywhere.

[Brock Samson]

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,71858.0.html

[WHITE AND RED 69]

Losing the viper is a shame, I could care less about the PT cruiser.

[Mike DC]

IMHO it's stupid to kill the Viper. 

I'm sure the program is a money-loser in any direct measurement, but these things always are.  People's perception of the brand is the vital benefit of it.  That effect can't very easily be measured.

[bull]

Chrysler's inconsistancy makes me ill. Despite all the ups and downs in the auto industry, Chevy can produce the Corvette for 57 years straight, Ford can produce the Mustang for 46 years straight... The only thing Chrysler seems to be able to do with any consistancy is, time and again, pull the plug on its own heritage.

[TruckDriver]

Knew about it, but never liked either car.

[bakerhillpins]

Chrysler's inconsistancy makes me ill. Despite all the ups and downs in the auto industry, Chevy can produce the Corvette for 57 years straight, Ford can produce the Mustang for 46 years straight... The only thing Chrysler seems to be able to do with any consistancy is time and again, pull the plug on its own heritage.

Well at least they are consistent with something. I suppose it could be worse. 

[bull]

Chrysler's inconsistancy makes me ill. Despite all the ups and downs in the auto industry, Chevy can produce the Corvette for 57 years straight, Ford can produce the Mustang for 46 years straight... The only thing Chrysler seems to be able to do with any consistancy is time and again, pull the plug on its own heritage.

Well at least they are consistent with something. I suppose it could be worse. 

I'm sure we all know the guy who has too many ideas and starts a bunch of different businesses and/or projects and never really completes any of them with much success. And when he does do something successful he seems to always undermine it somehow and run it into the ground. This has been Chrysler's M.O. since the Carter administration with everything but Jeep and Dodge trucks. I can think of no Chrysler/Dodge/Plymouth sports-type car models that have had an uninterrupted run for more than 20 years. Maybe the Coronet, which isn't exactly a sports model. But no "flagship" sports car like the Mustang or Corvette. I've got a new slogan for it: "Chysler, the a rent-a-company." Too many chiefs with too many different ideas, a revolving door of designers and bean counters; just too many fingers in the pie.

[tricky lugnuts]

"I'm sure we all know the guy who has too many ideas and starts a bunch of different businesses and/or projects and never really completes any of them with much success. And when he does do something successful he seems to always undermine it somehow and run it into the ground."

Yep - I used to work for that guy!!!

Agreed, it is a shame that Chrysler has not been able to maintain any sort of "flagship" performance car like the Corvette or Mustang over the years. I kind of liked the little Neon SRTs - sort of an affordable little race car for the working man - but they decided to get rid of those, too. 

[SRT-440]

Chrysler's inconsistancy makes me ill. Despite all the ups and downs in the auto industry, Chevy can produce the Corvette for 57 years straight, Ford can produce the Mustang for 46 years straight... The only thing Chrysler seems to be able to do with any consistancy is time and again, pull the plug on its own heritage.

Well at least they are consistent with something. I suppose it could be worse. 

I'm sure we all know the guy who has too many ideas and starts a bunch of different businesses and/or projects and never really completes any of them with much success. And when he does do something successful he seems to always undermine it somehow and run it into the ground. This has been Chrysler's M.O. since the Carter administration with everything but Jeep and Dodge trucks. I can think of no Chrysler/Dodge/Plymouth sports-type car models that have had an uninterrupted run for more than 20 years. Maybe the Coronet, which isn't exactly a sports model. But no "flagship" sports car like the Mustang or Corvette. I've got a new slogan for it: "Chysler, the a rent-a-company." Too many chiefs with too many different ideas, a revolving door of designers and bean counters; just too many fingers in the pie.

