Dash Lights suddenly inoperative

[rp23g7]

Hey Everyone, i am new here.

I dont have a Charger, but wishing will make it so, hopefully.  I actually have a 69 Superbee.  Non Rallye dash

Got a issue with my lights, just covering my bases.

Driving to work yesterday morning, my dash light were not working, they had been previously, the dome light/rheostat thingy too.

I thought it may be due to something in the fender turn signal wire i was messing with the day before, so i unplugged it, no change. .


No dash lights, including radio, clock, Temp, speedo, etc
Some other info....

The fender signal wire goes into the parking lights circuit, and they are working.

Tail lights, front parking lights, headlights, licence light and brake lights are working.

Dome light, map light and turn signals in the dash as well as external lights are working. The buzzer thingy works also. Flashers work.

Horn works, wipers and washer squirter works, radio, no antenna, but you roll the switch and you can hear it make its little turn on noise and its radio static noise.

I looked at the fuse yesterday afternoon, pulled it out, it was good, put another in same issue, no dash lights.

Looking at the wiring diagram, i notice a orange wire from the opposite fuse going to the turn signal switch and also up to the No 1 Pin on the cluster, would this be bad??

There is also a pink wire going to the trunk light, which runs to another fuse which is not working, i suddenly remembered, i may go unplug this and see what happens at lunch.

My door switch, i was playing with last night, the right one worked, the left one didnt, i suspected a ground issue.

It apparently uses the body as ground, they guy who had the car did a awsome prep and paint job on the car, too good, as there is a bunch of paint in the threads.
I cleaned them, screwed the switch in, it worked for two door openings, then the light didnt work, unscrewed it a little it worked twice then didnt.

Wondering if this could be the issue. What does everyone think.
     

[FLG]

Try playing with the knob for the lights. They get a little testy sometimes, especially after 40 years.

[Nacho-RT74]

are you able to get it down the dash to check for voltage ? I can guide you where to check

[rp23g7]

are you able to get it down the dash to check for voltage ? I can guide you where to check

Yeah i messed with the knob a bit, no effect really.

Yeah, i can get under the dash, pretty accessible, Non AC car.  Thanks for the quick reply

[TylerCharger69]

All of those orange wires come together in a junction....maybe one came loose?

[rp23g7]

All of those orange wires come together in a junction....maybe one came loose?

Could be, i will have to check better under the dash, it does go to the Tach, ashtray and clock lights

[Nacho-RT74]

the wire coming from dimmer switch is not orange, the orange one comes from fuse so junction is right AFTER the fuse.

when looking below the dash you'll see three wires arriving to dimmer wheel

Black wire spliced with a yellow traced wire in to the dimmer wheel plug. That wire comes from lights switch sourcing front parking lights, buzzer if equipped and of course is the input to dimmer rheostat.

Tan wire, middle cavity, is the OUTPUT from rheostat ( variable resistance ) to feed cluster. That wires runs to fuse box and becomes orange when passing through fuse.

yellow wires, are the ground to dome light. they are spliced with the door switches, but on this case takes the ground by the cluster ground itself like you were opening the door.

Clearly you are getting input to dimmer wheel since you are geting lights on buzzer, being same source, so mostly sure the problem is on dimmer output or fuse. Set dimmer wheel at max output just right before the dome light and check for voltage at tan wire. If not power, problem is dimmer wheel. It could be simply rusted/sulfated/dirty and that could be cleaned up at home.

[rp23g7]

the wire coming from dimmer switch is not orange, the orange one comes from fuse so junction is right AFTER the fuse.

when looking below the dash you'll see three wires arriving to dimmer wheel

Black wire spliced with a yellow traced wire in to the dimmer wheel plug. That wire comes from lights switch sourcing front parking lights, buzzer if equipped and of course is the input to dimmer rheostat.

Tan wire, middle cavity, is the OUTPUT from rheostat ( variable resistance ) to feed cluster. That wires runs to fuse box and becomes orange when passing through fuse.

yellow wires, are the ground to dome light. they are spliced with the door switches, but on this case takes the ground by the cluster ground itself like you were opening the door.

Clearly you are getting input to dimmer wheel since you are geting lights on buzzer, being same source, so mostly sure the problem is on dimmer output or fuse. Set dimmer wheel at max output just right before the dome light and check for voltage at tan wire. If not power, problem is dimmer wheel. It could be simply rusted/sulfated/dirty and that could be cleaned up at home.

