More Toyota Recalls: Corolla Electric Steering Problems now...

[Brock Samson]

 

8 million vehicles recalled from 12 model lines.

today they recalled the new  '10 Prius.

now this...

http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100209/RETAIL05/100209863/1290

[tan top]

thats a lot of cars being  re called  
  thats a big embarrassment for them
 bet the service departments are loving all this work ,  

[Arthu®]

It's odd, you know if this would happen to some of the western companies I wouldn't feel bad. It would almost be fun to see a couple of Germans wonder around at a press conference trying to explain the faults in their Germanish way. But whenever a Japanese manager needs to come up to the press to explain a problem it looks like he will commit suicide as soon as he comes home. They have made humbleness an art and every time they do something wrong they look like that small pup that has just ruined your shoe and it looks at you with the guilty eyes and you just can't get mad at them.

Arthur

[Mike DC]

Everyone is looking at these stories as if Toyota fell off the wagon. 

But that's not what I'm thinking.  I'm thinking something more like: "If a pillar of consistent quality like TOYOTA can't even make this stuff safe . . . " 





The auto industry can either stop trying to drive the whole goddamn car by-wire, or else they can look forward to a future of this stuff on a yearly basis. 

The airline industry can make fly-by-wire the standard thing.  But the auto industry is not the airline industry.  The auto industry doesn't have the trained vehicle operators, the expense invested per-vehicle, the system redundancy, the consistent maintinence schedules, nor the willingness to refrain from cutting corners. 

 

[squeakfinder]

Had an 84 Camry I just got rid of 3 months ago. It had 320,000 miles on it and still running strong. It's pretty sad to see this happening.

[Brock Samson]

 I've been following these Toyota stories doggedly since last Nov. It would appear the problems were hushed up about as long as could possibly be done, now the dam has burst with reports of several suppressed problems.
My feeling and it is just my opinion is that with the quest for industry domination R&D took a backseat to the quest to unseat GM and bottom line numbers.
As I recall the major magazines were warning about some of these issues two and three years ago.
Still yet to be resolved are the hybrid battery issues which will be cropping up shortly.
Scion hasn't yet been named but I know in Europe joint ventures between Renault and Toyota has led to these cars being recalled and of course the Joint venture here in the Bay area with the Pontiac Vibe in a soon to close NUMI plant is problematic with a few thousand folks are being laid off as we speak along with the parts suppliers.
of course the older Toyotas are pretty much immune from these problems.
Might be a good time to buy with their stock and inventory being devalued.
Personally I've all ways preferred Nissans over Toyotas which seem far more driver and enthusiast oriented.  
but I'd allways look for a Chrysler way before I'd buy anything else.
I'm not the typical car buyer by any means though...

[Silver R/T]

I say it's good time for Big 3 to get their crap together and take over while concurrent is down. We need to bring jobs back and stop depending on foreign products, including cars

[resq302]

I say it's good time for Big 3 to get their crap together and take over while concurrent is down. We need to bring jobs back and stop depending on foreign products, including cars

Silver,

I agree with you 100% but you know as well as I do, the Big 3 will never do something that smart.  Hell, look at that wonderful new dodge charger commercial during the superbowl.

[moparjohn]

As a devoted Chrysler fan, who has seen and put up with people, automotive press, and the most hated (IMO) consumer reports, bash Chrysler ever since I can remember (late 70's).   I am smiling watching the smug giant get some negative press. Sorry, I know they build "good" cars, but NEVER will I find myself in one.  Now toyata fans can defend their marque as I have mine.  Again I will dream of the America that celebrates the American car, like in the 50's and 60's, maybe this will open some eyes to the possibility of how much Detriot has changed, still not making new cars I would like, but more in tune with current demands. PLEASE! don't respond to my rant, I'm just enjoying the monent, let me have that. MPJ

[Silver R/T]

I say it's good time for Big 3 to get their crap together and take over while concurrent is down. We need to bring jobs back and stop depending on foreign products, including cars

Silver,

I agree with you 100% but you know as well as I do, the Big 3 will never do something that smart.  Hell, look at that wonderful new dodge charger commercial during the superbowl.
[/quo

I say it's good time for Big 3 to get their crap together and take over while concurrent is down. We need to bring jobs back and stop depending on foreign products, including cars

Silver,

I agree with you 100% but you know as well as I do, the Big 3 will never do something that smart.  Hell, look at that wonderful new dodge charger commercial during the superbowl.