That's why u see a million mustangs and camaros and zero (most of the time) mopars...I like driving something different and out of the norm...with Chryslers crappy business management it might make our cars more collectable as time passes. Just look at how many new camaros have been made compared to new challengers....years from now the challengers will be hard to find and sought after.. while the camaro will still be on every used car lot. ~ I know this is bs but it makes me feel better. LOL 

[bull]

I agree, but that doesn't seem to dissuade the Chevy and Ford guys from their hobby. It just means they have more parts availability and support from their company. And that their company will make more money and therefore be more consistant and stable. Let's face it, if Chevy had made the Charger we'd probably be Chevy guys right now. I know I would be. Mopars are rare but not rare enough in my book to be so unique you never see them, like a Tucker or something. The only reason they're as rare as they are is due to the fact that Chrysler's head is always just above water. It kind of sucks that Chrysler's good run between the years of 66-74 has caused us so much suffering ever since.

[Highbanked Hauler]

Chrysler's inconsistancy makes me ill. Despite all the ups and downs in the auto industry, Chevy can produce the Corvette for 57 years straight, Ford can produce the Mustang for 46 years straight... The only thing Chrysler seems to be able to do with any consistancy is, time and again, pull the plug on its own heritage.

   Ain't it the case, it seems Chrysler shoots themselves in the foot every so many years.

[nh_mopar_fan]

The PT set the record for the longest production run of a model without any major design change.

It's basically the same car that rolled out in 2000.

It had it's run.

[Brock Samson]

The Viper will be back in two years with a redesign,.. probably using a new Tech V-8 and possibly Alfa or Ferrari bits.

the PT is still around as the Chevy XXXX the same designer, brian nesbit, designed a variety of "retro" cars one for ford was the last two seater T-bird that was stale by the time it came to market.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bryan_Nesbitt

Both the Viper (compared upon it's intro to the Original Ford 427 Cobra) and the PT (originally designed for Plymouth on Neon mechanicals) gave a boost to Chrysler in '99 when the company need a CAFE boost, it was classified as a truck remember?..

And the Viper hangs (or hung) on many a school-boys wall alongside or in place of the Lambos of the '80s and '90s.   Called a "Halo" car it has a gloryious race history and I'm suprised you guys are so freaking unappreciative.
Chryslers' history has always been rocky climbing from the gutter to market "Hail Marys" that sell like hotcakes...
(if Dodge cancelled the Charger when the '67s sold so poorly i guess that would've been OK huh?..)  
 Why all the hate?..  

 P>S> Edit...
 Further curiosity about the 11th Gen. T-Bird design led me to research and discover the actual 2002 T-Bird designer
     http://www.globalmotors.net/ford-lets-go-of-ford-gt-designer-camilo-pardo/
To wit:  "Camilo Pardo. He spent 24 years with the Dearborn, Michigan based automaker and is considered to be one of the most eccentric. His best known design was the production Ford GT supercar as well as the GT Concept and the GT90 Concept. Pardo, now 45, began his career at Ford. He can be credited for the Ford Thunderbird, Lincoln LS among others.* We wonder who'll pick him up next." \
 
Somewhat related is the fact that both the Viper and the the PT Cruiser as well as the 11th Gen. T-bird, GT40, new- VW Beatle, Mini Cooper and several other recent and current Cars are all baised originally on a "Retro design theme".
   
In a completely unrelated side note:
Pardos' GT90 is a favorite of mine being anything but "Retro" and a decidedly modern design for the 21st century...
Ford chose once again to go Retro with the FORDGT which Pardo also designed.
but I digress...90 pics here.. http://www.netcarshow.com/ford/1995-gt90_concept/
 
 
 

[moparstuart]

The Viper will be back in two years with a redesign,.. probably using a new Tech V-8 and possibly Alfa or Ferrari bits.

the PT is still around as the Chevy XXXX the same designer, brian nesbit, designed a variety of "retro" cars one for ford was the last two seater T-bird that was stale by the time it came to market.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bryan_Nesbitt

Both the Viper and the PT (originally designed for Plymouth on Neon mechanicals) gave a boost to Chrysler in '99 when the company need a CAFE boost, it was classified as a truck remember?..