Wow, great info, quick too, you guys rock, gotta go find a Charger now.   It sounds like it is probably that left hand door switch, since it seems it has a bad ground.  I will have to clean it better, and check the connections on the dimmer wheel tonight.  I will let you guys know.

[rp23g7]

I think i found the issue. Its gotta be the door switch.  The dome and map light were not working with the drivers door, neither was the buzzer. 

I goofed around with it at lunch and got them to work with the drivers door. 

Cant tell if the dash lights were working, didnt have anything to cover the dash with.  I will take it off and clean it after work, and check the dimmer connections.

They guy that was restoring the car did a fantastic body prep and paint on this car, he got laid off from Boeing and couldnt afford it any longer i was told. 

It needs a Charger as a garage mate though, still looking for one.

[Nacho-RT74]

the door ground has nothing to do with cluster lights beside the only fact both systems need to be good grounded, so you could get a general fail ground. But for a while dome light is constant positive from batt and switched ground, the dash lights are constant ground ( directly by chassis at sockets ) and switched/dimmered positive

soe even you could fix one problem, doesn't mean you fixed the other one UNLESS is a generic ground issue

( we get mostly quick responses because we don't have life and use the board like chatting LOL )

[rp23g7]

the door ground has nothing to do with cluster lights beside the only fact both systems need to be good grounded, so you could get a general fail ground. But for a while dome light is constant positive from batt and switched ground, the dash lights are constant ground ( directly by chassis at sockets ) and switched/dimmered positive

soe even you could fix one problem, doesn't mean you fixed the other one UNLESS is a generic ground issue

( we get mostly quick responses because we don't have life and use the board like chatting LOL )

Or bored at work like me??

Cool, good info, i will check the fuse and the connections at the back of the dimmer when i get home and can contort myself in weird positions.

[Nacho-RT74]

Or bored at work like me??

myself, at home... maybe 70% of whore posters are bored at work everyday like you are right now LOL

[rp23g7]

Or bored at work like me??

myself, at home... maybe 70% of whore posters are bored at work everyday like you are right now LOL

Lol, so true.

So, your in Venezuela?  Nice looking Charger.  Are muscle/classic cars common down there?  How much is gas?  We go on a cruise every year or so.  Went down to Trinidad, and looked around.  There was a SWEET 68 Charger sitting in front of a house there, i think this was 2005

[Nacho-RT74]

yea, more less common and still drivers. Maybe still the 70% of pony/muscles still existant around are drivers and the rest are race and show. Think if you fill the gas tank with US$3, you can drive it daily ... but then 90% of those drivers muscle are far away from show conditions. ( FAAAAAAR AWAY )

and also maybe 25% of cars riding around are still old 70s/80s cars. My own car is a driver ( but in good conditions )

There is a new member around on board from Trinidad who got a 68 locally. Maybe is that one, but this one is in actually poor conditions ( maybe the same car but now in disgrace? )

[rp23g7]

well, i think  i may need a new rheostat, i got my door switch working, but i think the roller is broken, i can twist it and it wont turn the dome light on, i can reach behind and turn it the rest of the way and it will switch it on.

Funny thing is, there was a 20 amp fuse blown, but everything worked, unless the 20 amp controls the light rheostat by itself

[Nacho-RT74]

as stated cluster lighting gets a fuse AFTER the rheostat. That fuse is linked to an orange wire... check on back of fuse box ( if you can ), since dunno what the location for it on those. If you were getting parking lights and buzzer, the input source to the rheostat is good since is spliced juts right on same plug.

there are resto services for them and also new rebuilt units being sold. take care beacuse as far I know rally and standart clusters are diff units ( not sure though )

MAYBE you can clean it at home and make it work back. so you could try firts.

of course we are taking as a fact than the fault IS the dimmer

[rp23g7]

so we know we have power going in since the parking lights work?  It leaves the switch through the tan wire and goes to the fuse box? 

There was a 20 amp fuse blown, but dont know what it was, as everything was working, buzzer, all lights, except dash, tail, brakes, signals, heater, wipers, washer etc. 

I replaced the fuse and noticed no change in anything. 

So, i should test the voltage before the fuse on the tan wire, and after the fuse on the orange wire?  I think the orange wire also goes to a spilce and runs to the turn signal switch and ends at Pin 1 on the connector, so the issue must be on that orange line after the splice, if i have voltage out of the fuse.