I know...unfortunately everyone, starting with government has their head up their ass.

[chargergirl]

Sounds like they should stop buying Jaguar wiring harnesses...jk!

[resq302]

As a devoted Chrysler fan, who has seen and put up with people, automotive press, and the most hated (IMO) consumer reports, bash Chrysler ever since I can remember (late 70's).   I am smiling watching the smug giant get some negative press. Sorry, I know they build "good" cars, but NEVER will I find myself in one.  Now toyata fans can defend their marque as I have mine.  Again I will dream of the America that celebrates the American car, like in the 50's and 60's, maybe this will open some eyes to the possibility of how much Detriot has changed, still not making new cars I would like, but more in tune with current demands. PLEASE! don't respond to my rant, I'm just enjoying the monent, let me have that. MPJ

And you shall John.  For as, this is America, where we have the freedom of speech!   

[The70RT]

The old mechanical stuff worked fine. The rusty truck frame took it's toll first then went on a huge production spree when the big three were down. I'm sure more is to come. Now they have apologetic commercials. That still wont bring back the ones that lost their lives due to their shoddy craftsmanship.

[Silver R/T]

No offense but don't Americans build them Toyotas here, right on the U.S. soil? Sabotage? lol

[Ghoste]

They're built all over the world but that is beside the point.  Toyota has been one of the most ruthless about demanding their suppliers do it cheaper and cheaper all the time.  All of the automakers are guilty of that and sooner or later that strategy comes home to roost.  If it's designed or made by men it is subject to failure and for years now I've had to endure people telling me that Toyotas were the greatest cars on the planet and superior to everything else with wheels.  Turns out bad things can come from Japan too.  I am not happy about any injuries or deaths that have resulted from this but I can't say I feel the slightest sympathy for Toyota the corporation.

[Silver R/T]

I have to agree. Here at work they're doing these Japanese style events where they try to run company Japs would with "Lean" program and crap like that. You can only cut so much cost out of product before it's quality goes to shit. Toyota is good example. We've been supposedly saving money etc, but none of the employees have had any raises for the past 3 yrs or so.

[Belgium R/T -68]

I see 2 things to be the reason for this. First of all the culture and awarness in Japan is changing, in the past it was an honor for a Japanese
to work at one of the famous companys overthere. They were married moore or less to their company, their family was taken care of etc.
They worked moore or less like robots for a much smaller paycheck then we were used to but that has changed. The younger generation is
influenced by Europe and the US, they want the lifestyle we have and demands on sallary and workinghours gets higher.

Secondly, the competition in the carindustry is ofcourse also hitting the Japaneses, costreductions and improoved quality doesn't always walk
hand in hand.

I've been working for Volvo Cars for 28 years and been involved in several studies over "the Japanes wonder", "leanmanufacturing" or whatever
it has been called and according to my opinion we in the west has past them in many areas when it comes to those issues.

Same thing will happen in china, when the big mass overthere wants moore then the 250$ a month a worker on the assemblyline has today they
will also start to face big problems.

Per

[Sweet T]

Gentlemen (and Ladies) before we get nasty about the "Japan Car Company" and the recent deficiencies the media is exploiting into a God Damn Carnival remember these cars are built by your neighbours and family members.  This company is as much of an asset to the North American economy as any of the big 3.  Almost every vehicle is built on North American soil.  This includes almost every part being supplied by a North American supplier.  Jobs for us and our families.  Toyota has gotten where it is for producing quality.  If we are hearing this crap about Toyota now, just wait and see what you hear about your Big 3 next.......

[Arthu®]

That still wont bring back the ones that lost their lives due to their shoddy craftsmanship.

I only know of the incident with the Lexus where the floor mat jammed the throttle wide open. In which case they had the time to call 911 and talk to them for over a minute, a minute in which they could have done a lot of things that could have unstuck the throttle, take the car out of gear, or whatever. I wouldn't go as far as saying they deserved to die, but I do believe in a thing called natural selection. A stuck throttle is nothing serious, we have had an old Mini that would do that when ever its throttle position sensor would be too dirty, the Lada did it after it finally unfroze after months and for some reason got stuck in the full throttle position, you naturally take the car out of gear stop and look at why the throttle is jammed. Even my mom knew how to do that the first time it happened in the old Mini. This doesn't mean that there is not a problem with the Toyota cars, and I do believe they should be recalled, but we have come to a point where no one in society has any common sense anymore, we fully rely on other things and when they fail we tend to be helpless.