And the Viper hangs (or hung) on many a school-boys wall alongside or in place of the Lambos of the '80s and '90s.   Called a "Halo" car it has a gloryious race history and I'm suprised you guys are so freaking unappreciative.
Chryslers' history has always been rocky climbing from the gutter to market "Hail Marys" that sell like hotcakes...
(if Dodge cancelled the Charger when the '67s sold so poorly i guess that would've been OK huh?..) 
  Why all the hate?.. 
   

I live them both  , but i bleed mopar 

[TexasStroker]

The Viper is a world beater and should be back.  If you've been in one you'll understand the price-tag.  I agree they could lower the price and move more units, but the lightweight components and engineering make the difference and don't come cheap.  The last run of Vipers are amazing cars and truly look better in person than over the net.  For every 50 vettes you see, you might see 1 Viper. vettes do nothing for me, nor do mustangs or camaros.  They have their following, they have their market shares, and they have their place at every stop light across town.  The Viper is truly a unique car in what amounts to a very low production volume for the run it has had.  Each generation saw an improvement in performance and styling...when was the last time you could say that?  If the car is going out-of-production I would imagine it is for a re-tooling and comprehensive redesign that should set the bar even higher.  It would truly be a shame to loose such a legendary vehicle.  I don't despise the car for having a steep price tag, it just makes me know if I want one I've really got to work hard to get it. 

While not a huge fan of the pt cruiser, particularly with the brand-x copies, it and the minivan have their place.  They sell to a segment and provide revenue for the development of other cars and side projects which folks like us care more about.  The PT is a Mopar and has quite an avid fan base.  These people put tons of time and money into their cars and have a lot of fun with them.  I don't see anything wrong with that.

[bull]

The Viper will be back in two years with a redesign,.. probably using a new Tech V-8 and possibly Alfa or Ferrari bits.

the PT is still around as the Chevy XXXX the same designer, brian nesbit, designed a variety of "retro" cars one for ford was the last two seater T-bird that was stale by the time it came to market.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bryan_Nesbitt

Both the Viper and the PT (originally designed for Plymouth on Neon mechanicals) gave a boost to Chrysler in '99 when the company need a CAFE boost, it was classified as a truck remember?..

And the Viper hangs (or hung) on many a school-boys wall alongside or in place of the Lambos of the '80s and '90s.   Called a "Halo" car it has a gloryious race history and I'm suprised you guys are so freaking unappreciative.
Chryslers' history has always been rocky climbing from the gutter to market "Hail Marys" that sell like hotcakes...
(if Dodge cancelled the Charger when the '67s sold so poorly i guess that would've been OK huh?..)  

 Why all the hate?..  

To what "hate" are you referring? I can't tell by reading who you are talking to because I didn't see too many people happy about the Viper's departure.

[Brock Samson]

quote TruckDriver  > l Knew about it, but never liked either car.

quote dkn1997   > That's why I could care less that they ever even made the first one.  Good riddance.


                                         

[Ghoste]

As someone who gets to drive a bunch of cars quite regularly that he will probably never actually own an example of any of them, let me just say that the Viper is one of my favorites for a bunch of reasons and one of the biggest is it's bang for the buck factor.  Agreed, it ain't on the beer menu but it's a long way down from the top of the overpriced wine list yet still provides an incredible mindblowing kick.

[THE STIG]

So in 20-30 years will Viper owners be getting the shaft from Chrylsler like Charger, Roadrunner, Coronet, and Challenger owners are now?

[Ghoste]

If Chrysler is still around.  Since Fiat plans to turn them into a maker of little cars (and didn't Saturn work out great for GM?) I would guess that the most exciting thing coming from them in the future will be a limited edition Nancy Pelosi Signature Electroturd.  It will be a 4X4... four doors and four square feet of interior room.