[rp23g7]

HMMM, i found a post from you from a while ago Nacho.....

"check that you have the right bulb... 1004.

check also on kick panel area for the pink and yellow wires plug... it could be some loosen.

Jam switch is also related with seatbelt warning light and key courtesy light drived with a time delay flasher...

Map lights also turns on with door Jam switch.

Key in buzzer is related with door switch, but ONLY DRIVER SIDE, and is a separated black wire than the yellow one that is feeded by both doors. You will notice that those switches have two prongs. On driver side attachs a black and yellow wires, and on passenger side only the yellow one.

Yellow is the one that drives all, except key in buzzer what as told is the black one."

When messing with my door jamb switch yesterday, i took it out and saw that there were two connectors, only the yellow was hooked up, the buzzer was working but kind of randomly.  when i was taking it out it was working probably because it was grounding on the side of the door jamb.  I need to look for that black wire and reconnect it.

Wonder if this is the fuse that was blown.  Does that also control the lights in the panel somehow?

[Nacho-RT74]

so we know we have power going in since the parking lights work?  It leaves the switch through the tan wire and goes to the fuse box?  

yes parking lights function is what feeds dimmer so if we have parking we have input to dimmer. Yes to the rest.

There was a 20 amp fuse blown, but dont know what it was, as everything was working, buzzer, all lights, except dash, tail, brakes, signals, heater, wipers, washer etc.  

I replaced the fuse and noticed no change in anything.  

dunno. Remember I'm not really into 2nd gens, so dunno every fuse function on these.

So, i should test the voltage before the fuse on the tan wire, and after the fuse on the orange wire?  I think the orange wire also goes to a spilce and runs to the turn signal switch and ends at Pin 1 on the connector, so the issue must be on that orange line after the splice, if i have voltage out of the fuse.

the orange wire running into steering column is too feed the shifter dial in case of column shifters. Does not goes to turning switch really, just use probably that plug to not get it hanging around. On cars with floor shifter, orange wire can go to steering plug what doesn't mean should get INTO the column after the plug with another wire from plug to inside. Just will stop there. As far I know Column and Floor shifeter underdash harnesses are not diff, just have diff stuff plugged here and there to match the body setup and equippment. Is on that way on 3rd gens, I think also on earliers.

you can test for voltage on tan wire up to fuse box, yes. If you doesn't get power there, the problem is at dimmer wheel ( rheostat ) or tan wire itself. So for a direct dimmer test, check on back of dimmer.

if you get power at fuse, the problem is fuse or at orange line... splice or whatever comes into it.

[Nacho-RT74]

HMMM, i found a post from you from a while ago Nacho.....

"check that you have the right bulb... 1004.

check also on kick panel area for the pink and yellow wires plug... it could be some loosen.

Jam switch is also related with seatbelt warning light and key courtesy light drived with a time delay flasher...

Map lights also turns on with door Jam switch.

Key in buzzer is related with door switch, but ONLY DRIVER SIDE, and is a separated black wire than the yellow one that is feeded by both doors. You will notice that those switches have two prongs. On driver side attachs a black and yellow wires, and on passenger side only the yellow one.

Yellow is the one that drives all, except key in buzzer what as told is the black one."

When messing with my door jamb switch yesterday, i took it out and saw that there were two connectors, only the yellow was hooked up, the buzzer was working but kind of randomly.  when i was taking it out it was working probably because it was grounding on the side of the door jamb.  I need to look for that black wire and reconnect it.

Wonder if this is the fuse that was blown.  Does that also control the lights in the panel somehow?

thats mostly to 3rd gens ( I bet you found it on a reply to some 3rd gen Charger owner ). Buzzer on 2nd gens as far I could notice on diagrams is driven by both doors and same yellow wire, instead an added black wire just for the warning signals at drivers door. Would need to check your diagram to be sure about

Dome light bulb is for evey Mopar around. Plug on 2nd gens for dome light I think is really on C pillar or rear wheel well area, not in kick panel. Colors are the same though.

dunno about second conector useage on door jam switches for 60s cars. I know for sure on 3rd gens and thats is as I told just on driver side ( 71s got even three pins plugs, relativelly hard to find ). However that,  on passenger side 3rd gen chargers ( and its counterpart on Coronets ) got also a double prong conector but only using one

[rp23g7]

HMMM, i found a post from you from a while ago Nacho.....