[Belgium R/T -68]

That still wont bring back the ones that lost their lives due to their shoddy craftsmanship.

I only know of the incident with the Lexus where the floor mat jammed the throttle wide open. In which case they had the time to call 911 and talk to them for over a minute, a minute in which they could have done a lot of things that could have unstuck the throttle, take the car out of gear, or whatever. I wouldn't go as far as saying they deserved to die, but I do believe in a thing called natural selection. A stuck throttle is nothing serious, we have had an old Mini that would do that when ever its throttle position sensor would be too dirty, the Lada did it after it finally unfroze after months and for some reason got stuck in the full throttle position, you naturally take the car out of gear stop and look at why the throttle is jammed. Even my mom knew how to do that the first time it happened in the old Mini. This doesn't mean that there is not a problem with the Toyota cars, and I do believe they should be recalled, but we have come to a point where no one in society has any common sense anymore, we fully rely on other things and when they fail we tend to be helpless.

Good point Arthur It's the same as blaming the GPS that you didn't find your way. We tend moore and moore to have to big trust in modern
stuff.

Per

[Ghoste]

If we are hearing this crap about Toyota now, just wait and see what you hear about your Big 3 next.......

The media has already been exploiting "my Big 3" for decades, I still am firmly of the opinion that I have absolutely no sympathy for Toyota whatsoever.

[The70RT]

People also fail to recognise most of the parts are made in Japan by well...Japanese. They are assembled here by low paid Americans.

[Troy]

I can tell you from personal experience that *at least* Toyota is doing something about the problems with the cars and trying to keep the customers happy/satisfied. Generally, it seems that the customer is the first to get royally screwed when the company needs to pinch pennies (especially in this economy). I see it happen almost every day.

My experience with my (newer) cars, warranties, and dealerships:
Toyota A+ (8 vehicles)
Chevy B
Nissan D (they at least try but stuff is still broken)
Dodge F- (I'm not sure my experiences could be any worse without involving an explosion or severe bodily injury of some sort)

Your experiences may differ of course. I'll probably be trying a Ford next but I haven't picked one yet.

Troy

[Brock Samson]

 The peddle assembly. is made in Canada - I don't know about the other parts, what amazes me is how they tried to blame the floor mats, one lady had a minor low speed accident where the car sped up and her mats were in the trunk.
but at some point we have to differentiate exactly which problem we're discussing because there seem to be at least five or six separate issues. The trucks seem to have a tie rod failure issue as well.

[Brock Samson]

 Well the Ford midsized fusion is getting pretty high marks Troy, their hybrid is superior according to the tests I've read.

[Troy]

The Fusion is pretty decent - my step sister has one and she hasn't managed to kill it yet (which is somewhat of a miracle). I'm not sure if I'm ready for a hybrid as I'm not willing to pay the higher costs (and maintenance) for what I see as a minimal improvement. For example, at $2.59 per gallon (current price in Ohio for 87 octane) and 30k miles per year it'd take me 7.12 years to cover the additional purchase price of the hybrid over the base model 4 cylinder (which would probably suck to drive but I could get a moonroof). I'd rather pay more for gas than to finance the higher costs and pay interest. The V6 has tons of options, gets much worse mileage, and costs almost as much as the hybrid so that comparison would favor the hybrid. I drive a lot on the highway so a hybrid isn't the best choice. If I worked downtown and lived in the suburbs I'd put more weight into the decision.

The local dealer has a blue/white GT500 and will give me Private Party Blue Book for my Ram and Tahoe. Somehow I don't think that is a '"responsible" idea but it sure would be fun!

