Broken 383 to rebuilt 440 weaker?

[METROID]

The first seven seem like a good list to make sure I check off by the end of the summer by then I will have more cash to do things right.

Just wondering is there any advantage in picking up a mid 60's motor and building it from the ground up instead of messing with the one I have now?

[squeakfinder]

 Is it possible for you to park the car, and tear down the 440?. Get the block hot tanked and the cylinder's and crank miked to see where your at. Mid 70's heads are OK, it's the pistons that mopar used to castrate the compression in those days. If the cylinder walls need to be bored out you'll need new pistons anyway. You could go with 9.5 to 1 or higher and solve the the low compression problem.
  And as mentioned, the mid 70's motor has the hardened exhaust seats on the heads. I don't see an advantage to the older 60's engine unless your looking for authentic/period correct parts.

[Ghoste]

A mid sixties one will cost about the same to rebuild by the time your done.  You are fine to work on the one you have.

[skip68]

If you have low compression right now, nows the time to put a blower on it.   

[Purple440]

... I am looking for a band aid fix at the moment because I have the motor pulled but by December 31rst its going back and the Charger is coming up to college with me.

Based on my experience driving my pre-restored Charger in college, tune it as best you can so it doesn't stall out on your dates, which is way more embarrassing than losing a race.    Maybe you should build a 440 on the side, and sell this one when the new one is ready, whenever that is.   

[Ghoste]

Unless it stalls out on cue.

[greenpigs]

If its a sure grip 300 is ok but offer 250. Then a proform main body for the 750 vacum secondary @ 125. Then the cam Ron recomended the vodoo 302 @ 129 plus lifters @  80? Mill heads .030 and get shims for rocker arm shaft. Then MP steel head gaskets which you might have on it. Then gaskets to do all this. That might be over budget but not much.   

[Purple440]

Unless it stalls out on cue.

Bench seats 

[1Bad70Charger]

Unless it stalls out on cue.

Bench seats 

     

[METROID]

  My girl has put up with it for almost 4 years (she is terrified of it) unless the car blows up I think dates will be OK.




Heck the car still scares me even with the current 74 440.

[Ghoste]

It sounds like you'll be okay then.

[METROID]

Found it list number is 80457-2, it is 600 CFM 4 barrel  Holley Carb. The thing is really black from when the 383 used to backfire through it.

[Ghoste]

Given the rest of the current combo and what I preceive to be your main use of the car, I think right now you might be a lot happier getting that thing rebuilt (or at least check the power valve if it's been on a backfiring car) and running it.  Yes, it's small for a 440 but you don't have a powerhouse 440 in the car to take adantage of higher airflow and the smaller carb is going to give you a much snappier throttle response.

[greenpigs]

Ok I know you asked about a looser converter and here is what I think might work for you.http://chucker54.stores.yahoo.net/11converter727.html Not sure if it will just bolt up so to save some coin I think you need to look at a quality company and what will work with what you have.

[METROID]

Bad news and good news. The bad news is the charger is still in pieces and the shop just decided to close new years eve  , so I won't see the Charger until March. The good news is I am going to take everybodies advice and do this thing right. The car will also be stored indoors free of Charge as long as I need so it is safer than sitting on the street at home.

For now I have decided to start with the converter and rearend pumpkin and after the new year I will start ordering parts for the engine going from the ground up.

greenpigs, that looks to be close to the range I was thinking about for a converter  . I think I'm going to go ahead and order it for the Charger. In the mean time while I'm down here I'm going to keep looking for a pumpkin I think I will start with my buddy who offered me his Sure Grip if it is at least 355 I will toss it on.

[Purple440]

Don't forget about A&A Transmitions:
http://www.aandatrans.com/Departments/Chrysler-727-Trans/Torque-Converters.aspx

I love mine.  http://www.aandatrans.com/Products/727-Competition-11-Torque-Converter-26002800__22767.aspx You don't know it's there until you punch it.

- Doug

[Ghoste]

Yep, Rick Allison is another great guy to deal with. 

[METROID]

  A&A looks good too. lower 2600 -2800 looks better to me I think I will wait until next week before I make my final decision.