"check that you have the right bulb... 1004.

check also on kick panel area for the pink and yellow wires plug... it could be some loosen.

Jam switch is also related with seatbelt warning light and key courtesy light drived with a time delay flasher...

Map lights also turns on with door Jam switch.

Key in buzzer is related with door switch, but ONLY DRIVER SIDE, and is a separated black wire than the yellow one that is feeded by both doors. You will notice that those switches have two prongs. On driver side attachs a black and yellow wires, and on passenger side only the yellow one.

Yellow is the one that drives all, except key in buzzer what as told is the black one."

When messing with my door jamb switch yesterday, i took it out and saw that there were two connectors, only the yellow was hooked up, the buzzer was working but kind of randomly.  when i was taking it out it was working probably because it was grounding on the side of the door jamb.  I need to look for that black wire and reconnect it.

Wonder if this is the fuse that was blown.  Does that also control the lights in the panel somehow?

thats mostly to 3rd gens ( I bet you found it on a reply to some 3rd gen Charger owner ). Buzzer on 2nd gens as far I could notice on diagrams is driven by both doors and same yellow wire, instead an added black wire just for the warning signals at drivers door. Would need to check your diagram to be sure about

Dome light bulb is for evey Mopar around. Plug on 2nd gens for dome light I think is really on C pillar or rear wheel well area, not in kick panel. Colors are the same though.

dunno about second conector useage on door jam switches for 60s cars. I know for sure on 3rd gens and thats is as I told just on driver side ( 71s got even three pins plugs, relativelly hard to find ). However that,  on passenger side 3rd gen chargers ( and its counterpart on Coronets ) got also a double prong conector but only using one

Speaking of that wire you stated that went to the column.  Mine had a column shift, and was changed to a console,   gotta see where that wire is if there is one.  My wiring diagram for a 69 shows two wires on the door switch, so i will dig around in there to see if there is one.

I will check the Tan and orange wire for voltage, before and after the fuse tonight.  Your a awsome wealth of info Nacho.  If your interested, here is a link to some of my car pictures  http://s572.photobucket.com/albums/ss161/rp23g7/1969%20Coronet/

[rp23g7]

The guy that was restoring it did a great body job, and started the interior.  I took the sill plate and kick panel off, expecting to see a half a** job.  Not true.  I looks like he took everything out blasted and primered and painted.

Its painted all the way over the sill plates, and probably under some of the carpet.  Its glued down, so cant tell.  Take off the kick panel and its got fresh insulation and primered metal.  And that wiring and stuff under the dash isnt 40 yrs old either.  The guy lost his job at Boeing and couldnt afford it anymore.  I will try that testing tonight and let youo know what happens.

[rp23g7]

didnt have much time to play around today.  i tested both sides of the fuse, both sides dim with the wheel.  On the backside there is power from both the tan wire and the orange wire.

[Nacho-RT74]

looking nice!!! I'm not big fan of 68/69s Coronets/Plymouths... 70 Coronet is an exception and one of my dreams car, but a well done car is allways something to drool.

if you are getting power at orange wire at fuse I only can think now on a missed chassis ground at dash/cluster... but MISSING ALSO AT CONSOLE ? THATS WEIRD. Console light has its own chassis ground.

maybe TylerCharger69 could be on the right track, the junction at orange line

Just checked the diagrams again about the dual yellow wires at door jam switches. Yes one drives the buzzer, and is linked to both sides. The other one drives cortesy light, map light, dome light and everything door related.

Is simply than 3rd gens are slightly diff on that. Feeding the same but different route and splices. 3rd gens light on buzzer and ign key buzzer are just linked to driver side by a black wire.

Anyway... did you tell are getting problems with dome light with dimmer wheel ? thats will make something to check it there too

[rp23g7]

Thanks Nacho, the 70 Coronet is a favorite body style of mine too.  I need to find the other wire on the drivers door switch, the buzzer doesnt work on the drivers side, and i saw the second terminal on the switch the other day.

The car doesnt have a console, they just moved the shifter to the floor.  I think the black pig tail under the dash may be for a light in the column if there was one.

I will try to take the connector off the panel tomorrow and check the power there. The dimmer wheel seems like it doesnt turn far enough itself. You can reach under the dash and turn the rheostat and make the dome light  turn on.