Troy

[Brock Samson]

 Correction:
  I checked and the part in question in the pedals are made in America...
go for the 500 Troy I read bordom is dangerous... 
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpress/article/ALeqM5gizasS9zNON0KLGroJrN6kFdDg0g

[The70RT]

Correction:
  I checked and the part in question in the pedals are made in America...
go for the 500 Troy I read bordom is dangerous... 
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpress/article/ALeqM5gizasS9zNON0KLGroJrN6kFdDg0g

Yep sabotage then 

[resq302]

The peddle assembly. is made in Canada - I don't know about the other parts, what amazes me is how they tried to blame the floor mats, one lady had a minor low speed accident where the car sped up and her mats were in the trunk.
but at some point we have to differentiate exactly which problem we're discussing because there seem to be at least five or six separate issues. The trucks seem to have a tie rod failure issue as well.

The problem is the floor mats are not to blame and neither is the pedal assembly.  It is a signal that the computer is getting that tells the computer to give it more or full throttle.  Something as simple as receiving or making a cell phone call could trigger the sudden onset as all electronic devices MUST accept interference such as our portable two way radios for our fire and police departments.  Granted, wireless devices are more prone to accepting these types of interference but hard wired electronics can still accept the same things depending on the circumstance.

[89MOPAR]

They're built all over the world but that is beside the point.  Toyota has been one of the most ruthless about demanding their suppliers do it cheaper and cheaper all the time.  All of the automakers are guilty of that and sooner or later that strategy comes home to roost.  If it's designed or made by men it is subject to failure and for years now I've had to endure people telling me that Toyotas were the greatest cars on the planet and superior to everything else with wheels.  Turns out bad things can come from Japan too.  I am not happy about any injuries or deaths that have resulted from this but I can't say I feel the slightest sympathy for Toyota the corporation.

Hear Hear !    I second that motion.

Aurthur- many of the newer vehicles have no throttle cable to get stuck.  You push the pedal, it determines the depth of pedal movement, based on that, an electronic signal is sent to the throttle on the engine, and a little motor/valve attached to the inlet manifold opens the air inlet and pumps in more gas.  If a faulty electronic signal is forcing the 'butterflies' open, than what ?? [ beyond shutting off the car,shift to neutral]

[Arthu®]

They're built all over the world but that is beside the point.  Toyota has been one of the most ruthless about demanding their suppliers do it cheaper and cheaper all the time.  All of the automakers are guilty of that and sooner or later that strategy comes home to roost.  If it's designed or made by men it is subject to failure and for years now I've had to endure people telling me that Toyotas were the greatest cars on the planet and superior to everything else with wheels.  Turns out bad things can come from Japan too.  I am not happy about any injuries or deaths that have resulted from this but I can't say I feel the slightest sympathy for Toyota the corporation.

Hear Hear !    I second that motion.

Aurthur- many of the newer vehicles have no throttle cable to get stuck.  You push the pedal, it determines the depth of pedal movement, based on that, an electronic signal is sent to the throttle on the engine, and a little motor/valve attached to the inlet manifold opens the air inlet and pumps in more gas.  If a faulty electronic signal is forcing the 'butterflies' open, than what ?? [ beyond shutting off the car,shift to neutral]

I know that, I know that fix on these old cars is easier, but between going a 120mph out of control putting yourself and others in danger and shifting to neutral and possibly overreving the car (won't blow up, they will be controlled as soon as it hits the red. Shutting of the car is not the best option as it kills the power brakes and power steering possibly even engages the steering lock. I would just put it in neutral stop and shut it off. Anyways not doing anything is basically the worst thing to do in that situation and I think we can all agree on that.

Arthur

[Mike DC]

  
I'm amazed that this throttle issue was allowed to get so bad before Toyota even seems to have addressed it INTERNALLY.  Toyota has known about this for years.  I suspect they've known it wasn't just a floormat issue for years too.



As soon as they knew they had a problem with this, Toyota could have just put a bit of code into the cars to address it.  Just write the code so that if the gas & brake are being pushed at once, the brake pedal wins and the throttle backs itself off.  

Of course this would not have been a final solution or anything, but it would have bought Toyota some time to solve it.  It would have prevented 90+ percent of the continued injury/accident claims that continued to accumulate on more brand new cars.  

 

[Silver R/T]

People also fail to recognise most of the parts are made in Japan by well...Japanese. They are assembled here by low paid Americans.

x2, what I wanted to say.

[aussiemuscle]

remember these cars are built by your neighbours and family members.  This company is as much of an asset to the North American economy as any of the big 3. 

perception is a funny thing. GM and Ford make cars in australia, have done since the 1920's. GM (holden) is often portrayed as Australian, while Ford isn't. Toyota is about as japanese as GM or Ford. they are all global companies.