[ACUDANUT]

 I'd rather own a 2007 Ford GT....Not a mustang either.

[Brock Samson]

i believe it had about a tenth of the numbers made (per Year) 4038 FORD GTs in total - and was two to three times more expensive... $149,995 Vs.  $86,140

  The first private sale of Ford's new mid-engine sports car was completed on August 4, 2004, when former Microsoft executive Jon Shirley took delivery of his Midnight Blue 2005 Ford GT.[2] Shirley earned the right to purchase the first production Ford GT (chassis #10) at a charity auction at the Pebble Beach Concours d'Elegance Auction after bidding over $557,000.[3]
A few other early cars sold for as much as a US$100,000 premium over the suggested retail price of $139,995 (Ford increased the MSRP to $149,995 on July 1, 2005).[4] Optional equipment available included a McIntosh sound system, racing stripes, and forged alloy wheels adding an additional $13,500 to the MSRP.[5] An enthusiast website, FordGTprices.com, tracked sales and production numbers, and published up-to-date best-pricing advice, based on tracking the prices of successfully completed eBay auctions of the cars. By June 2005, retail sale prices had dropped to around $10,000 to $20,000 over MSRP, and in August 2005 several new GTs were sold on eBay for no more than the suggested retail price

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_GT   production numbers and prices

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dodge_Viper                 "

  Car and Driver tested the Viper's track performance, and managed a fast sub-3 minute lap time around Virginia International Raceway. The Viper's time, despite hot weather, was faster than the Corvette Z06, Ford GT, Nissan GTR, Porsche 911 Turbo, 911 GT3, and 911 GT2, Audi R8, and similar cars.
  The 25,000th Viper is owned by Kurt Busch and the milestone was commemorated by Bob Nardelli, Chrysler LLC Chairman, in a ceremony at the Conner plant in March 2008
   Price Range: $86,140 - $91,005

   On November 4, 2009, Dodge Car Brand President and CEO Ralph Gilles announced that the Viper would end production in the summer of 2010. A new car Template:As in 2012 to replace the current Viper, but it is not known if the new car will have the Viper name.[11]

The last 2010 Viper has been built, but a 2012 Dodge Viper redesign is likely. Ralph Gilles said the new car would use expertise, materials, and technology (but not parts) from Ferrari to lighten the weight, with a V-10 derived from the current 8.4L engine. Gilles said the Viper will always be V10 powered and that there might be a V8 powered sibling. * We believe that the future Viper will be similar to the current one in basic look, feel, and character; changes will focus on increasing performance and conforming to new safety standards.
   
* http://www.allpar.com/cars/concepts/firepower.html

[bull]

quote TruckDriver  > l Knew about it, but never liked either car.

quote dkn1997   > That's why I could care less that they ever even made the first one.  Good riddance.

I saw the one from truckdriver but not dkn. Very strange though. You wouldn't think any car guy/Dodge fan would have any problem with a good looking V10 RWD 600+ hp Dodge monster but... whatever. Anyway, the words "hate" and "hater" have been overused to the point of impotence. They have no meaning anymore.

[Brock Samson]

 I know, how many two seater sports cars has Dodge made anyhow?..   And the PT was pretty trendsetting in it's own way at the time,.. I really loved the original concept... in 1998 it was pretty neat, that was 12 years ago and I still love the Raked Ford Coupe look. 






They made a convert two door and a no slouch GT Turbo Convert. that was pretty neat and well turned out.


It's also important to note that the Daimler "invasion" derailed the Dodge Chrysler Plymouth plans for all it's product lines delaying all model updates a min. of 18 Mos. and eliminating Plymouth entirely.
 and that's all I'm gonna say about that.  

[Mike DC]

   
I wouldn't mind seeing the Viper go to V8 motors.  IMHO the V10 always sounded wrong. 


The car's signature is a stupid amount of low/midrange torque and a mandatory stick shift.  Keep that intact and it will remain pure.