Daytona/Superbird Rear Wing Design Question?

[DC_1]

I am sure this question has possibly been asked and discussed somewhere but what was the purpose of having the rear wing so high on these cars? I cant imagine the height had a lot to do with vertical down force to the rear wheels. Was it more for the lateral stability of the wing posts would create in the wind stream? It can't be just to allow access to the trunk on the production models, they could have mounted a lower wing to the trunk to eliminate trunk access problems. I would think the drag produced by these post would out weight the gain in any stability.

[Troy]

The wing could generate upwards of 700 pounds of down force so mounting it to the trunk was not an option. The braces inside the trunk are for lateral stability I'm sure but also to keep the quarters from buckling under the load. The uprights have minimal drag (unless you're sideways and then they'd help push the car back in line).

I don't know the exact reason for the wing being so high but it does get it out of the "dirty air" close to the car. The wing and braces also act like a fulcrum so the effectiveness of the wing increases as it's moved higher up and farther behind the car. For other examples of both of these concepts, check out the location of the control surfaces on the tail of most airliners.

Troy

[DC_1]

The wing could generate upwards of 700 pounds of down force so mounting it to the trunk was not an option. The braces inside the trunk are for lateral stability I'm sure but also to keep the quarters from buckling under the load. The uprights have minimal drag (unless you're sideways and then they'd help push the car back in line).

For the 200 mph race cars I understand but the production cars wouldn't see those forces. The Nascar versions could have had supports under the trunk to take the load. Just my observation..

[nascarxx29]

On one of the areo sites info .I think I read something like the wing height didnt make a dramatic difference.And wing was raised higher for trunk access.And had hinge stops so trunklid wouldnt hit wing

[hemi68charger]

The wing could generate upwards of 700 pounds of down force so mounting it to the trunk was not an option. The braces inside the trunk are for lateral stability I'm sure but also to keep the quarters from buckling under the load. The uprights have minimal drag (unless you're sideways and then they'd help push the car back in line).

For the 200 mph race cars I understand but the production cars wouldn't see those forces. The Nascar versions could have had supports under the trunk to take the load. Just my observation..

Not true.. The production wings were the same design as the Grand National cars. There was a Superbird in Florida a LONG time ago that buckled it's quarters because the new owner forgot to install the braces... You get a production car getting to speeds of 130+, pivot the wing for maximum downforce and no braces, "bye-bye" quarters....... I'll never try it.........

[Aero426]

For the 200 mph race cars I understand but the production cars wouldn't see those forces. The Nascar versions could have had supports under the trunk to take the load. Just my observation..

Whatever they wanted to run on the race car, they had to include into the design of the street car.  So that is why the street cars also have a bracing mechanism. 

The wing was initially raised to get the trunk open.    A benefit of this was that the height of the uprights helped handling.   

[nascarxx29]

Superbird wing info from same site http://www.coachbuilt.com/bui/c/creative/creative.htm

Even with the plug installed, wind tunnel tests revealed that the Superbird was still less efficient than the Daytona so a decision was made to reduce drag by enlarging the Superbird's vertical sail panels by 40% and increasing their rearward angle. The wings were attached to the car's frame via a triangular brace made from angle iron, with a

[DC_1]

good stuff, thanks for the info!

[wingcar]

The rear wing sits high only because the deck lid had to clear the rear wing, and in fact a lower wing would have been just as effective.  However, a major benefit from mounting the wing on high uprights was that the uprights made the car more stable, acting as "rudders" in the air, helping to keep the car tracking straight.  And, while it can be argued whether the wing is very effective at "legal" speeds, the uprights are very effective at freeway speeds.  A wingcar owner will find his car will track straight while passing an 18-wheeler at freeway speeds without the unusual side push of air most autos feel.   In fact many racers commented on how much easier it was to pilot a Daytona around the track, often using one hand! 

Somewhere I have a copy of the Windtunnel Test Report that Chrysler did on the development of the aero cars, it would answer a lot of your questions....I believe it's been posted out there before....worth a read, as it's very interesting....it shows how the design of the Daytona was a compromise between what was needed for the track and what was needed to keep it street legal (and sellable). 

[learical1]

from Aerowarriors:
"The Aerodynamic Development of the Charger Daytona for Stock Car Competition  
DATE:
February 1, 1970  TYPE:
SAE Technical Paper  

DESCRIPTION:
An often quoted work on how the Charger Daytona was developed. This paper (document number 700036) is available from the Society of Automotive Engineers. "


Now, back in the mid '70's, somebody (who will remain nameless) that owned 4 SuperBirds, found a copy of this document at his or her university's library.  This person made a couple of copies and sent one to one of the Aero car club's presidents.  The Society of Automotive Engineer's frowned on having the club publish the paper in the newsletter.  The person who made the copies has since finished college, sold off his or her Mopars, got married and had a bunch of kids.   Said person has no idea what ever happen to the copy he or she kept.  Said person kicks him-or her self in the butt for selling the Mopars and losing track of most of the valuable paperwork.  

[pettybird]

[xs29j8Bullitt]

Now, back in the mid '70's, somebody (who will remain nameless) that owned 4 SuperBirds, found a copy of this document at his or her university's library.  This person made a couple of copies and sent one to one of the Aero car club's presidents.  The Society of Automotive Engineer's frowned on having the club publish the paper in the newsletter.  The person who made the copies has since finished college, sold off his or her Mopars, got married and had a bunch of kids.   Said person has no idea what ever happen to the copy he or she kept.  Said person kicks him-or her self in the butt for selling the Mopars and losing track of most of the valuable paperwork.  

Said person = Sad person... 

Another said person obtained copies of the SAE, E-Series, & F-Series reports while he or she was living in Wichita, Kansas...  Although the reports have gone into hiding, said person hopes he or she will eventually find them.  Said person provided a partial copy of the E-Series report to Ken N. for his AeroWarriors website, and he or she remembers the partial E-Series report and full F-Series report being on AeroWarriors several years ago... but they appear to be gone now.  He or she wonders if they had to be removed like the drawings from Barry W.'s website...

Anyone know... or are still on the AW site...?

[nascarxx29]

Is this the SAE booklet your refering to in this post


http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,36386.msg399350/topicseen.html#msg399350

[learical1]

Yepper, that's the dude!