[Ghoste]

So in a global company, the money ultimately goes where?

[Mike DC]

Yeah, the domestic brands are still keeping more money inside the USA than buying foreign brands. 

I own a foreign car but I know it's not as patriotic as buying Detroit stuff.     



 



 

[Ghoste]

I was thinking less about patriotism than globalism.  Corporations are the first to point out whatever regional interest needs to be highlighted in order to porvide good press.  For example building a new plant in a small town in rural Kentucky could be considered American, Kentuckian, a county thing or even right down to the closest village depending on what they want, but ultimately the money goes somewhere.  Picking on Toyota (because I like to) means that at the very top, you eventually come to a board of directors who are not likely from (insert small foreign locality of choice) and I doubt they think of themselves personally as "global citizens". 
No real point here, just saying.

[Troy]

So in a global company, the money ultimately goes where?

Mostly to the employees (the biggest "expense" on most company's books) and shareholders. 

Oh! And taxes.

Troy

[Ghoste]

You know I mean the profits.  I suppose its unclear but that is why I used the term ultimately.  It's a somewhat rhetorical question meant to illustrate that even though we talk about corporations as being "global", at the very top the principals typically come from a single nation of origina and that at that level I would be surprised if they thought of themselves as belonging to some sort of global culture.

[moparstuart]

You know I mean the profits.  I suppose its unclear but that is why I used the term ultimately.  It's a somewhat rhetorical question meant to illustrate that even though we talk about corporations as being "global", at the very top the principals typically come from a single nation of origina and that at that level I would be surprised if they thought of themselves as belonging to some sort of global culture.

how would you like to be in the euro system and be german and french tax payers bailing out greece 

[Brock Samson]

 We've been bailing out entire countries for years, propping them up - forgiving their debt you name it...
But, what kills me, is among the many many articles i've read about the toyota problems are the toyota apologists who swear by toys as the "Best" cars ever built and they allways, allways include how crappy american cars are and the domestics horrible record for safety and quality and generally rag on anything American.
Obviouisly these folks never knew shi... sorry,.. anything about automobiles, their history or development and are sheep.
  A few short years ago Ford was in the dog house because of the high center of gravity and the faulty Firestones they were equiped with,.. Today Ford is actually doing quite well.

[Troy]

You know I mean the profits.  I suppose its unclear but that is why I used the term ultimately.  It's a somewhat rhetorical question meant to illustrate that even though we talk about corporations as being "global", at the very top the principals typically come from a single nation of origina and that at that level I would be surprised if they thought of themselves as belonging to some sort of global culture.

Yeah, I know. But again, "profits" also go to shareholders and that's only after you pay all your employees and vendors. In good times a company might make 10% profit which means that other 90% of income is getting paid out. I will gladly let you keep 10% of your income in Canada if I can have the other 90%. The same guys getting the profits also take on the losses but everyone else still gets paid (until something goes horribly wrong and everyone is out of a job).

Don't forget that every country involved also gets to tax the corporation - and every employee and vendor. You know what the taxes are on corporations, big paychecks, and Capital Gains? How do you suppose all these government run programs are paid for?

I work for a global corporation based here in the US. I'm sure people in countries where we do business complain about their money leaving as well.

Troy

[Ghoste]

I would imagine that they do.  My point being though, that even though Toyota (or whomever) have a large workforce investment in the US (or wherever) at the highest level the people who head the company (not the shareholders but the people who sit around the mahogany desk and roll the dice) speak the common language and observe the common customs and think of themselves as citizens of wherever that head office might be. 
I can't imagine a Japanese board meeting involving conversation about how they might improve the lives of their American workforce.  I doubt many American boards have conversations about how they can improve American lilves either but IMO there is this somehow implied ideal that by building a factory in the US it therefore follows that Toyota (yes, picking on them in a personal bias again) must obviously be a largely American company that cares deeply for the USA.
All speculation on my part obviously because I have never sat on a Toyota board meeting.  In fact my entire knowledge of Japanese culture is based on what people from North America who have lived there have told me so my speculation isn't even based in anything I could ever derive from something like fact.

[Arthu®]

Don't forget that every country involved also gets to tax the corporation - and every employee and vendor. You know what the taxes are on corporations, big paychecks, and Capital Gains? How do you suppose all these government run programs are paid for?

