lame hemi

[wrench]

Hi guys. I've got a 472 barton hemi, automatic, with 3.23 gears. Dyno'd at 595. should this thing be frying tires? It pulls really good off the line, no bog whatsoever, but the tires barely spin. is this common or did i miss something?

[68X426]

You want to spin? ?

No show, all go. No action, all traction. Is no spin actually a problem, really?
If the goal is to put on a show, then there are guys on here that can certainly get you set up for that and how to delivery smoke and burned rubber.

Since you asked, for reference, my 660 hp Hemi is dialed in, Dana 4.10s, CalTrac suspension, 2800 stall, 295-50s.

•   The car is stupid fast.
•   No spin.
•   Can't spin.
•   Won't spin.

I'm very happy with no spin, all traction. My opinion: you have no problems if you got traction.  Enjoy the good times.

[wrench]

yeah, i know what you're saying. going fast is the key, right. it's just that i expected more from the big guy, especially since i don't have any traction control parts. original leaf springs,etc. i forgot to mention, i'm running stock exhaust manifolds through tti 2.5's and dual edelbrocks, do you think headers and a single holley would make a substantial difference. 

[greenpigs]

   Is there a reason your running stock exhaust manifolds? I would have a set of headers on it if it was mine. What stall is your converter flashing at? If you want smoke you could run a dynamic 9.5 street converter and then deal with hooking up after all the tickets.

[maxwellwedge]

Start with some 3.55 gears and a stock "Hemi" convertor - you will notice a big difference over those 323's. Go 3.91's if you don't live on the highway.

[wrench]

i sort of like the stock look for the exhaust manifolds and they are trouble free. although i installed tti's on a clients bb the other day and seemed pretty good quality.the convertor is stock "hemi" 2800 from ati. i would like 3.91's but i can get 4.10's for a decent price(used). would 4.10's be too much. i do live out in sticks.

[maxwellwedge]

If you start running a real loose convertor, 4.10's and have any kind of tire, those 600 ponies and all that torque may send that 8-3/4 back to its maker!

[wrench]

Thanks guys. i guess we'll do baby steps and see what happens.

[BSB67]

Tire spinning is probably not a good measure, as 68x426 suggests.  If you get us a 1/4 mile et and mph, then we could tell you if things are about right.   FWIW, the car in my sig will not spin my BFG P-235 70 14s. 

[Brass]

Getting traction is definitely important but it sounds like something is wrong.  My 230 rwhp 440 with manifolds, auto, 3.23, and 2800 stall will fry the tires at will - without touching the secondary's.  I can see how you would not want to spin the tires for a hard launch.  But it sounds like Wrench's set-up, without traction control, should have enough torque to lay down tracks all day long if he wanted.

Do the tires at least start to slip?  Maybe it is short-shifting and coming out of 1st gear too soon?

[wrench]

the tire do slip a bit but not much, and i manually shift it. it will stay in 1st as long as i hold it. like your saying, you would think this thing would eat asphalt for dessert.

[maxwellwedge]

Recheck your initial and total timing....that dog should hunt.

[elacruze]

yeah, i know what you're saying. going fast is the key, right. it's just that i expected more from the big guy, especially since i don't have any traction control parts. original leaf springs,etc. i forgot to mention, i'm running stock exhaust manifolds through tti 2.5's and dual edelbrocks, do you think headers and a single holley would make a substantial difference. 

Did Barton dyno the motor with stock manifolds?

If not, you're killing it. Tall gears too, and you probably have big sticky tires.

[wrench]

your right,barton had headers on it on the dyno. i didn't think it would lose that much power, FAST guys are running stock manifolds(slightly modified) and they run 9's. from 595 hp to let's say 500, that should still be enough to giddiyup. i gotta do some digging.  Thanks.

[wrench]

your right, dyno with headers. i new it was going to make a difference but from 595 to 500 hp, it should still giddiyup. total timing 34 all in by 2500. i will do some digging.

[wrench]

echo

[maxwellwedge]

Stock Hemi manifolds aren't terrible - and the FAST guys are using them (but they extrude-honed them).

Have you got a good flowing exhaust system? Timing sounds close enough to run properly. The 3.23's are not liking your camshaft for sure.

[wrench]

would prefer 3.91 but will try the 4.10's for now.  Thanks.

[mauve66]

383, stock bottom end, purple shaft .474, 340 convertor, 3.23 rear, smoked a 14 inch radial through 2nd gear

[maxwellwedge]

Gotta remember, the big port, big valve Hemi heads aren't tree stump pullers in the lower rev's. They are race motors corked-up. 383/440's have a lot more velocity in the lower revs.

[Mefirst]

The Hemi wants RPM, so rew that Moth..FU... and you'll smoke up the rear tires faster than you can even imagine possible...

My Hemi is a bit more race oriented than yours, but it should not matter.. any ways... My Hemi does want Rpm, once the Rpms start to climb then things will start to happen very fast and I really need to be on top of things or bad things will happen faster than I can say -Ooh SH..T

/Tom

[Cooter]

Gotta remember, the big port, big valve Hemi heads aren't tree stump pullers in the lower rev's. They are race motors corked-up. 383/440's have a lot more velocity in the lower revs.

Amen, think "Boss 302" and "351 Cleavland 4V"..Make alotta power as long as it was in the ozone doing it...

[Ghoste]

Which is why a lot of Street Hemi's got smoked by 440 Six Packs (and much lesser wedges but all with that street friendly torque ) in the stoplight wars.

[adauto]

The Hemi wants RPM, so rew that Moth..FU... and you'll smoke up the rear tires faster than you can even imagine possible...

My Hemi is a bit more race oriented than yours, but it should not matter.. any ways... My Hemi does want Rpm, once the Rpms start to climb then things will start to happen very fast and I really need to be on top of things or bad things will happen faster than I can say -Ooh SH..T

/Tom

Which is why a lot of Street Hemi's got smoked by 440 Six Packs (and much lesser wedges but all with that street friendly torque ) in the stoplight wars.

How true, my girl's just starting to breath nice at about 2800!

[Scaregrabber]

I've ran Hemis for 30 years. From stockers to my current 472. Most of them had stock convertors and exhaust systems. If a Hemi doesn;t destroy the tires, something is off. Check out your timing, advance curve and then start looking at the carb.
That has to be embarrasing.

Sheldon

[TylerCharger69]

I think you should be able to roast those tires with no problems!!!   Im thinking a weak transmission  and maybe the torque converter is shot.....i dunno.....I remember mine was not a tire roaster, and when i swapped trannys......that made all the difference in the world.   Just my experience though