So I locally found pumpkins with 4.10, 3.91 and 3.55 gear ratios (Checked current one today in my Charger and suprise it is a 3.23 non Posi). I am wondering now that I will be redoing the 440 which one is the better way to go. I mainly do city driving but I don't want the thing to strain on the highway. I was thinking about either going with the 3.55 or 3.91 but was wondering if you guys could give me an opinion on it  . 80 miles an hour is the norm in California even if the speed limit is 55 or 70 and I don't mind being in the right lanes either .

[Purple440]

METROID take your time.  It sounds like you will be building your engine/setup over time, so try to glean as much info from this site as possible before you start spending your hard earned cash.  The wrong combo will cost you twice as much to fix later on.

My 3:55's have me around 3400RPM at 70MPH, standard tires.  If you're going to drive this thing around town and just enjoy it, 3:55 should be enough.  Keep the converter stall lower than your cruising speed so you don't heat up your tranny as much (what I'm told).  My A&A will go to 3000RPM when I really hit it...you should call them and talk to them, they will advise you on what you need.

- Doug

[greenpigs]

   I don't know if swapping from a 3.23 to a 3.55 would even be worth it? Well I am just going to watch this post and let some of the others guide you. Try this from Moparts to help with cruising RPM.http://vexer.com/68rt/speed.html

My car with an 27.1 dia tire a 4.10 gear is at 4068 rpm at 80 mph and that is with 100% efficiency on the converter. The link is something to mess with and hopefully will help a little. FWIW I would go with the 3.91 and something that stalls within the above mentioned guidelines. I think budget may dictate what you end up with to a point.

[squeakfinder]

   My 68 has a 440/727 (2000 stall?) 3.91 suregrip, 295-50-15 tires. Drove from Oregon to Kent,Washington for the Charger gathering last August up I-5. I have never spent so much time in the right hand lane! If I didn't enjoy driving the car like I do it would have been an exhausting trip. You might be OK with the 3.23's in my opinion.

[Cooter]

Unless you got the coin for an overdrive and by your previous statements you don't, you better reconsider on having your cake and eating it too...

You are old skool either runs like hell on the short jaunts, or can cruise all day long in the LEFT lane but won't pull a greasy string out of a cats ass on take off..1-2-3 is all you get with deep gears and drag gears are WAY more fun and a cheap way to boost performance, but with todays driver's and everybody driving like idiots at 90 PLUS MPH, you WILL be in that right lane and still pissin' people off with a TorqueFlite and 3.91's...

[elacruze]

Consider your ultimate miles driven goal. Remember that a jillion motorhomes came with big block dodges, and had 4.10 or 4.56 gears, and ran tens of thousands of miles turning 3500-4500 rpm successfully. If your engine's built well, and maintained well, RPM alone won't kill it for more miles than you're likely to drive it.

[green69rt]

I had a 383 (1967/1968) Out of either a Dodge station wagon or power wagon, it came in the car when I bought it. The motor backfired, pinged and knocked and only held full compression in 3 of the 8 cylinders. Even with the motor shot the car would take off and tear up the road.

I eventually came across a rebuilt 440 (1974) and I rebuilt the 727 trans and got a new torque converter as well. I haven't fully broken in the motor but ever since the swap the car lags, chokes, and seems to have less power and acceleration than my Fuel efficient economical Honda Civic or the old 383 when it was broken  .

My mechanic Suggested I put in a Purple cam and pre 67 flat heads so my Charger isn't a joke. I realize I have vague info on my car but I was wondering if you guys had any suggestion to fix or make the car better. I was wondering while I have the motor pulled should I put in new heads, cam, and Torque converter  ? I'm not looking to race but I want the car to move better and not be an embarrassment to the Charger name.

(Budget at the moment is under 1k not including labor and I can pull heads from the old 383 if thats the way to go)

Sorry but I got to this thread a little late.  Is the basic problem solved??
Something sounds fishy here.  This engine sould at least run smoothly. There needs to be some basic trouble shooting done on this engine to get it to perform to its max with the installed equipment.  If you add new parts you may be disappointed because the basic engine isn't performing right.

[METROID]

No nothing has really changed except I am taking it slow and saving up some more cash. I think I want to tear it down bare and start over at the moment I am not making any big decisions. I am going to check out another rear end tomorrow for the car but beyond that I'm going to idle for a while and not make any rash decision.

Happy New Years!