It depends on where the subsidiaries and home office are located but the U.S. but in general with most countries (that one would like to do business with) the U.S. has a Double Taxation Avoidance Agreement. That is why it is very profitable for countries to work through the Netherlands, we have a very unhealthy (except for the Netherlands and for the companies) tax system where you pay very little corporate tax. There are also a ton more tricks to lower your taxable earnings, but I won't bore you all too much .

Arthur

[Troy]

Sorry, forgot about point when I combined sentences. The employees are taxed where they live no matter where the company is based (ie the VP of North American Operations likely lives in North America so taxes on his pay, bonuses, and capital gains all stay here). The land, buildings, equipment, and infrastructure are also taxed where they are.

Any way, back to Toyota...

Troy

[Silver R/T]

I was wondering if Mr. Toyoda (president of toyota) is driving one of them Toyota's. What would be interesting to see him drive it and have accelerator get stuck while he's driving on one of their Japanese hills (they have a lot of them in Japan)
I wonder how he would handle that situation.

[Arthu®]

Sorry, forgot about point when I combined sentences. The employees are taxed where they live no matter where the company is based (ie the VP of North American Operations likely lives in North America so taxes on his pay, bonuses, and capital gains all stay here). The land, buildings, equipment, and infrastructure are also taxed where they are.

Any way, back to Toyota...

Troy

Correct, but remember how many authorities offer businesses incentives when it comes to establishing a plant or office somewhere. Some don't have to pay the majority of their taxes for years, a small example...

http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2009/04/greenville_area_gets_860000_ba.html

But indeed back to Toyota.

I was wondering if Mr. Toyoda (president of toyota) is driving one of them Toyota's. What would be interesting to see him drive it and have accelerator get stuck while he's driving on one of their Japanese hills (they have a lot of them in Japan)
I wonder how he would handle that situation.

No Akio Toyoda most likely drives a Mercedes Benz and his favorite cologne is from Bugatti. I would also like to thank you for your enlightened geographical comment on Japan, you know I have never been there and I did not know they have their Japanese hills, do you know how they differ from the Chinese hills? What are their characteristics? Also what would the effect be of having a stuck accelerator on a Japanese hill? Will it be more destructive than on a Japanese plain? Should he be going uphill or downhill? How do you recommend he handles the situation? I mean I wonder about all these things just from one single post made by you, you are by far the most inspiring and enlightening member of our board.

[Brock Samson]

 ouch! 

[Silver R/T]

Arthu® I recommend you visit Japan then and do some research, you live closer to Japan than most of us do.
p.s. Think you could make it there and back in Lada? Maybe drive Lada over there and trade it in for a Toyota. When and if you make it back to Netherlands maybe you can write a post how you made it back in one piece.

[Arthu®]

I just noticed your vast knowledge of Japanese geography and I wanted to pick your brain. P.S. you are about 800miles closer...

[resq302]

And now they are having problems with the power steering in the Toyota Corolla's.   Sheesh.

[Brock Samson]

 And,.. now the Tundra/Sequoia is under review as well.
10K vehicles recalled for cracking front driveshafts.
Plants being idled across the U.S.
http://www.examiner.com/x-38702-Product-Recall-Examiner~y2010m2d12-Toyota-recall-8000-2010-Tacoma-trucks-for-faulty-drive-shaft.

[Ghoste]

Didn't they already dodge a bullet in their truck line with frames cracking or something to that effect?

[The70RT]

Didn't they already dodge a bullet in their truck line with frames cracking or something to that effect?

Yeah rusted out frames - http://www.tundraheadquarters.com/blog/2009/11/24/toyota-frame-rust-recall-only-partial-fix/

[Mike DC]

     
I'll bet Honda is loving this. 


And Toyota's stock is probably gonna be undervalued for a while. 

[Brock Samson]

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/contribute/sn/forums?plckForumPage=ForumDiscussion&plckDiscussionId=Cat:f0150c98-e59f-413d-8445-1899e0161a54Forum:0c97677a-65c6-47cc-9037-95bef4028847Discussion:90b35923-5237-4275-9cb3-e9c13aecd381&plckCategoryCurrentPage=0

  "I have the original 2001 Prius, which was featured on the front page of SF Chron in 2001 because it was such an unusual concept at the time. Sadly, I found out yesterday that I'm being penalized for being an early adopter to the tune of $3700. That is the replacement cost (including installation) of the battery which has an 8 year warranty. The warranty was upped to 10 years in 2004 but Toyota did not grandfather earlier vehicles. More about this at   http://bit.ly/51EK0S

Looking at some owner bulletin boards on the web, it appears I may have shortened the life of the battery by allowing it to sit for a period of time till the battery discharges. But, I don't think you should have to babysit your battery.

My new $3700 battery has a 12 month warranty. Guess that tells you something."
 

[skip68]

My new $3700 battery has a 12 month warranty. Guess that tells you something."
 

   Man that just sounds wrong, wrong, wrong.......   

[Ghoste]

I don't even feel slightly sorry for him.  That is exactly the kind of thing people have been trying to say since the greens started this whole mad campaign to go electric "RIGHTNOWTHISVERYSECONDWEDONTCAREIFTHETECHNOLOGYEXISTSJUSTDOITDAMMIT!!!!!!!!!"
It doesn't mean the technology should not be pursued.  And shame on Toyota for going to greatlengths to get those Pious's out there just so they could hump them for good press.  It worked, people slammed the Big Three for not having such wonderful planet savers on their lots too and then they cry when the reality of their hype influenced buying decision hits home.

[Silver R/T]

I don't even feel slightly sorry for him.  That is exactly the kind of thing people have been trying to say since the greens started this whole mad campaign to go electric "RIGHTNOWTHISVERYSECONDWEDONTCAREIFTHETECHNOLOGYEXISTSJUSTDOITDAMMIT!!!!!!!!!"
It doesn't mean the technology should not be pursued.  And shame on Toyota for going to greatlengths to get those Pious's out there just so they could hump them for good press.  It worked, people slammed the Big Three for not having such wonderful planet savers on their lots too and then they cry when the reality of their hype influenced buying decision hits home.

x2 Toyota is back in stone age from having all these problems happen. Americans should go back to buying from big 3 and improve our own economy rather than giving Japan hard earned dollars.

[Mike DC]

     

The battery thing isn't gonna be tied up in a pretty consumer-friendly bow for many years to come.  They have to start somewhere but of course they went too far too fast.  They should have sold that car in limited quantities for a bunch of years before widening the spread of those vehicles.  


I don't hate Toyota for doing this.  They're no better or worse than any other huge corporation.  But I do think that they're being given miles of slack that Detroit would NEVER have been given for a problem half this extensive & dangerous.

   

[resq302]

Thats been my whole thing with these new hybrid cars.  When, and we all know that batteries have a limited life span, these batteries go, how much will they cost and what will they do to the landfills?  Lets face it, the money that you save in fuel you are going to be shelling out for a new battery.  Wonder what the tree huggers will be saying about this when the time comes to start disposing of all the batteries when they crap out all at once.

[stripedelete]

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/contribute/sn/forums?plckForumPage=ForumDiscussion&plckDiscussionId=Cat:f0150c98-e59f-413d-8445-1899e0161a54Forum:0c97677a-65c6-47cc-9037-95bef4028847Discussion:90b35923-5237-4275-9cb3-e9c13aecd381&plckCategoryCurrentPage=0

  "Sadly, I found out yesterday that I'm being penalized for being an early adopter"
 

In early adapters always get burned.  Look at the prices of anything at introduction verses five years later.  They are a personality type and will always be early adapters.  We used to refer to the "leading edge" of technology as the "bloody edge".   

Anyway, I am not a Toyota hater or lover.  I agree that they have been given more slack than the domestics.  I also agree that their crappy churn-and-burn supplier model/strategy may have finally come back to bite them.   I'm even going to get a few kicks in while they're down.  But, I wonder if this embarrassing meltown will drive them to run away with industry for the next twenty years.

[Brock Samson]

just wait,..  till JBB666 is gonna be the first to buy his volt... 

[Ghoste]

Thats been my whole thing with these new hybrid cars.  When, and we all know that batteries have a limited life span, these batteries go, how much will they cost and what will they do to the landfills?  Lets face it, the money that you save in fuel you are going to be shelling out for a new battery.  Wonder what the tree huggers will be saying about this when the time comes to start disposing of all the batteries when they crap out all at once.

ABSOLUTELY!!